Is it the grind or the sharpener (Wicked Edge)

Here are some more shots of what I have been dealing with on my quartermaster.

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and this knife was also mounted centered in the vise.
 
After doing some more research I am pretty sure now, the main cause of the these uneven edges with my knives are due to the over blades grind from the factory. Some of these sharpening devices, like the wicked edge, edge pro, lansky, spyderco sharpener, will often leave a edge slightly higher then the other. Only because of the overall grind of the knife is off, mostly where the edge begins to sweep up to the point.
 
Maybe this might help. Allison mentions uneven bevels and what to do, a few times.

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Minifcar said:
Here's my Infidel after sharpening on the wicked edge:

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Click to expand...

Minifcar. I happen to discover some things while sharpening my USMC Kabar with serrations. Every blade you put in the vise you need to make sure the stones can get the ENTIRE EDGE IN ONE STROKE. So it is best to place the knife centered in the vise in order to get the whole edge that you planning on sharpening. Some times you might have to put the knife a little ahead of it's center mark. Remember and this is very important. The edge portion of the blade that is going to be sharpened has to be centered in the vise. So if your knife has serrations you cant count those serrations as the edge your planning on sharpening. In order to fix those grinds your going have to do a convex edge on the knife. It's really easy to do on the Wicked Edge. Lets say that knife angle is a 20 degree on both sides of the knife. Get the bur on both sides. Then once you have that down proceed to go down another degree. In this case 19. Do 8 strokes on each side with the 100 grit. Then go down again another degree. 8 strokes again on each side. Make sure they are full strokes. If you do it in sections you will be changing how the stones cuts into the metal. That's why I was getting these wacky angles. So if your originally started to do this edge first off at 20 degree, you want to down a total of 5 degree. Once you finish your last degree in this case 15. You want to go all the way back to 20 degrees on both sides and now use the 200 grit stones. I am sure you see how it goes on from here. So once you finish the last degree (15), you start back over with a new grit till your satisfy with whatever grit you choose to finish. Once you finish you want to strop the knife. This will round the shoulders of all the mini bevels you created. Thus giving you a convex edge.
 
Minifcar,
I also wanted to show you this picture of a great example of how to mount the knife, and also keep and eye on thing that screw up your sharpening.

Notice how my knife is mounted for the EDGE I PLAN ON SHARPENING.

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The serrations and the rest of stock with the USMC stamped on it are NOT PART OF MY EDGE I AM SHARPENING. So what ever surface you are sharpening you need to center that in vice. That should save you time on sharpening and give you not so wide angles. And remember do only single strokes that cover the entire surface you are sharpening. If you sharp the blade in sections you will change how the stones cut into the metal.

Here is the same USMC Kabar with serrations that I convexed (toothy convex) in order to fix the wacky grind angles. The very edge starts at a 22 grind then goes all the way down to 15.

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I'll try that out. I have been centering the blade minus the serrations though. I thought maybe it was my technique. I watched the videos that Singularity35 posted and Clay also says that he sees a difference between the left side versus right side of the blade in regard to the bevel size while he's reprofiling the blade and he spends more time on the left side to even it up. I think it's just in the nature of the WEPS for some reason. I am just really surprised that it's so noticeably different when you have the same degree of angle on each side of the blade. I think I'll try placing the knife in the WEPS at different depths. I've been using the 2 depths with the depth key but I think I'll experiment. If the stone has to travel up the blade because the knife is placed higher in the WEPS, perhaps that removes more blade material unnecessarily. I'll post back here after I test this.
 
Minifcar said:
I'll try that out. I have been centering the blade minus the serrations though. I thought maybe it was my technique. I watched the videos that Singularity35 posted and Clay also says that he sees a difference between the left side versus right side of the blade in regard to the bevel size while he's reprofiling the blade and he spends more time on the left side to even it up. I think it's just in the nature of the WEPS for some reason. I am just really surprised that it's so noticeably different when you have the same degree of angle on each side of the blade. I think I'll try placing the knife in the WEPS at different depths. I've been using the 2 depths with the depth key but I think I'll experiment. If the stone has to travel up the blade because the knife is placed higher in the WEPS, perhaps that removes more blade material unnecessarily. I'll post back here after I test this.
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I think wider blades should use the bottom key. Smaller width blades like pocket folders and fillet knives use the top key.
 
Here's another example. This is my benchmade emissary. The angle was set to 18 degrees and you can see how off the grind is.
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Here is my Strider PT after I reprofiled it from 20 to 18 degrees. It looks much closer to being even. Before it looked like the BM.
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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.080220,-84.489389
 
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I have no custom knife experience. With my production knife experience, i have found it VERY common for the grind to be off centered as shown in post #30, pic#1. My Quartemaster was the same, as were most of my Spec-Plus series. A $30 belt grinder goes a LONG way to even them out quickly, so you don't wear out your primary sharpening system.
 
TwinStick said:
I have no custom knife experience. With my production knife experience, i have found it VERY common for the grind to be off centered as shown in post #30, pic#1. My Quartemaster was the same, as were most of my Spec-Plus series. A $30 belt grinder goes a LONG way to even them out quickly, so you don't wear out your primary sharpening system.
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Thanks twinstick. Glad to hear this from another person. I remember reading from somewhere that there was a reason why they canceled the spec-plus series. After examining some of my blades, I noticed the grind on the knives may look even, but they never are. One side always has a little bit more metal then the other.
 
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I haven't gotten to try a factory edge on it since I've done this. I have a digital angle finder on order and I'm kind of waiting for that. I frankly don't want to risk another knife. The only one that looks ok is the BM Emissary. The Strider, Infidel, and Spartan all look bad and have too much blade material removed from one side. I'm afraid I just ruined a couple expensive blades! :(

Do you guys think this is a manufacturing issue with the WEPS itself?[/QUOTE]

First of all let me assure you that you haven't ruined your expensive blades anymore than you would have if you were sharpening free hand for example...free hand sharpeners, even the best, have great difficulty getting edges perfectly even, still their knives go on cutting and being useful for many years. Similarly with the WEPS, although I suggest to you that the uneven edges may be the fault of unevenness directly from the factory but also through human error as you sharpen...varieties of pressure, unevenness of strokes, but particularly not getting the initial bevel correct the first time you use the WEPS. That first raising of the burr and bringing the scratches right up to the edge is absolutely crucial. That is why even Clay, who has experience beyond anyone with this rig, uses a Sharpie marker to highlight the edge so he can tell when he has the burr raised correctly on both sides of the new bevel before he proceeds with building the edge.
Many people think that using the WEPS requires no great skill...just clamp her in and begin stroking away with the paddles. Not so. You will find as you work on your knives that in time you will become more even in your strokes, more accurate getting up the first burrs and more sensitive to what the paddles are doing and when to switch to the next set.
The adjusting of the degree marked rod was a good move. Slight errors like that can add up when you are seeking perfection. Also, flipping the arms so that you don't use the dimples anymore is a trick many of the more advanced sharpeners are trying. It can save you a bit of a degree but you have to be sure to keep checking those screws are holding tightly...once again I can't emphasize how great it is to have an angle cube to verify angles for you as a double-check.
Like you, I was afraid to use my excellent knives, some of which are in excess of 500 dollars in value, on this new rig, but even with gross errors I made the first few tries because I failed to raise the burr correctly, I have not ruined a thing. My prized possessions are as sharp as scalpels and my working knives do their chore like a charm. My wife has quit nagging me about dull knives and she has even shown interest in using the sharpener...this is amazing because you should have seen her reaction when I first bought the WEPS, "You did what?!!! And it cost how much?!!!!" The doghouse and the couch were quite unpleasant for awhile there. LOL! She has done a 180 degree turn and even has her friends bringing their knives over for me to do. What a change!
As to manufacturing errors in the WEPS, that is unlikely since Clay catches those and sends them back. This happened just recently. It is possible that an angle bar may be out of adjustment a bit but as you note it was easily fixed. Even Rolls Royce cars have issues from time to time and Rolls will not admit to that, unlike Clay who is scrupulously honest I have found. An unusual quality nowadays!
BTW, no! No I do not work for the Wicked Edge nor is Clay a relative...I just love my WEPS and don't hesitate to tell anyone who cares to listen or read!
Very best to all
Leo
 
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