Is that possible

[Thenoob]

Hello guys i recently used my new sharpened knives and it seems they don’t cut well.
They cut phonebook paper even push cuts and shave like a razor but when i run it thru my arm slicing motion like I want to cut myself with light pressure and It didn’t cut me, how it this possible? I sharpen on lansky to 1000 grit without strop? What do i do wrong guys and how is this even possible?? Later i will try to upload videos if its possible on here.

 

[Thenoob]

Btw when i run the blade thru my fingertips its bot catching its super smooth dull smooth feels like

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Sounds like the edge is polished, but slightly rolled due to a very fine, ductile burr. The burr itself is sharp & fine enough to cut paper and shave hair, but it 'moves' or rolls side-to-side in some other cutting against skin or something firmer. As it moves or rolls, the cutting behavior will vary widely, from tree-topping hair to just simply sliding over whatever's in contact, without cutting.

The polished & burred character of the edge is also something that happens with fine/uf ceramics, like the Lansky's finishing stones. I saw the same behaviors with my Lansky, finishing edges to a similar degree. The Fine & UF ceramic hones can create an extremely fine, thin, feathery edge, especially on simpler, low-alloy stainless steels at relatively low hardness, like kitchen stainless and others of the 420/440 variety. And it's even more so, as the hone itself becomes somewhat loaded or clogged with swarf. That fine, feathery edge is too weak to do much 'real' cutting, but will still do some of the tricks, like tree-topping or whittling hair.

A strop with some aluminum oxide polishing paste, like Flitz or Simichrome, works very well to clean up edges on low-alloy stainless, in situations like you describe. Denim or linen, used as the strop substrate, works REAL well with these polishing pastes in particular.

 

[Blues]

The Fine & UF ceramic hones can create an extremely fine, thin, feathery edge, especially on simpler, low-alloy stainless steels at relatively low hardness, like kitchen stainless and others of the 420/440 variety. And it's even more so, as the hone itself becomes somewhat loaded or clogged with swarf. That fine, feathery edge is too weak to do much 'real' cutting, but will still do some of the tricks, like tree-topping or whittling hair.

So true. I recently experienced this with one of my wife's 5" Boker kitchen utility knives, which is 440A. It seemed to be screaming sharp but the edge didn't last until I took it back to the workbench and made sure that every bit of that "feathery edge" (that I could detect) was removed. Made all the difference in both cutting and durability. Doesn't fix the crap steel but she prefers not to use my "good" knives.

 

[Thenoob]

Sounds like the edge is polished, but slightly rolled due to a very fine, ductile burr. The burr itself is sharp & fine enough to cut paper and shave hair, but it 'moves' or rolls side-to-side in some other cutting against skin or something firmer. As it moves or rolls, the cutting behavior will vary widely, from tree-topping hair to just simply sliding over whatever's in contact, without cutting.

The polished & burred character of the edge is also something that happens with fine/uf ceramics, like the Lansky's finishing stones. I saw the same behaviors with my Lansky, finishing edges to a similar degree. The Fine & UF ceramic hones can create an extremely fine, thin, feathery edge, especially on simpler, low-alloy stainless steels at relatively low hardness, like kitchen stainless and others of the 420/440 variety. And it's even more so, as the hone itself becomes somewhat loaded or clogged with swarf. That fine, feathery edge is too weak to do much 'real' cutting, but will still do some of the tricks, like tree-topping or whittling hair.

A strop with some aluminum oxide polishing paste, like Flitz or Simichrome, works very well to clean up edges on low-alloy stainless, in situations like you describe. Denim or linen, used as the strop substrate, works REAL well with these polishing pastes in particular.

Thank you for the detailed answer man! I will buy a lansky strop (a am very bad at keeping free hand angle) and i will try to find a compound but in my country i am very limited about strop compounds i will probably find some kind of polishing grind wheel compound for metals. Will it work? Also i ha never heard of denim/linen stop is that just a piece of the materials you said on firm surface ?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Thank you for the detailed answer man! I will buy a lansky strop (a am very bad at keeping free hand angle) and i will try to find a compound but in my country i am very limited about strop compounds i will probably find some kind of polishing grind wheel compound for metals. Will it work? Also i ha never heard of denim/linen stop is that just a piece of the materials you said on firm surface ?

For compounds used with grinding & buffing wheels, look for those labelled for use on 'hard metals' or stainless steel in particular. Most of those would be aluminum oxide (usually grey, white or yellow). So-called 'white rouge' compound usually fits that category, and is fine-grained for high polish. It works very well when used on a strop of hard-backed denim, as from an old pair of blue jeans, for example. Linen, such as from some clothing (shirts, etc) or bedding (sheets) also works well, used the same way. Use contact cement or a similar spray adhesive to attach the fabric to a hard backing, like smooth wood.

 

[BadComrade]

the knives plus stop comes preloaded with green compound in case you think it will be hard to find that kind of stuff in your country.

 

[Thenoob]

For compounds used with grinding & buffing wheels, look for those labelled for use on 'hard metals' or stainless steel in particular. Most of those would be aluminum oxide (usually grey, white or yellow). So-called 'white rouge' compound usually fits that category, and is fine-grained for high polish. It works very well when used on a strop of hard-backed denim, as from an old pair of blue jeans, for example. Linen, such as from some clothing (shirts, etc) or bedding (sheets) also works well, used the same way. Use contact cement or a similar spray adhesive to attach the fabric to a hard backing, like smooth wood.

If i have only one strop what compound should i get in microns ?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

If i have only one strop what compound should i get in microns ?

Most of the compounds made for use on buffer wheels usually aren't labelled with a micron-size rating. If any of them are, the ones in a ~ 9 micron or smaller size (in aluminum oxide) are usually pretty good at polishing to mirror or near-mirror. The 'white rouge' I've used is actually marked at a 2 - 5 micron range (Ryobi brand), but most aren't, from what I've seen. If you don't see any micron ratings, other descriptors on the labelling will usually indicate what the compound is for, like polishing (finer), or 'cleaning' (usually a bit coarser at least, to sometimes much coarser, for removing heavy scale, rust, etc). Assuming you're looking mainly for quick burr-removal and polish, I'd be looking for a white/grey compound marked for polishing hard metals and/or stainless steel.

Other buffer compounds might be black (usually silicon carbide) or green (chromium oxide, maybe blended with some aluminum oxide, sometimes). The black compounds are usually coarser, and generally intended for heavy cleaning of very rough-surfaced hard metals. The green can be a good polisher for steels that aren't too wear-resistant, like basic carbon steels (1095, CV, etc) and low-alloy stainless steels (420HC, 440A, etc). But for most simple & mid-range steels up through 154CM, VG-10, etc, I've preferred aluminum oxide in white/grey compounds for quick & easy burr cleanup and some pretty nice polish, and leaving very crisp & sharp edges.

 

[Thenoob]

Most of the compounds made for use on buffer wheels usually aren't labelled with a micron-size rating. If any of them are, the ones in a ~ 9 micron or smaller size (in aluminum oxide) are usually pretty good at polishing to mirror or near-mirror. The 'white rouge' I've used is actually marked at a 2 - 5 micron range (Ryobi brand), but most aren't, from what I've seen. If you don't see any micron ratings, other descriptors on the labelling will usually indicate what the compound is for, like polishing (finer), or 'cleaning' (usually a bit coarser at least, to sometimes much coarser, for removing heavy scale, rust, etc). Assuming you're looking mainly for quick burr-removal and polish, I'd be looking for a white/grey compound marked for polishing hard metals and/or stainless steel.

Other buffer compounds might be black (usually silicon carbide) or green (chromium oxide, maybe blended with some aluminum oxide, sometimes). The black compounds are usually coarser, and generally intended for heavy cleaning of very rough-surfaced hard metals. The green can be a good polisher for steels that aren't too wear-resistant, like basic carbon steels (1095, CV, etc) and low-alloy stainless steels (420HC, 440A, etc). But for most simple & mid-range steels up through 154CM, VG-10, etc, I've preferred aluminum oxide in white/grey compounds for quick & easy burr cleanup and some pretty nice polish, and leaving very crisp & sharp edges.

Thank you!

 

[jll346]

I sharpen everything on my Tsprof ko2. But I always finish a blade on a sharpmaker or crock sticks. Just one or two VERY LIGHT passes.

 

[Thenoob]

Most of the compounds made for use on buffer wheels usually aren't labelled with a micron-size rating. If any of them are, the ones in a ~ 9 micron or smaller size (in aluminum oxide) are usually pretty good at polishing to mirror or near-mirror. The 'white rouge' I've used is actually marked at a 2 - 5 micron range (Ryobi brand), but most aren't, from what I've seen. If you don't see any micron ratings, other descriptors on the labelling will usually indicate what the compound is for, like polishing (finer), or 'cleaning' (usually a bit coarser at least, to sometimes much coarser, for removing heavy scale, rust, etc). Assuming you're looking mainly for quick burr-removal and polish, I'd be looking for a white/grey compound marked for polishing hard metals and/or stainless steel.

Other buffer compounds might be black (usually silicon carbide) or green (chromium oxide, maybe blended with some aluminum oxide, sometimes). The black compounds are usually coarser, and generally intended for heavy cleaning of very rough-surfaced hard metals. The green can be a good polisher for steels that aren't too wear-resistant, like basic carbon steels (1095, CV, etc) and low-alloy stainless steels (420HC, 440A, etc). But for most simple & mid-range steels up through 154CM, VG-10, etc, I've preferred aluminum oxide in white/grey compounds for quick & easy burr cleanup and some pretty nice polish, and leaving very crisp & sharp edges.

I just ordered a razor strop compound the only one that i found it sawys its fro razors and it's fina and ultra fine will it work ? name is
SOLINGEN GERMANY RAZOR STROP PASTE

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

I just ordered a razor strop compound the only one that i found it sawys its fro razors and it's fina and ultra fine will it work ? name is
SOLINGEN GERMANY RAZOR STROP PASTE

Seems like most pastes sold for razor strops are usually red or black. The red paste will be an iron oxide, which really is only useful for finishing off the very fine, razor-thin edges on straight razors in simpler steels. The iron oxide abrasive is barely harder than the steel itself, so it won't be aggressive at all in removing much, if any, steel. This means most of the refining work done on razors must be done on stones, prior to the final stropping, which serves mainly to align the very thin edge and does some very light burnishing/polishing. Red iron oxide won't work very well on more wear-resistant steels, as are often used in modern knives. The black paste may or may not be useful, depending on what it's made from.

I first tried stropping with a 4-sided razor strop block from Germany, which came with black & red pastes. Neither of them worked nearly as aggressively as the other compounds in aluminum oxide I previously mentioned. The black, in particular, seems very different from the other black compounds generally used with powered buffing wheels, which is much more aggressive at removing metal. This is why there's some question in my mind, as to whether the 'black' compound for use on razor strops is at all similar in composition to other black compounds.

 

[Thenoob]

Seems like most pastes sold for razor strops are usually red or black. The red paste will be an iron oxide, which really is only useful for finishing off the very fine, razor-thin edges on straight razors in simpler steels. The iron oxide abrasive is barely harder than the steel itself, so it won't be aggressive at all in removing much, if any, steel. This means most of the refining work done on razors must be done on stones, prior to the final stropping, which serves mainly to align the very thin edge and does some very light burnishing/polishing. Red iron oxide won't work very well on more wear-resistant steels, as are often used in modern knives. The black paste may or may not be useful, depending on what it's made from.

I first tried stropping with a 4-sided razor strop block from Germany, which came with black & red pastes. Neither of them worked nearly as aggressively as the other compounds in aluminum oxide I previously mentioned. The black, in particular, seems very different from the other black compounds generally used with powered buffing wheels, which is much more aggressive at removing metal. This is why there's some question in my mind, as to whether the 'black' compound for use on razor strops is at all similar in composition to other black compounds.

Well i already ordered it so we will see

 

[cbwx34]

Hello guys i recently used my new sharpened knives and it seems they don’t cut well.
They cut phonebook paper even push cuts and shave like a razor but when i run it thru my arm slicing motion like I want to cut myself with light pressure and It didn’t cut me, how it this possible? I sharpen on lansky to 1000 grit without strop? What do i do wrong guys and how is this even possible?? Later i will try to upload videos if its possible on here.

Btw when i run the blade thru my fingertips its bot catching its super smooth dull smooth feels like

I would have gone with the simpler explanation... that you have over polished the edge, and removed the "teeth" that are used to grab and bite for slicing.

Try leaving an edge with a little more coarse finish... and see if it slices better. (If you use the ceramic... try as jll346 said above... just one or two light alternating passes... just enough to clean up the edge a bit).

You can try this while waiting for your strop.

 

[Thenoob]

I would have gone with the simpler explanation... that you have over polished the edge, and removed the "teeth" that are used to grab and bite for slicing.

Try leaving an edge with a little more coarse finish... and see if it slices better. (If you use the ceramic... try as jll346 said above... just one or two light alternating passes... just enough to clean up the edge a bit).

You can try this while waiting for your strop.

Late i already sharpened my knife on 1000grit

 

[cbwx34]

Late i already sharpened my knife on 1000grit

Just step back a grit... it only takes 1-2 alternating strokes to add a bit of "teeth" back into the edge. If you don't like it, you can easily "return" to the 1000g level.

(1000g finish is not set in stone hehe).

 

[Thenoob]

Just step back a grit... it only takes 1-2 alternating strokes to add a bit of "teeth" back into the edge. If you don't like it, you can easily "return" to the 1000g level.

(1000g finish is not set in stone hehe).

Ok i might do it but what is the difference? I need that knife for meat and slaughering/skinnig. I have never used a knife of mine or shapened by me for slaughter. All the knives i used just went thru throats in a swipe i want my knife to be capable to do it.
I am scared to use it because i might torture the animal is its not sharp. IF you know about these things please let me know which is better for the job!

 

[cbwx34]

Ok i might do it but what is the difference? I need that knife for meat and slaughering/skinnig. I have never used a knife of mine or shapened by me for slaughter. All the knives i used just went thru throats in a swipe i want my knife to be capable to do it.
I am scared to use it because i might torture the animal is its not sharp. IF you know about these things please let me know which is better for the job!

The difference is... the "teeth" on an edge is what bites into and makes the cut in a slice. (Think of a saw). Polished edges are good for what you indicated in your first post... pushcutting, shaving, etc.

I don't hunt, but when I sharpened a few hunting knives for others, I quickly learned that the highly polished edge didn't do well for many users. Stopping at a more coarse grit... around 600 or so, (sometimes coarser), did a better job. (You can get a finer finish to slice well... but it takes practice, and I no longer think it's really worth the effort in most cases).

One suggestion is to look at the edges of the knives you know do the job well... maybe under some magnification... and get an idea of how and what level they're finished at.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Ok i might do it but what is the difference? I need that knife for meat and slaughering/skinnig. I have never used a knife of mine or shapened by me for slaughter. All the knives i used just went thru throats in a swipe i want my knife to be capable to do it.
I am scared to use it because i might torture the animal is its not sharp. IF you know about these things please let me know which is better for the job!

Might actually be better off with a coarser finish for that use, anyway. Something like ~ 320 - 600 with some noticeable 'tooth' in the edge will cut flesh/meat more easily, assuming it's fully apexed and burrs cleaned up. It should zip through paper effortlessly, pop hairs from your forearm and bite the skin when testing with fingertips. Such an edge can be wickedly sharp, and it doesn't really depend on a high-polish finish to be so.

In the Lansky kit with the standard hones (not diamond), try finishing with the 'medium' grit hone; then just make sure the burrs are cleaned up after that.