Is this celluloid out gassing?

Sibyrnes said:
I’m pretty sure celluloid has not been used in the U.S.A since the 1950’s. I don’t know about Germany - anybody got any info?
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RoyalHolic said:
Most companies stopped in the 60's but there's plenty that were made all the way up till the 90's.

Queen made some Celluloid knives in the 90's.
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I read here that GEC used celluloid on a run a couple years back.
I don't remember the pattern or year.
I remember that GEC's celluloid outgassed inside a year or so after the release. Those that had the knoves were NOT "happy campers" about that.

Did GEC see the outgassing covers as a warranty issue?
I don't know.
 
afishhunter said:
I read here that GEC used celluloid on a run a couple years back.
I don't remember the pattern or year.
I remember that GEC's celluloid outgassed inside a year or so after the release. Those that had the knoves were NOT "happy campers" about that.

Did GEC see the outgassing covers as a warranty issue?
I don't know.
Click to expand...
That I couldn't tell ya, don't keep up on GEC newswise stopped playing the hard to get game years ago.
 
afishhunter said:
I read here that GEC used celluloid on a run a couple years back.
I don't remember the pattern or year.
I remember that GEC's celluloid outgassed inside a year or so after the release. Those that had the knoves were NOT "happy campers" about that.

Did GEC see the outgassing covers as a warranty issue?
I don't know.
Click to expand...
Ahh interesting, I didn't know that! I can imagine people not being happy about it. I don't know if I would ever buy a celluloid knife without the understanding that it's going to need recovered at some point. At the very least, I'd plan on it. If it happens to work out and it's "good" celluloid, that's just a plus 😝

Will Power said:
Lot of interesting comments here :thumbsup: As for re-handling, I'd opt for smooth polished bone, Camel maybe?

Since the original slabs are quite thin, material like Ram's Horn or Stag might look a bit unhappy on this, bulging out etc. Wood is a bit monotonous for this one...high polish Red Micarta would look well. Only my views of course, tastes must vary :cool:
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Yea, stag was my most questionable cover choice. The main reason I thought it could work was the speaker jacks in stag looked good. But, I do like a nice slim profile for a knife this size and so jigged/smooth bone was likely my first realistic choice. I can see how smooth would pay more of an homage to the original covers! I don't have many smooth bone covers, but I have a 1980 Appaloosa bone Case barlow that is gorgeous. And, I agree! A high polished red micarta would look very nice too and would be the more durable option. I certainly wouldn't mind it!
 
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Here's my "after" celluloid photo. Not great, just shot it with my phone. I had Bill replace the celluloid scales with ones made from some acrylic that he had. Not too bad for a knife that is at least 84 years old!

Yellow Case-.jpg

And, again, here is my "before" shot with the damaged celluloid.

Tested XX -0000709-2.JPG
 
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Well, I wanted to wrap back around with anyone following this thread. Got the knife back recently and couldn't be happier! I don't have too many smooth bone knives. But, I feel the new covers, which are gbone, pay homage to the original covers; a red look with black streaks.

I love the new shield and its placement. The original shield was glued. I didn't realize the new shield would be pinned, but am happy for it! It's not going anywhere 😂 I'm not sure what this shield is called, but its fairly close to a banner shield?

And, I really think the threaded bolsters gives it an elegant touch!


A few pics in various lighting:
EHokWFk.jpeg

Hrtwgj5.jpeg

MkkWpSO.jpeg

uqtPTKc.jpeg

W4DVz9i.jpeg

7GpO6Qp.jpeg



EDIT: Some of the original images for comparison...
yL7jBJp.jpg

Qw14YXN.jpg
 
meako said:
Thats exactly what I thought as soon as I saw the words fightin rooster.
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Unfortunately the same can be said for the Bulldog, fighting bulldogs and some of the German Case and Boker celluloid of that era 1980's 1990's??. One would have thought they would have used acrylic instead of Cel then what with the reputation celluoid has. I think they thought their reformulated cel would be better. It wasn't Boker used some really nice looking Christmas tree cel in the late 1980's - early 1990's and when you see them now they vary from pristine to badly degraded with a lot showing discolored pins, bolsters and a hint of corrosion on the blade tops.
 
Here's what it looks like when the patient is terminal.
Both German made Bulldog knives, same material and color. Same age (2004).

The first thing I noticed was the bolsters and shield would constantly tarnish.
Then the scale material started to craze.

Now it sits separated from my other knives, when I retire, I'll try to rehabilitate it.

bulldog.jpg
 
lithicus said:
Well, I wanted to wrap back around with anyone following this thread. Got the knife back recently and couldn't be happier! I don't have too many smooth bone knives. But, I feel the new covers, which are gbone, pay homage to the original covers; a red look with black streaks.

I love the new shield and its placement. The original shield was glued. I didn't realize the new shield would be pinned, but am happy for it! It's not going anywhere 😂 I'm not sure what this shield is called, but its fairly close to a banner shield?

And, I really think the threaded bolsters gives it an elegant touch!


A few pics in various lighting:
EHokWFk.jpeg

Hrtwgj5.jpeg

MkkWpSO.jpeg

uqtPTKc.jpeg

W4DVz9i.jpeg

7GpO6Qp.jpeg



EDIT: Some of the original images for comparison...
yL7jBJp.jpg

Qw14YXN.jpg
Click to expand...


That's an EXCELLENT job, looks much better than the original. Congrats!!!!

Eric
 
lithicus said:
Well, I wanted to wrap back around with anyone following this thread. Got the knife back recently and couldn't be happier! I don't have too many smooth bone knives. But, I feel the new covers, which are gbone, pay homage to the original covers; a red look with black streaks.

I love the new shield and its placement. The original shield was glued. I didn't realize the new shield would be pinned, but am happy for it! It's not going anywhere 😂 I'm not sure what this shield is called, but its fairly close to a banner shield?

And, I really think the threaded bolsters gives it an elegant touch!


A few pics in various lighting:
EHokWFk.jpeg

Hrtwgj5.jpeg

MkkWpSO.jpeg

uqtPTKc.jpeg

W4DVz9i.jpeg

7GpO6Qp.jpeg



EDIT: Some of the original images for comparison...
yL7jBJp.jpg

Qw14YXN.jpg
Click to expand...


Glenn did a fantastic job as usual 👍
 
Early signs of gassing is usually noticed first on the shield and bolsters. There have been celluloid scales on Fight'n Roosters
I've never had a problem with. The one called "End of Day" is one that comes to mind. There aren't many. FR's are notorious for blade rust regardless
of the scale material. Some folks use semichrome polishing compound on the celluloid to create lacerations on the surface that seems
to delay damage by letting it breath. Celluloid scaled knives should never be stored enclosed in a box or glass case or anthing similar. They should
be kept oiled and in the open. Something like a closet shelf. Even then it's just a delay, not a cure.
The best way I have found to preserve a celluloid scaled knife is to carry and use it from the time it's new. Those days have passed by.
It's a shame too. FR has some of the coolest and pratical configurations for a pocket knife.
Let's not confuse the pitfalls of the celluloid from the past with the material being used recently. Two different animals.
Greg
 
Many if not most of the German made celluloid knives I've owned have gassed out, 1970s through 1990s knives. I have a dozen or so American made butter & molasses cell knives that are much older, back to the WWI period, and none of them exhibit any gassing. The Germans must have used a more volatile compound.

0K59o8o.jpeg
 
black mamba said:
Many if not most of the German made celluloid knives I've owned have gassed out, 1970s through 1990s knives. I have a dozen or so American made butter & molasses cell knives that are much older, back to the WWI period, and none of them exhibit any gassing. The Germans must have used a more volatile compound.

0K59o8o.jpeg
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I don't know much, but would tend to agree. I don't own many celluloid knives. But, this one was passed down to me. No off gassing. US made. I believe it dates between 1916 and 1939.

hartford.jpg
 
Originaly, celluloid was made in large heated vats and stirred by workmen with paddles. The stuff was highly volatile and there were some large buildings
blown apart and many workers killed when it decided to explode. To counter this they started putting the roofs on in sections that were split in the center.
The lower part of the roof, bearing on the outside walls, were connected to large hinges. It was just a matter or time when the explosion would
occur. With the split and hinged roof the explosion would travel upward and open the roof up thus saving the building and lives of the workers.
These were some very large single story buildings.
Greg
 
I agree with you guys about the older, 1930's-40's celluloid. I have seen quite a few knives that stood
the test of time and are still in great shape.
Greg
 
lithicus said:
Well, I wanted to wrap back around with anyone following this thread. Got the knife back recently and couldn't be happier! I don't have too many smooth bone knives. But, I feel the new covers, which are gbone, pay homage to the original covers; a red look with black streaks.

I love the new shield and its placement. The original shield was glued. I didn't realize the new shield would be pinned, but am happy for it! It's not going anywhere 😂 I'm not sure what this shield is called, but its fairly close to a banner shield?

And, I really think the threaded bolsters gives it an elegant touch!


A few pics in various lighting:
EHokWFk.jpeg

Hrtwgj5.jpeg

MkkWpSO.jpeg

uqtPTKc.jpeg

W4DVz9i.jpeg

7GpO6Qp.jpeg



EDIT: Some of the original images for comparison...
yL7jBJp.jpg

Qw14YXN.jpg
Click to expand...
An excellent job and the Giraffebone really suits the frame. Gimp shield and Rat-Tails add to it, you are clearly pleased with the result, rightly so :cool:
 
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