Is this normal? (leather sheath question)

C

CDH

Joined
Jun 8, 2007
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In building my first sheath I am using a piece of 'premium 8/9 oz shoulder' from TKS that I bought about a year ago. The 3 thicknesses at the welt make the sheath a full 1/2" thick! That comes out looking ridiculous on a 3" bladed knife!

Did I get some bad stuff? It had a few scars and a definite thin section (maybe 10% of total area).
 
CDH said:
In building my first sheath I am using a piece of 'premium 8/9 oz shoulder' from TKS that I bought about a year ago. The 3 thicknesses at the welt make the sheath a full 1/2" thick! That comes out looking ridiculous on a 3" bladed knife!

Did I get some bad stuff? It had a few scars and a definite thin section (maybe 10% of total area).
Click to expand...

It's somewhat common for leather to have thinner and thicker spots. Just choose your section carefully for what you're doing.

For a knife of that size I tend to use 5-6 oz for the main body, but will find the section of the leather that is thickest for the welt.

One caution is in using leather from different hides. If you're doing a darker stain, will not always show, but if you're going for a lighter stain, they often will not match. Each hide acts a bit differently with the stains.

Hope this helps,

Charlie
 
CShepherd said:
It's somewhat common for leather to have thinner and thicker spots. Just choose your section carefully for what you're doing.

For a knife of that size I tend to use 5-6 oz for the main body, but will find the section of the leather that is thickest for the welt.

One caution is in using leather from different hides. If you're doing a darker stain, will not always show, but if you're going for a lighter stain, they often will not match. Each hide acts a bit differently with the stains.

Hope this helps,

Charlie
Click to expand...
Yup, I agree. The lighter dyes show up the "imperfections" in the leather much more than do the darker shades, and come out "blotchy" at times. I've always had good luck with using a "medium brown" color of dye.
 
8/9oz. is pretty thick for smaller bladed knives. 7/8oz. is a better choice or 6/7oz for really light, short blades. If the 8/9 is all you have, you might try skiving both edges back about 3/16" from the edge and about half the thickness of the leather. You can also skive the welt thinner as well. I take the welt down to about 1/16" thick at the point depending on the blade thickness. It doesn't take a thick welt to protect the sheath and it will increase the retention value to hold the blade in the sheath.
 
CDH said:
In building my first sheath I am using a piece of 'premium 8/9 oz shoulder' from TKS that I bought about a year ago. The 3 thicknesses at the welt make the sheath a full 1/2" thick! That comes out looking ridiculous on a 3" bladed knife!

Did I get some bad stuff? It had a few scars and a definite thin section (maybe 10% of total area).
Click to expand...

Are you sure you have 8/9 oz ? My 8/9 oz. comes in at ~ .120 (just under an 1/8") and with the stack (back/welt/front) should end up ~ 3/8". IMHO, for safety sake, I wouldn't go to a lesser thickness (7/8oz.), except for the welt. 8/9 oz. is the minimum leather weight, again, IMHO ;), for a knife of any size. Depending on where you get your hides from there could be a slight variation in thickness and "range marks" but for the most part it's usually pretty darn consistant. Range marks also depend on the grade of leather you purchased. Can you post a pic of the sheath ?
 
I realize that I'm still pretty much a newbie (God, I hat that word), but in lean times when I just don't have the resourses, I've used as much as 4 different types/color of leather. I'll think "This looks like s@#t!" but carry through till finish.

I tend to use a dark (read "black") shoe/leather dye that hides a lot of mistakes. Then I'll be glad I finished.

To remedy the problem of having such a thick sheath for a small blade, check out one of the many tutorials for making pouch style sheaths. Good luck!

Jim L.
 
I have read tutorials until I am blue in the face. I have looked at pictures until I am cross eyed. Eventually one has to just go for it and stab themselves in the fingers with stitching needles...:D

Here are some quick and dirty pictures. Obviously I still need to trim and finish the edge and treat the whole thing.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/cdhcmh/Knives/PB030027_cropped.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/cdhcmh/Knives/PB030026_cropped.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/cdhcmh/Knives/PB030028_cropped.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/cdhcmh/Knives/PB030029_cropped.jpg

The welt is so thick the body of the sheath actually 'caved in' on the backside when I wet formed it instead of laying flat.

The 2 holes are for a retention cord. I have some leather boot lace material for that. Right now I can insert the knife, turn it over, hold it by the tip of the sheath, and shake vigorously and it will NOT budge. I figure the retention will get weaker as the leather gets finished and softened though...so I punched it just in case.

It is far too late to start over. This thing will have to carry me through my 6 day wilderness hunt starting this Friday, so I am making it work and to heck with pretty. Overall I think it would be fine if I had thinner leather and a little more time to trim up and finish the whole rig.

So another question. My finishing supplies consist of:

Small lump of 2-3 year old beeswax, maybe 3-4 oz.
3 oz jar of Mink oil...about the consistency of lard
Lexol leather conditioner
Parrafin wax blocks
Danish oil (I read somewhere that it could be used in a pinch???)

I don't care about color, but time and funds dictate using what I have on hand. Suggestions on anything and everything are welcome! Thanks!
 
CDH said:
So another question. My finishing supplies consist of:

Small lump of 2-3 year old beeswax, maybe 3-4 oz.
3 oz jar of Mink oil...about the consistency of lard
Lexol leather conditioner
Parrafin wax blocks
Danish oil (I read somewhere that it could be used in a pinch???)

I don't care about color, but time and funds dictate using what I have on hand. Suggestions on anything and everything are welcome! Thanks!
Click to expand...

I've had very poor results dipping in wax, but fabulous results with mink oil. Love that stuff.
Usually I go: dye -> shoe polish of same color -> mink oil, but you said you don't want to color it. Give it a very generous (read, heavy) dose of mink oil and put it away for a couple days. The oil will soak in, and then you do it again.

Gives you a smooth feel, a slight gloss, and good water resistance. :thumbup:

Out of the supplies you listed, that's what I would use!
 
With the exception of maybe a bit more loop and the finishing, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that sheath CDH, nothing at all :thumbup: . I would take it to your belt grinder first, to bring the uneven edges together then use an edge beveler to round off the sharp corners. The edge beveler, IMHO, is what really makes the sheath look professionally finished.

IMHO, I would use the Lexol. It will probably darken the leather a bit and will protect it quite well (I use neatsfoot oil for the most part now, sometimes dye & atom wax). If you want to dye it you can always use shoe dye and then the use lexol for protection. When you're finished with those steps take a piece of antler or hard plastic and briskly rub the edge (burnish) to shine it up. That is the last step and will work better when gum tragacanth is applied to the edge. The lexol should shine up well in a pinch. Maybe a couple coats on the edges would be better, then burnish.

All in all, I would say you are definately on the right track. :)
 
One tip I can give you is to sand down the part of the belt loop that attaches to the back of the sheath. Taper it down to almost an edge and this will take some of the thickness out of the sheath. You can also do this with the side edges of the sheath if you want to.
 
When you get back from your trip, try to get a hold of a copy of Custom Knife Sheaths with Chuck Burrows. The set of two DVDs is an invaluable resource for making knife sheaths. It's well worth owning, but if you'd rather rent it, it's available from SmartFlix.

As far as the welt on your blade, it's usually skived so that it's widest at the mouth of the sheath and thinnest at the bottom. You can do this easily with a Safety Beveler that you can pick up from Tandy Leather Factory for about $6.50.

3001-00-L.JPG
 
Nothing wrong with that sheath. One thing to do is thin down the welt a bit as you near the point or lower part of the blade like Chris said. I use my belt grinder and a 36 grit belt for that. Just don't take too much off, you need a little room. When you grind the back to smooth it up be carefull and go slow or you'll burn the leather.

I use a hot wax dip, it's a mix of bee's wax, parifin, mutton tallow, kiwie shoe polish, Balistol lube and mink oil. I just played around with it in a crock pot till I got the results I wanted. I have tried an acrylic finish and stain in one that Tandy sent me with an order one time. I didn't like the results as it made the leather flesh side stiff enough to leave wear marks on the gaurd. I have used it on a couple of gun belts I made with good results, and if a little quicker wear on the finish of the knife were no concern it'd make a very tough sheath. The Lexol will probably be the best for your aplication if it's the acrylic I think it is.

Also wanted to mention, I wouldn't go much if any thinner. I normaly use 12 once leather on just about everything.
 
12 oz. leather for sheaths? Isn't that a little overkill? That is skirting and fit for saddles and weight lifters belts----
 
I also use thicknesses like that and with my 1x30 belt grinder, sand down the edges a bit where its stiched, so it has a good bevel to about 1/2 the original thickness. it really makes it come together much less bulky while leaving the good thick leather for a safe, tough sheath. i get scrap saddle leather from tandy, its already great rich colors and i personally love the patterns and imperfections, they look rustic and aged, and the price cant be beat. $7 for a piece big enough for 4 or 5 sheaths. im lucky, theres a tandys around the corner from my home, so i can pick through and get the best pieces.
-Lou
 
I'll probably make another one later for a permanent sheath, as this one has a few serious problems...like being left handed.:foot: Yeah, I'll just live with that one.

Many thanks to the ones who weighed in. I tried a lot of combinations in my head, and a few in paper, and this sort of fell into place. In particular I was aiming for a flap sheath but the piece of leather I had was too short so I had to bend it over the other way and make a loop from it. Oh well...them's the breaks when you are poor and in a hurry!

It will serve me well for this hunt I built it for. For my fourth knife I think I like this hobby enough to keep at it!:D

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/cdhcmh/Knives/PB040025_cropped.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/cdhcmh/Knives/PB040026_cropped.jpg

1/8" stock removal, O-1, my first heat treat (it sliced a few feet of cardboard boxes without any edge problems and stayed shaving sharp)
South Texas mesquite
600 grit hand rubbed finish
Knife weighed in at a svelte 2.8 oz.
My first sheath too...:p
 
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