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Cookies Week 34 - Kizer Sheepdog

It can be tough to choose...

Discussion in 'Spyderco' started by Sonnydaze, Aug 16, 2019 at 12:04 AM.

  1. Aug 16, 2019 at 12:04 AM #1
    Sonnydaze

    Sonnydaze Gold Member Gold Member

    10,594
    Jul 6, 2009
    This sounds pretty silly, but I'm trying to compare the Mass Drop Keen/Laconico to the new Spyderco Advocate.
    The Keen is a great knife; I've carried one solidly now for six months, and it slices so very well. It's about 0.016" behind the edge, and it serves my very casual cutting/slicing needs very well. Ray Laconico is one outstanding custom designer and knife-builder.
    However, I'm a long-time Spydie fan, and the Advocate, with its M4 steel and "reported" thin-behind-the-edge measurement, is really pulling me in...
    I could own both, but I've gone down that route so many times in the past...and I only carry one folder, and I'm not interested in the different knife-a-day routine that many of you seem to enjoy.
    I'd be happy to read your thoughts...thx.
    And then there's this point...you can buy two Keens for the price of one Advocate...which doesn't necessarily impact my decision ... You only go around once...
     
    Murphjd25 likes this.
  2. Aug 16, 2019 at 12:49 AM #2
    Murphjd25

    Murphjd25 Gold Member Gold Member

    2,586
    Apr 27, 2016
    I have both and I would honestly pick the Keen over the Advocate. I love the Advocate though, it’s a great design by one of my favorite makers.

    The Keen gets the win for me because it’s such a simple and elegant design, it’s a better flipper, by far, the plain ti is more “grippy”, the S35VN seems to have a pretty good heat treat, and it’s almost half the price.

    The Advocate I have (1st Gen) flips mediocre to poor, and the orange peel scales are stunning to look at and feel, yet it is very slippery in the hands, especially when wet. I love the blade shape and grind, and you can’t go wrong with M4.
     
  3. Aug 16, 2019 at 2:58 AM #3
    Sonnydaze

    Sonnydaze Gold Member Gold Member

    10,594
    Jul 6, 2009
    Thanx, Murph. I'm glad that you addressed some pertinent points.
    I know that Spyderco has greatly improved the flipping action, and the orange peel might not show spider-trax, but slippery scales are NOT nice either...
    Darn it...
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2019 at 12:51 PM
    Murphjd25 likes this.
  4. Aug 17, 2019 at 2:24 PM #4
    sgt1372

    sgt1372 Platinum Member Platinum Member

    1,341
    Oct 16, 2018
    Don't know anything about the Keen but I like my Advocate. It's one of only a few out of the 300+ knives in my collection that I actually choose to carry.

    It flips fine/locks up well and I like the stippled look/feel of the thin Ti handle which also makes it easy to carry. I don't use any of my knives to cut anything. So, the blade steel type/grind is pretty irrelevant to me but there are lots of people who think that M4 is the bee's knees.

    The only neg thing that I've heard about M4 is rust/tarnish but I always oil my blades before storing them and have not had any problem with it on the Advocate or on the GB 1 & 2. No doubt that the blade on the Advocate is extremely thin/sharp at the edage and can cleanly slice anything that you want to cut.

    So, I can't say if the Advocate is "better" than the Keen but I don't think you'd make a mistake by buying the Advocate instead of the Keen.
     
  5. Aug 17, 2019 at 7:38 PM #5
    Sonnydaze

    Sonnydaze Gold Member Gold Member

    10,594
    Jul 6, 2009
    Thanx, Sarge. You have quite a collection to pick from.
    Now, I'm stuck. I just sold a bronze grooved Keen yesterday, and I thought it's a great knife. I carried it solely for perhaps three or four months...was never disappointed. It was 0.016" behind the edge and sliced very nicely.
    I have been hoping to buy a "nearly new" purple holey Keen to replace the bronze groove...a color change, but the holes might give a firmer grip.
    I have long been a devoted Spydie fan for good reason and am reviewing their 2019 knives before I jump. I am very fond of M4 and S90V, but wish that companies would post the approximate BTE measurement, as it's so very important, regardless of the steel. It is discouraging to buy a new knife for casual carry, and then discover that it's 0.030" bte, like so many on the market.
    Thanks all for your notes.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2019 at 11:38 PM
  6. Aug 19, 2019 at 1:18 AM #6
    4mer_FMF

    4mer_FMF Basic Member Basic Member

    2,143
    Jun 9, 2016
    Hi Sonny,

    From a pragmatic point of view, you’ve already had a Keen and liked it, but it seems you’re still itching to try an Advocate.

    When I have an itch, it keeps bugging me until I scratch it.
     
  7. Aug 19, 2019 at 9:55 AM #7
    Mistman68

    Mistman68 Gold Member Gold Member

    119
    Apr 7, 2019
    Don't have a Keen but love my Advocate and think it's one of the better flippers I have. I've read that Spyderco doesn't do well w/flippers but I find that untrue for me w/the Advocate (I have lots of ZT's and Hinderers) . It flips very well. I also like how slim it is, I don't have any problem w/the orange peel texture and like most Ti it gets 'grippy' the longer it's in your hand. I really like all the polished edges, it's a nice looker IMO. My only annoyance is the hole isn't 'open' very well on the clip side, the scale intrudes on the opening for the hole making finger flicking more difficult. You need to be diligent w/the M4 it will stain pretty quickly. Even when I'm not carrying it I probably nose grease it once a week just because. I did get a few spots on it within the 1st couple weeks of owning it but they came off w/an erasure, I just try and keep it more protected now (which also means it's seeing less pocket time :( )

    I've read tons of great things about the Keen, the price is good but I just can't get myself interested in it.
     

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