It's true, dull knives are safer most of the time!

[BryFry]

But a duller knife safer than a sharp one , can't see how , with a dull knife , you have to work harder to make it cut.

LOL! ....Sorry, I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I can't help but point out the irony of this statement..... Doesn't that mean you have to work harder to make it cut yourself??

Oh and I do agree that a cut from a dull blade will hurt more and take longer to heal, but you also have to take into account that a sharp blade will cut deeper and potentially cause a more serious injury.

 

[Jeff Clark]

People just aren't reading carefully enough to see the precise irony in my statement. Most of the time of a knife's existence is spent in idle anticipation of the glorious moments when it gets used. Most of the "time" (not times) it is Not Being Used. That is true for anything but a spinning slicer in a factory. A sharp knife does not pass the time more efficiently than a dull one. During all those minutes, hours, and days that it sits around (the vast majority of its existence) it is more likely to be involved in an accident and cut someone than a dull knife. A really sharp edge or point will not only cut things with less pressure, it will also snag and turn in to you easier than a dull knife. That is what the finger nail test is all about.

It is this neglected idle time that I am highlighting. A sharp knife works much better than a dull one. A sharp knife used with moderate pressure for maximal control works safer. But an idle sharp knife is the devil's play thing.

I think it helps to understand people who seem to fear sharp knives. They may unconciously focus on all that time that a razor sharp object is just hanging around more than the time that it is being used. In a way it is not that much different than having broken glass lying around. There are people who worry about glass containers since they might break and cut someone.

All my knives are sharp. I despise dull knives, but I now think I begin to see the other guy's (more often gal's) perspective. I might be able to regard my step mother with more understanding when she won't allow a sharp knife in her kitchen.

 

[Gadgetaholic]

I think that it is important to understand that things can be done to make a knife that is 'scary sharp' quite safe when not being used. Folding knives are inherently safe when unused because the blade is folded so that the the sharp edge is not exposed. A Knife in a sheath also does not have the sharp edge of the blade exposed. A knife in a knife block is similar to one in a sheath.

Some scary sharp knives in a kitchen draw with their sharp edges exposed may not be the best idea in the world.

Keeping blunt knives is also not too smart - it would be just as safe to not have those knives in the first place. If they can't cut well they really have no use! I have never heard of anyone being cut by a knife that wasn't there!!!!!

 

[hardheart]

The loaded gun analogy works to an extent. A loaded gun lying around will not shoot anyone, but if picked up by the inexperienced, tragedy is waiting to happen. A sharp knife laying about also will never cut anything, but also if handled by the inexperienced, a risk of greater injury exists. We do not have to blame the tools, but just understand that they are force multipliers, and the forces of ignorance & carelessness are already pretty powerful on their own.

 

[Simple Man]

We do not have to blame the tools, but just understand that they are force multipliers, and the forces of ignorance & carelessness are already pretty powerful on their own.

That sums it up rather nicely, I may have to use that with credit given.

 

[Skimo]

Excerpt from Jeff Clark's original post.
"I finally figured out the error of my logic. Most of the time knives are not used at all, let alone used properly. So most of the time a dull knife is safer than a sharp one. When sitting in a drawer a dull knife is safer. When sitting on a counter a dull knife is safer. When sitting in dish water a dull knife is safer. When you are polishing a knife, showing it around, or just playing with it a dull knife is safer. Even resting in a sheath a dull knife is safer."

very good - but can you further elucidate?

Certainly, though it is a basic premise. Succinctness was my aim, to avoid thread drift.

Some individuals don't agree with hazards in others lives, even their own. This is in direct paradigm confrontation with my views, which made his statement obvious.

The OP essentially states that some form of regulation, in this case personal, should be required for safety. One could only guess where the OP came to this conclusion, my guess is our current society with regulations on other force multipliers such as rifles be they capable of automatic operation, "high capacity" etc.

The OP has not demonstrated that he acknowledges the highest force multiplier or what real safety is. Which brings us full circle to my original post stating that inanimate objects are incapable of harm on their own.

At this point arguments for natural disasters causing harm, it's a straw man, some human decided to put themselves in harms way, in example living in a flood prone area, mud slide area, within distance of a volcano, on an eroding beach, these and every other hazard are the result of simply living this planet, the only way to avoid any possible damage is to end one's life. This eliminates any logical argument about inanimate objects being hazardous, the only way they may be hazardous is if we interject ourselves.

For those who want a shorter answer.

The real force multiplier is the user of a tool, the real safety issues lay with the individual and their practices, not with the tool.

 

[Skimo]

Post edited for clarity and points I wish to address.

*1*A sharp knife does not pass the time more efficiently than a dull one.
*2* A really sharp edge or point will not only cut things with less pressure, it will also snag and turn in to you easier than a dull knife.

*3* A sharp knife works much better than a dull one. A sharp knife used with moderate pressure for maximal control works safer.

*4* But an idle sharp knife is the devil's play thing.

*5* All my knives are sharp. I despise dull knives, but I now think I begin to see the other guy's (more often gal's) perspective. I might be able to regard my step mother with more understanding when she won't allow a sharp knife in her kitchen.

Here we go.

1. Sharp knives certainly pass the time better than dull ones, a well sharpened knife is a well maintained blade. As such a well maintained blade will last longer than a blade suffering from poor maintenance.

2. Sharp knives do not snag unless there is a chip or roll in the blade, the very idea is that instead of snagging, they slice.

3. You contradicted yourself. Which statement are you willing to stand by?

4. The devil has nothing to do with knives, stating this is a thinly veiled attempt at putting sharp knives in some relation to a mythos often seen as evil.

5. Blatant sexism. Though it appears you are willing to look outside your own paradigm, which is a good thing, we must remain vigilant to maintain sure footing for our own beliefs.

 

[knerd]

5. Blatant sexism.

I'm going to have to disagree with your statement. From my experiences I've come across less than a handful of women that don't freak out or dislike knives/the fact I carry a knife. It's not sexism, more like how people were raised as children (i.e. girls play with barbies and makeup and boys play with cars and tools). Men can be equally as "freaked out" by knives, especially in today's society, but from my experience it's usually women. It's completely subjective because not everyone is the same person and they have different parents, beliefs, cultures, etc.

 

[Skimo]

We have inferred differently from his statement.

I saw it as opinion stated as fact.

Perhaps Jeff Clark could clear this up for us?

 

[udtjim]

Very sharp kitchen knives should always be in a block, NEVER in a drawer. If anyone takes one of my knives from the Block, it is to cut something. Knives should be sharp. If someone gets cut playing with a knife, OR a gun, then they earn what they get. A sheath knife should be in the sheath until you need to use it or co maintenance on it. Seems like a no brainer to me. JMO

 

[knerd]

We have inferred differently from his statement.

I saw it as opinion stated as fact.

Perhaps Jeff Clark could clear this up for us?

Eh, from his experiences maybe it is "fact." Doesn't mean every woman/man out there is the same.

I usually find that the people that get offended by opinions are the ones that like to jump to conclusions.

 

[Skimo]

Eh, from his experiences maybe it is "fact." Doesn't mean every woman/man out there is the same.

I usually find that the people that get offended by opinions are the ones that like to jump to conclusions.

That's what needs clarification, I'm not offended by this instance of sexism, as a matter of fact I was raised to be sexist in a few areas.

I don't generally jump to conclusions, and often take a great deal of time and effort while posting to censor myself and remain objective.

I do get offended by opinions that are stated as fact, either out of habitual use of phrases or because of outright deceit.

I understand your position, and will wait until Jeff Clark responds before furthering the discussion.

 

[Jeff Clark]

Regarding some of Skimo's questions/observations. Most of my comments are highlighting idle time and most of my comments are really about kitchen knives.

Regarding "2. Sharp knives do not snag unless there is a chip or roll in the blade, the very idea is that instead of snagging, they slice." I am talking about idle time, not while in use. If you accidentally brush up against a really sharp edge it tends to catch on your skin and dig in. Your skin will often just slide over a dull edge. Usually an accident like this happens with a knife that is not secured so when it catches on something the blade rotates. This often aggravates the situation by pivoting the edge into you. This is a way that an idle knife, say laying on a counter top, is more dangerous than a dull knife. I do a lot of cooking and for sanitary and speed reasons I may use 6 different knives within a 30 minute interval. Often I am switching back and forth between them. Knives on a counter top are not an unusual occurrence.

Regarding your concern about: "*4* But an idle sharp knife is the devil's play thing." That is simply a joke playing on the old adage "Idle hands are the devil's play things." It was never to be regarded literally.

Regarding your concern about: "*5* All my knives are sharp. I despise dull knives, but I now think I begin to see the other guy's (more often gal's) perspective. I might be able to regard my step mother with more understanding when she won't allow a sharp knife in her kitchen." This comes from about 50 years of personal experience. I started sharpening my mother's kitchen knives when I was 10 and I am now 60. I started sharpening knives for money when I was 15. At 21 I was going door-to-door sharpening knives. Recently I only sharpen knives for free, but at times I do it in great volume. Often I sharpen 75 to 100 knives for the local soup kitchen. Over that 50 years I may have had a man say to my face that he doesn't like knives that are "too sharp", but I cannot actually remember a specific occurrences. I was warned by the soup kitchen manager to back off slightly since they use all volunteer cooks who change every day. I have had quite a few women tell me too my face that they don't like their knives to be too sharp. My step mother is one in particular. My dad had to keep his own set of kitchen knives after he married her in a separate knife block for her safety concern. I would get in trouble if I touched hers. So in my extensive experience it is more common for women to express fear of sharp knives than men and I more often have to deal with them about the issue.

Regarding knife blocks verses drawers for knife storage, my wife and my son's fiancee keep taking knives out of my knife block and stuffing them in a drawer. They can't really adjust to the knife block concept. It has only been about 10 years for my wife and she won't adjust. It is also hard to get extremely large or extremely small knives in a block. I have a drawer for small paring knives and another for large cleavers and 12-inch knives and for odd shapes like ulus. My wife keeps moving the mid size knives into the large knife drawer.

 

[John T Wylie Jr]

I am talking about idle time, not while in use. If you accidentally brush up against a really sharp edge it tends to catch on your skin and dig in.

Idle time for a knife , is the same as idle time for a firearm. It is the responsible of the owner , or person who used it last , to know where it is and if it poses a threat to others. If it poses a threat , you adjust it's storage or maintain possession until a safe storage can be had.

Regarding knife blocks verses drawers for knife storage, my wife and my son's fiancee keep taking knives out of my knife block and stuffing them in a drawer.

Sounds to me like you have some around you who fail to change their ways to be safer , then it is up to you to find another way to instill safety, is it not ? Just like a firearm , would you accept if they borrowed it and just tossed it on the coffee table when done ? Or if they borrowed your car and returned it by parking it on the sidewalk ?
A knife is no different.

In our house , it is known , the knife is returned to the block ASAP when you are done , if you have to wash it first , so be it , but it does not get left laying on the counter. They all know , if they do , there will be hell to pay , and believe me they will get the lecture. I have a wife and 3 sons ( ages 6-16 ).

It is always up to the user to protect themselves and others from "accidentally bumping , bumping or snagging on it " , it is responsibility of use.

Adjust the software , not the hardware

It's an education issue , nothing less , the only thing that can change is to make the people safer. But as long as there are those who are unwilling to understand simple safety , the situtation will not change.

Look at it this way , you boil water , you go to pour it into a cup , would you leave your hand over the top of the cup ? NO ! Why ? Cause you realize that you will get burned so you move your hand.

In your case Jeff , all parties know there are sharp knives in the drawer , after 10 years if they can't remember that and be extremely careful when going in that drawer , nothing you can do short of key locking that drawer will make them safer from the contents.

 

[Jeff Clark]

In the end I am talking about understanding, not safety. This is about understanding that people are not quite as foolish in their aversions to sharp knives as I have regarded them for the last 50 years. Over the years I have learned that even people with low IQ's are seldom as foolish as you would expect. Even people who don't agree with your wisdom are seldom as foolish as they seem. Often they have serious concerns that I don't share. At times I have problems even recognizing those concerns. My post was really about how hard and how funny it can be to look at things the other person's way.

 

[Djinn]

this whole thing follows the logic that dictates that an unloaded gun will get you killed. An unloaded gun will only get you killed when you need to use it as a dull knife is safer 'till you neen to use it. Having had my entire family's share of stitches over the years I can attest that I'd rather be cut by something sharp then dull any day.

 

[FlaMtnBkr]

It sounds like a lot of people don't know the meaning of the word accident. And if you can't see that a razor sharp knife is going to do more damage when an accident occurs then you are being close minded. In fact most are arguing that a sharp knife cuts easier with less force.

So when that accident does happen, the cut WILL be worse than if it was a dull knife. That is the point of a sharp knife.

I like my knives as sharp as I can get them. But I also know that when an accident does happen down the road, I will more likely be going to get stitches with a razor sharp knife, and hopefully won't sever something where I need surgery. I use knives a lot so there is a pretty good chance that something not planned for will happen eventually resulting in spilled blood.

You can preach all you want about safety and the correct way to handle a knife but that is not going to stop you from being cut when someone bumps into you at the wrong time. And by the very argument everyone is making, the cut is going to be worse with a sharp knife than a dull one.

I will take being cut with a dull knife because more than likely it will barely draw blood instead of going to the bone. Sure if you get a crush injury with a dull knife it is going to hurt, but that same force applied to a sharp blade would probably remove a body part.

It sounds to me like Jeff Clark is talking about accidents happening when the knives are not in use. So I agree that a dull knife is going to cause less damage and therefore be safer than a sharp one.

 

[rwasham]

Instead of dull lets just make them blunt...solves the whole problem

 

[Samael]

Instead of dull lets just make them blunt...solves the whole problem

It's already been done, which is why there's such a thing as a table knife. It dates back to one of the earlier English kings, if I remember correctly.

 

[knerd]

The next knife craze will be the tactical folding butter knife! Just you wait.