Japanese Kitchen Cutlery

J

John L

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Oct 28, 2004
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I have decided to make some Japanese style kitchen knives but do not know appropriate thickness of steel used. I have several very good books on the different style knives and what they are used for but they give lengths and widths but never thicknesses. Any ideas here? Thanks.
John Lloyd
 
Depends on whether you are doing single or double bevel.
 
The one piece of actual Japanese cutlery I own a 8" santoku is about .085 at its thickest part of the spine with a significant taper. On the other hand I've seen large Deba's that were over 3/8" thick!
 
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thinner than you can imagine... :)
just kidding, but seriously nakiri? funayuki?
 
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2mm is the most common thickness among the general purpose pettys, santokus, and gyutos
 
most Japanese knives sold here use a very small piece of blade steel clad with low carbon steel, wrought iron, or low carbon stainless. if using just one piece of steel(a version of the honyaki), 3/64 or 1/16 for paring and utility knives and vegetable cleavers. 1/16 or 3/32 for larger knives. i like to go full/high flat grind with 7 to 10 degrees per side secondary bevel, the steel tempered to Rc62-66. Epicurean Edge is another site to look at, they usually have detailed dimensions listed. http://www.epicedge.com/shopdisplaycategories.asp?id=74&cat=Japanese/Asian+Knives for a pattern, I print the knife photo actual size on graph paper. for a first project, try something like this http://www.tanebocho.com/aji-kiri-fillet-knife-double-bevel-blade/ but use 1/16/1.5mm instead of 1/893mm).
 
To all those that replied to my questions...thanks very much. I have enough to read for the rest of the day! Perhaps a bit of common sense will work for me also.....
 
It's a really complicated question, but you can keep it simple. A relatively thin full flat grind is probably a good place to start.
From there the variations are seemingly endless.
Aside from the grind, the profile is also very important and subject somewhat to personal taste of the user.

Experience on this one is something you have to earn through trial and error, but you can put yourself ahead of the curve by studying what folks like to use.
I have learned a lot from these videos about general geometry, the rest is testing, experience and suggestions from users:

 
when starting on Japanese style knives, don't worry about steel type. unless you are willing to buy from Dictum or other small companies in Europe, you will not find Hitachi blade steel here in US. and IMHO, you don't have to sweat it. at the end of the day Hitachi white is 1095 or W1 with a Japanese label. for a heavy use knife(lots of chopping), try 80CrV2, it works well at Rc62-63. for slicers and paring/utility, try O1 or 52100 at Rc63-66, yes it might chip but so will Hitachi white, blue or yellow at same hardness. dig deep and you will find Japanese knife maker warranties have paragraphs about what to cut and not cut, and if you hit a bone with your Ichiki Rimbyo and the blade chips, tough luck.
the big differences between Japanese and Western knives has been weight, thickness of grind, and edge angle(Japanese usually less than 15* per side).
this is a test mule I made last year https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/basic-lightweight-chefs-knife.1511853/ it still sees daily use. It is a slicer, slight secondary bevel at 8* per side.
 
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I have another question. After looking hundreds of photos of Japanese kitchen knives and reading a lot about them and their construction there were numerous notes on the wax filled handle after or perhaps before the tang of blade is inserted. I thought from some instructions that tang was heated and inserted into smaller recess in wood handle. Then I read a few places that the hole may be oversized and filled with wax. What is the traditional way to do it and what kind of wax is used? Thanks again.
 
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