Japanese vs. US cars--what is the truth?

The only good thing about getting a DUI is now I don't have to think about driving my 96 Chrysler Cirrus. :D
 
I owned a Ford that went 147,000 miles and now own a Honda with 160,000 miles, but the difference is, I would take the Honda across the country but I wouldn't try it with the Ford. I now own Japanese cars and will probably never buy a Ford or GM again.
 
A poster (Think_of_the_children) predicted a 'holy war' for this thread, but there is virtually no support for US makers. By the way, I think everyone knows by now that the Japanese (and German, and Korean) makers now make cars in the US, and the US makers make in Mexico, Canada, etc. Nonetheless, the Japanese companies are still based in Japan, and the big 3 still based in Detroit.

I still like to buy stuff that is 'made in USA' but don't have much loyalty left for the big 3 after their attempted pickpocketing of taxpayers via 'bailouts.' Still, where are the posters speaking up for the big 3? There is still a tiny part of me that feels better with US badge on my vehicle.
 
wutitiz said:
A poster (Think_of_the_children) predicted a 'holy war' for this thread, but there is virtually no support for US makers.
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Indeed: looks like I was quite wrong. Seems like any past internet discussion I've seen of Japanese vs. US cars has resulted in exactly that: hence my prediction. Just like most 9mm vs .45 threads, for example.

There are exceptions to every rule, I guess :foot:
 
IMO, the thing of it is now, enough if the big three can make something as well as the Japanese companies (don't hold your breath), too many consumers have had too many bad experiences with them that most will never go back.
This one included...



Thirty years of dysfunctionally run US branded auto making.
The time frame in which the Japanese makers have consistently made a more reliable product.
 
ADD said:
Thirty years of dysfunctionally run US branded auto making.
The time frame in which the Japanese makers have consistently made a more reliable product.
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Actually I think closer to 50 years is how long Detroit has been ignoring the handwriting on the wall.

In the 1960's, the VW beatle became one of the most popular selling cars in the country. Detroit kept on making big gas guzzling V8 cars that fell apart in 75'000 miles. In the 1970's the Datsun 510 and the Toyota Corolla, and in 1976 the Honda Civic, knocked VW off the top of the hill.

Detroits answer to the demand of good quality small cars was the Ford pinto and the Chevy Vega. Remember them?

By the 1980's Japan was the rulling king of small cars and was branching out with the Honda Accord and Toyota Camray.

Detroits answer was the Chevette and the Dodge Omni.

These days just out driving around its now uncommon for me to see 15 to 20 years old Toyota's and Honda's. When was the last time the U.S. made equivilent went by?

The message was given loud and clear with the buyers wallets as long ago as the 60's, that people wanted a good quality small car. But Detroit chose to go on making junk that fell apart by the time the last payment was made. Companies like that don't deserve any mercy.
 
ThinkOfTheChildren said:
Indeed: looks like I was quite wrong. Seems like any past internet discussion I've seen of Japanese vs. US cars has resulted in exactly that: hence my prediction. Just like most 9mm vs .45 threads, for example.

There are exceptions to every rule, I guess :foot:
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My guess is your prediction would be accurate except so many citizens are still quite mad about the bailout. Any other time, the tire irons and crescent wrenches would be flying by now. :D
 
Nothing better than a Toyota. Whether it's a pickup or car or SUV, Toyota rules. Superb reliability, great variety, nice driving, decent mileage, and great retainment of value.
 
My Dad has a Toyota Tundra that's well over 180k miles. He's barely kept to the maintenance schedule, and it's still going strong. It's used daily as a work truck, and the only problem he's had with it in recent memory is the factory battery dying. Even then, 8 years out of a car battery for what he has the truck do on a daily basis isn't bad at all!

Based on his experience--and my experience with a newer Dodge car, I bought a Scion tC in 2004. For those who don't know, Scion is a subdivision of the Toyota company, and the tC is produced here in the US by Toyota.

To date, the only mechanical things repaired on the car have been brake pads and one of the lift-gate hydraulic struts, which I'm pretty sure blew because the car was parked with one back wheel in a ditch in cold weather. And, a little hydraulic strut that makes my glovebox open slowly instead of just fall open. Both were replaced immediately under warranty by Toyota.
 
jackknife said:
The message was given loud and clear with the buyers wallets as long ago as the 60's, that people wanted a good quality small car.
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The perpetuation of this misinterpretation of events annoys. What do they call it, "ad hoc"?

In general, American buyers never wanted small cars. American buyers wanted cheap cars that ran well.

Good gas mileage was a plus, but small size was an incedental.

Notice that all of the "small" cars are now much bigger and also notice that gas mileage has essentially been stagnant for over a decade due to the increased size. Also notice that many small car models will never be sold in the U.S. simply due to a price that is too high in comparison to bigger cars.

As for buying a car, if you can afford it then buy what pulls your enjoyment trigger most. Nothin' worse than owning a car you don't like.
 
I own a 2002 Dodge Ram quad cab 4x4. It just turned 100k miles. Rust is beginning to show at the bottom edge of all four doors. The undercarriage looks like a 20 year old truck. It squeaks and rattles like an old model T. I just added up the total for repairs (not regular maintenance, just repairs) in the last seven years: $5235.00.

We also owned a 2003 Toyota Corolla. We just gave it to my oldest daughter last December. It has 89000 miles on it, but it looks like a two year old vehicle, inside and out. Total for repairs: $25. That's right $25. That's the cost for two headlight bulbs that I installed myself over the past six years. Gas and oil changes. That's it.

Apples and Oranges, I know. But here's the thing, both vehicles are almost the same age with nearly the same amount of miles on them. I would jump in that Toyota today and drive it across country without any hesitation. I think twice about driving that Dodge truck to Bangor (my closest "city") about 35 miles away. As much as I want to be a die-hard Mopar fan (like my whole family!) I just can't buy in. This is my 4th Dodge truck, and likely my last. If it wasn't for my company truck, which I drive 90% of the time now, that Dodge would be long gone. I'm trying to get ten years out of it and stay out of payments for a few more years.

Last year my company bought 14 new Ford F-250 Superduty 4x4 extra cab trucks for us. In this first year, with about 20-30k miles per truck. We have not had to do one single repair on any of those Fords. They get rode hard too. Time will tell.

Scott
 
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Interesting thread. Interesting consensus.
About 20 years ago I was lucky enough to attend a seminar with Deming. The other attendees were mostly Ford execs and shortly after that "quality is job #1" was a Ford tagline. Not sure that any of the big 3 have still quite learned the lessons.
For me (at the time) it all came down to the indicator stalk of the ten year old Honda I was driving (which had a nice touch and operated smoothly) and the indicator stalk of a Dodge I rented which felt as if it was about to snap off every time I used it.
 
One thing that surprises me is that Ford seems to be ahead of GM & Chrysler. A friend had a for tempo or escort (forget which) about 6 years ago. He went through 3 alternators and only was able to keep it running when he found that Napa would sell him an alternator with a lifetime guarantee. After that every time it went out he would just go back to Napa and get a free one. After that I crossed Ford off my list.

I am 90% convinced now to buy the crew cab 4wd Tacoma. I prefer manual transmission however, which means either lots of looking or special order & presumably further jacking up of the price. It seems that trucks with manual transmission are going the way of carbon steel folders.
 
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i have a 2001 Ford Ranger and its running great. only like 58k miles on it tho so we shall see. if toyota keeps up making great tacomas then the plan is to buy (and severly modify) a tacoma in 2012.

I view American trucks as work trucks and foreign trucks as play/everyday trucks
 
orthogonal1 said:
As for buying a car, if you can afford it then buy what pulls your enjoyment trigger most. Nothin' worse than owning a car you don't like.
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The something worse is having the car that "pulls your enjoyment trigger" in the shop, repeatedly.

bradpierson26 said:
i have a 2001 Ford Ranger and its running great. only like 58k miles on it tho so we shall see. if toyota keeps up making great tacomas then the plan is to buy (and severly modify) a tacoma in 2012.

I view American trucks as work trucks and foreign trucks as play/everyday trucks
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The Ranger is a decent inexpensive compact truck.
IIRC, Ford, at one point never made any real design changes (besides cosmetic) in over a decade... also, I believe production has since been discontinued...

What is interesting about this thread is the general consensus as previously noted.
Ten years ago there would have been more far more Big Three defenders and ten years prior, even more.

They have pissed away so much goodwill and loyalty.

A very sad indictment on a once proud American industry. :(
 
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Over the years I have owned American, Japanese and German vehicles. Maybe I've been lucky but every one of them was reliable. Some of them have broken down on occasion but it was always a minor item. I presently drive a F250 4x4 that has 98k miles on it. Outside of one recall to fix a problem in the wiring (which was done for free) I have not had to do any repairs outside of normal maintenance. It's still tight and has no rust.

My 2¢ is that there was a time when the American car industry was far behind in quality but that gap has closed tremendously in the past 10-15 years. I don't think where a vehicle is made is nearly as important as whether or not it's a car/truck that you want to own.
 
Just remembered the Ford Exploder we bought. Made a clunking noise on over-run. Had it checked - "nothing wrong sir". Then I was looking myself and spotted that there were no nuts on the engine mounts - it was just sitting on the bolts. Took it back again. First mechanic said it was supposed to be like that so I made a fuss and they found someone who agreed. It was trouble-free for the rest of the lease but I was unimpressed that the factory had forgotten to bolt the engine in and the dealer didn't spot.
 
Get the Toyota. When I graduated from college I bought a 98 dodge neon as I wanted to buy American. That car had a number of annoying problems -- interior pieces falling off, power windows failing, sun roof motor had issues etc. Even worse in 2002 my wife was driving it and got rear ended. Her seat back *fully* failed and submarined totally flat. It was by shear luck she wasn't badly injured given that failure. I came to find out that the late 90's Neons had terrible safety ratings. I bought a 2002 Honda CRV to replace it. It still runs like its brand new. I am patriotic and believe in American made goods when possible but not to my own personal detriment.
 
Im very patriotic too (Im in the Army for F*** sake) but its just not smart to buy American autos, except for maybe a Corvette, F350(or equivalent), or a Escalade:D
when the American auto industry starts caring about me and what i want and need THEN i will help support them
 
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