Jeff Randall, Sere 2000 v Military

Marion David Poff

Marion David Poff

Joined
Oct 8, 1998
Messages
5,403
I'd like to hear a little more about the liner lock. I've sort of moved away from liner locks, preferring frame locks, axis locks, etc, in my folders. I wonder how good the Al Mar liner lock is and if it is able to compensate for wear like the Sebenza frame lock.

BTW, Jeff, any word on you new fixed blade?


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Hoodoo

And so, to all outdoor folks, the knife is the most important item of equipment.

Ellsworth Jaeger - Wildwood Wisdom
 
Ok....put me on the spot why don't you
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Simply put, the SERE is heavier duty in my opinion. Liner lock is heavier, blade takes a keen edge quicker than most others, rust prevention is good, smoothness is unbelievable, ergonomics are perfect. Put all of this in the Rivber City concealex I have and it's an awesome package. If anyone has ever designed a folder that fits me and what I do, then the Al Mar is it.

I have zero complaints against the Military, but for the role I use a folder in, the new SERE is absolutley perfect. Actually in a tactical role, the Military is a little faster to deploy for me. I think the Military is a perfect crossover between survival and tactical, but the SERE is the perfect survival folder.

Now...as far as the Laser Strike. It will be in production soon. Anyone know what 'soon' is in the knife industry?
smile.gif


The scheduling got screwed up because of me. I have been busy and not finalized all the details due to making some unscheduled trips back into South America.

Jeff

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Randall's Adventure & Training
jeff@jungletraining.com
 
Originally posted by Hoodoo:
I'd like to hear a little more about the liner lock. I've sort of moved away from liner locks, preferring frame locks, axis locks, etc, in my folders. I wonder how good the Al Mar liner lock is and if it is able to compensate for wear like the Sebenza frame lock.
Click to expand...


Granted I have only had my S2K for a short time, but I am extremely impressed. The steel liner is nearly half as thick as the blade. I really hate to see this knife get overshadowed because it is a liner lock. This one really seems to be done right. Lockup is excellent on mine and I havent been able to make it fail. I had been carrying a 710 on duty, but since receiving the S2K I have switched. Don't let the fact that it is a linerlock steer you away.

Ergonomics are excellent also. And I really like VG-10 steel.

I can tell that alot of thought has gone into this knife. It is one of the best production folders I have seen come along in a long time.


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Dennis Bible
 
Jeff, concerning the "heavier duty" aspect, what would you do with the Sere 2000 that you would not do with the Military?

About the ease of sharpening, ok I can see 440V being more resistant to metal removal, but what about the greater edge retention of the Military allowing less frequent sharpenings? Plus it looks to me like that Military should have a huge cutting advantage because of the full flat grind, dropped handle and sweeping edge curvature. For reference :

http://www.agrussell.com/almar/amk-s2k.jpg


http://archery1.com/Graphics/Knives/Spyderco/spyderco%20military%20model.gif

[serrated one pictured as it was simply the best pic I could find]

Concerning ergonomics, your comments are very surprising. I have not handled the 2000, but it looks uncomfortable compared to the Military. It would be interesting to meet you as we seem to have almost the opposite opinions on many blades. The Sere 2000 looks to me to be a very low performance cutter compared to the Military, not ergonomic or secure grip wise and a liner lock to finish it off (so is the Military of course).

-Cliff

 
Originally posted by shootist16:

Granted I have only had my S2K for a short time, but I am extremely impressed. The steel liner is nearly half as thick as the blade. I really hate to see this knife get overshadowed because it is a liner lock. This one really seems to be done right. Lockup is excellent on mine and I havent been able to make it fail. I had been carrying a 710 on duty, but since receiving the S2K I have switched. Don't let the fact that it is a linerlock steer you away.

Ergonomics are excellent also. And I really like VG-10 steel.

I can tell that alot of thought has gone into this knife. It is one of the best production folders I have seen come along in a long time.
Click to expand...

Good to hear, Dennis.


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Hoodoo

And so, to all outdoor folks, the knife is the most important item of equipment.

Ellsworth Jaeger - Wildwood Wisdom
 
Cliff, we do have opposite opinions on most stuff...one of these days you and I are going to agree completely on something and Bladeforums will just shut down and the world will come to an end
smile.gif


As far as cutting efficiency goes, The SERE's manilla rope cutting efficiency is one of the best I've seen. Maybe the VG10 has a little more bite than the 440. Having said that, I can't tell much difference in edge holding ability, if anything I think the SERE holds a keener edge a little longer than the Military from what I've tested. I'm also able to get a razor edge back on the SERE quicker than I can on the Military.

In my opinion and testing, the SERE has as much cutting ability as the military in a wilderness setting. I can get more power on this piece without hurting my hand than I can the Military. No doubt the Military has excellent cutting characteristics, but the blade size and shape doesn't change the SERE's ability overall.

Ergonomics don't look that impressive for the SERE but once you put it in your hand, the whole world changes. The Military beats it as far as a 'tactical' knife in my opinion, but the SERE wins hands down for a wilderness survival folder.

Personally I think the liner lock on the SERE is first class and done right.

In conclusion, I have zero problems with either the Military or the SERE, but I like the SERE better for a wilderness folder. There's nothing I would change about it.

Jeff

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Randall's Adventure & Training
jeff@jungletraining.com
 
Recieved my s2k the other day. Fit finish and handling is great. Have cut alot of cardboard, twine and plastic strapping along with some whittling and it still shaves. It is the smoothest opener I've ever handled. I will be taking it out to the field in a couple of weeks and hope to use it as it was designed. Just my opinions but I haven't been let down yet.
 
Originally posted by JeffRandall:
Ergonomics don't look that impressive for the SERE but once you put it in your hand, the whole world changes. The Military beats it as far as a 'tactical' knife in my opinion, but the SERE wins hands down for a wilderness survival folder.

Personally I think the liner lock on the SERE is first class and done right.

In conclusion, I have zero problems with either the Military or the SERE, but I like the SERE better for a wilderness folder. There's nothing I would change about it.

Jeff
Click to expand...

Ergonomics are great on the S2K. To be honest, I wouldn't have even considered the S2K until my friend Chris Christman, ( www.toptexknives.com ),told me about it. He said he got one in for a customer and noticed the quality and great feel of the knife when he was inspecting it. I trust Chris. Jeff Randall's endorsement solidified my decision to buy one. Pictures do not do this knife justice. You really need to hold it. I like the Spyderco Military alot, but the S2K is more comfortable and is alot stouter. The full flat grind probably does have a little better cutting efficiency, but the other features of the S2K more than make up for what ever minimal cutting efficiency may be lost.



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Dennis Bible
 
Jeff :

The SERE's manilla rope cutting efficiency is one of the best I've seen. Maybe the VG10 has a little more bite than the 440.
Click to expand...

How is the edge geometry? Is it possible that the Military is a bit thicker edge wise?

Interesting comments overall, based on the picture I had no interest it that piece at all. However I am rather curious now.

-Cliff
 
Well, we now have the Spyderco Military and the Al Mar SERE 2000 as candidate survival knives. I am curious about other tactical folders of about the same blade length (about 3.5 to 4 inches) and the same price point (about $150) that might also fulfill that function -- say, Microtech, Emerson, MOD. I would be grateful for people's thoughts and suggestions.
 
Heck, if we're going to be considering other "survival" folders, lets also talk about the REKAT Carnivore and BM 710 Axis...

[This message has been edited by Squid (edited 08-07-2000).]
 
In all honesty, the only "folding" blade I carry when I hike/camp is a SAK Rucksack! I feel no need to "conceal" a knife in such situations, thus no real need to "fold" it - I carry a fixed blade!

Not to discount the utility of a folding "survival" knife - I just prefer to carry a fixed blade. In fact, I carry two.
 
How about the Starmate, then?
It does everything the Military can do, and then it is just a little bit sturdier, especially at the point.
If I understand what Jeff does not like about the Military, then the Starmate is the ideal combination of cutting performance and overall mechanical strength.
 
Originally posted by Costas:
How about the Starmate, then?
It does everything the Military can do, and then it is just a little bit sturdier, especially at the point.
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The thick hollow ground blade isn't all that good for cutting performance, and the stronger point really doesn't matter much since it's a folder. (If you start bending or twisting, it's hardly the blade which will fail first, and it wouldn't even if it was much thinner.)
The thick blade might have been of some kind of use if the shape of the spine had been more suitable to hammer on in order to split wood or something.

If you want high performance for survival use, I think medium size folders in general (like those discussed) compare rather badly to fixed blade knives of about the same weight and not much larger size.
For me, I think a "survival folder" would be a smaller, lighter complement to a larger, stronger knife, taking advantage of the fact that it can have a really thin blade.

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Urban Fredriksson
www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/
Latest update: A Russian hand made hunting knife

"I've always been fascinated by Scandinavian knives [...] they're simple, in an advanced way".
- Bob Loveless
 
Good points.....however..... some of us don't have a fixed blade on us all the time, but do have a folder with us all the time. Survival knives are those that are with you all the time since survival situations can occur anyplace, anytime.

With that said, small SAKs that go through airport security and can be carried just about anywhere may well be the ultimate survival knife?

I keep a 'survival' vest with various gear with me at all times...it's on me when I'm flying...in the car when I'm driving....on me when hiking, etc. There is a SAK that stays in it all the time and there's a larger folder in my pocket all the time unless I'm flying. Fixed blades only go on once I head into the bush.

A also agree with you that cutting efficiency in a folder should be a top priority.

Jeff

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Randall's Adventure & Training
jeff@jungletraining.com
 
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