just starting out

RescueRiley

RescueRiley

Joined
Mar 22, 2006
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I'm toying with the idea of making my first knife I'm planning on using an old carbon steel file or just ordering some 1095 My question I suppose is basically What than?? I have a design and have access to a bench grinder...And a torch but I could also send it to ranger custom for heat treating...but should this be done before or after shaping?? ANy advice at all would be helpfull Thank You
 
instead of ordering the steel goto a local automotive repair shop and ask them if they have any leaf springs that they are going to scrap. its 5160 steel. you can get that stuff for free and it will help you out in the long run. you can also use coil springs. just use the torch to heat up the metal and flatten it out.
 
I'm going to take the opposite stance from PimpinSquee. No offense intended Jacob. There is no guarantee that automotive springs are 5160. For a person just starting out I would recommend that they order a known steel...just cuts down on the frustration in the long run. If it is sent out for heat treatment you can tell the man with 100% certainty that it is what it is. If you heat treat it yourself, you can rely upon known data for the operation. 10xx series and some other commonly used steels are not that expensive to get a hold of. I do my shaping and most of the grinding and hole drilling before heat treatment. Just my $.02. Good luck! -Matt-
 
i got mine from an offroading place. full length rear truck leaf spring. you can make alot of knives from it and its free. cant beat that. if you look in $50 Knife Shop by Wayne Goddard he shows you how to work with a one brick forge and a coil spring. if you havent checked out that book i highly recommend it.
 
Leaf springs generally are good steel, but are more useable for guys that forge. Riley sounds more interested in stock removal for the time being, and judging by the tools he has that would be easier for him.
The first thing that needs done with a leafspring is it has to be straightened and normalized, which is not something you could do with just a torch.

For a beginner at stock removal, buying new steel is usually the best way to go. It will be flat, annealed, and ready to work with. It will also be a known composition so that you can easily hire someone to heat treat it, or learn to heat treat it yourself. Learning to heat treat with an unknown steel is a bad idea. You take away the control of knowing what the outcome should be and what process you should use. If it doesn't harden properly you may have made a mistake, or it might just not be what you thought it was. Its best to limit the number of variables when you're starting out.
 
I think when you first start out it is important to know what you are working with. Don't reinvent the wheel. Spend $10 a buy a piece of steel with a known pedigree. And then have fun!
 
PimpinSquee said:
none taken. he is correct tho. but the majority of all leaf springs and coil springs is infact 5160.
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or 8260...or 9260...or whatever composition the OEM requested. It is true that a fair amount of leaf spring material from the early 20th century through into the 60-70s was in fact 5160, and even today a lot of it still is. However, the past few decades have seen a lot of change in this stuff due to several factors. Personally, unless I knew from a spring shop what the stock was when I got it (which is possible if you make friends with a custom spring shop. They know what they order.) I'd not take the risk when known steels can be had pretty inexpensively. You're guaranteed to spend more on tools and handle materials than the steel if you really start making knives. Why skimp on one of the cheapest parts?

In any event, it sounds as if more stock removal is in RescueRiley's future, and I have to agree that leaf spring would be a poor choice for this. It's generally very large stock which means a lot of wasted steel and effort in grinding aside from everything else mentioned already.

Go visit http://www.flatground.com and get a small quantity of a known simple steel such as 1095 or O1. Do most of your shaping prior to heat treatment (especially with O1. Don't forget to drill your holes before HT there...ask me how I know ;) ).

Most importantly be safe and have fun.

-d
 
I've heard that spring shops may have scrap of new stock. Which would be a known steel, annealed, and ready to grind. That would be the best of both worlds.

Look through the stickies here, there are lots of places to get whatever steel you like. And get it heat-treated too, if you want.
 
Gibson beat me to it. A custom spring shop will know what the steel is. They often have a barrel full of cut off pieces.

Jacob - The springs on cars are rarely 5160 anymore.

I recommend to all new makers to read a book or two before starting out at all. Knowing what you are going to do FIRST is far better than learning the hard way.Wayne Goddard's, "The $50 Knife Shop" is a classic first book. You can buy it on halfprice.com for $3-5.
Next, I always recommend newer makers to use known steel.1084/84, 5160,O-1 are the usual first steels. 1080/84 is a good starter steel. It is available from Aldo Bruno and Mace Vitale , and is very forgiving. It is the eutectic steel and has the easiest HT. 1095 is a little trickier to HT and should be used after a few successful knive attempts are under your belt.Here is a link for 1084 -
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=442728

Welcome to the knife world and the Bladeforums.
Stacy
 
Without any forging tools I think you should go with one of the stainless knife steels using the stock removal method. A good hack saw and your bench grinder will profile the blade and rough-in the bevels, next use a good file to draw the bevels. Make sure you have it sanded almost 100% and send it out to Paul Bos for the heat treating. When it comes back simply finish sand and put your handle on. It will be a very high performer and depending on how much time you take on the finish, it would look great.

If you catch the bug you will buy tools like a belt grinder and drill press as you go. Forging is another ball game.
 
the only reason why i was using leaf springs is taht i can heat them up and flatten them out and then do stock removal. im not ready for forging a blade yet. i hope you catch the bug. if you dont know what to spend your money on next these guys can help you with that.
 
PimpinSquee said:
if you dont know what to spend your money on next these guys can help you with that.
Click to expand...

Heh! That's true, but they've also helped me learn to make cool stuff without necessarily spending the rent. $50 Knife Shop is a MUST HAVE, you won't regret buying that book. And it's all in color now! :)
 
mines still got alot of black and white pics in it. the center pages with the knives is colored. is that what you mean GibsonFan by it being in color now?
 
Goddard's revised edition has about 250 color photos in it, not just the center section.
-Mark
 
bladsmth sent me the one with the colored center section. i get he kept the good one to himself. stingy person HEHEHEHE!! still an excellent book.
 
Heres some great advice at my expense. If you are having an off day, bad day or just dont feel well, dont do any critical knife work until you feel better. I was recoverying from the 24 hr flu and having a bad day. Thought I would cheer myself up by finishing a knife. I put a fresh 800 on and forgot to cut the grit a little with some mild steel (didnt have any used belts at the time). Took a big nasty hunk out of my micarta with a slip and bit into the tang! I already knew not to work grinding when not feeling well but I seem to have forgot.
 
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