Katana Quality For $500+ ???

Keep in mind you can get a better quality blade for the money if you buy a " bare blade", which is a katana blade with simple bamboo furniture vs the traditional mountings. Something like this. http://www.roninkatana.com/ronin-elite-2013-bare-blade.html(image courtesy of Roninkatana.com)

I think the key here is that you may be able to get a better quality blade in shirasaya, but you will not have a katana. Shirasaya are made for long term storage of a blade and should never be used for anything else (they are not made for cutting practice).

Also, just FYI the shirasaya are not made from bamboo and aren't usually lacquered as in the link. The point is to allow the blade to 'breath' during storage when a traditional tsuka / saya may 'trap' moisture.

(I actually don't think the point of the blades in the above link is to provide long-term storage but to allow someone to have the blades mounted themselves)

Blake
 
So you are simply disrespectful to everyone you meet? That's a stupid statement. You should give respect to everyone unless they slight you. I don't see as I have done that here so you are just being pompous. Wow I'm in awe of your knowledge of swords. Is that what you want me to say? Get a life. I can't believe some of you have so little in your life that you get this worked up over someone else trying to make a suggestion. Was this really worth it to you to put someone else down? Besides don't you want to spread the love of your hobby? I always work to encourage Busse and Bussekin noobs to learn in a nice way. People come into the Busse forum all the time asking what some would consider stupid questions. Why put them down? Does it make you feel like more of a man to be a keyboard warrior?

I'd have to say no... Steve is not disrespectful to everyone he meets, he has treated me with respect ... even in the custom knife forum where I made a jackass out of myself for posting an $80 knife where the big boys play..
 
Well as someone who pays due to geography much more than you guys in the USA I say I don't know if its possible to get real quality for that price.
I have held a cheness piece felt like crap others whom opinion I respect and know much more than me say they are good.
I'm having something made now not a sword mind but $500 for a piece you may use ?.
I may be off with my statement but I can't see it really tbh might last a short while.
But invariably will lead to failure , given its nature I'd not risk it .
Save up for 4x as long buy something you'll have a life time , even then x4 is just the low end.
 
well, while they're certainly nothing like a katana, they are quite excellent weapons, and highly durable. Whether or not they are "swords" will depend on who you ask. On the other hand, the OP asked about Katana, and nothing made by Busse or Swamp Rat fits any conceivable definition of Katana
 
I dont believe quality katanas exist for that cheap....
$500 is still a cheap kitchen knife. ..
 
I dont believe quality katanas exist for that cheap....
$500 is still a cheap kitchen knife. ..

um... yeah that's elitist nonsense. There are several high quality katana in that price range. What IS true, is that there are no traditionally made high quality katanas in that price range.

The practical and raptor series by Hanwei is very good quality and under 500. There are several other popular brands that make high quality through hardened monosteel bladed katanas

The idea that only traditionally made blades with traditional materials are "real katanas" is just nonsense that traditional collectors tell people.
 
The practical and raptor series by Hanwei is very good quality and under 500.

I was going to suggest something along the lines of the raptors, no they are not katanas in the way that I would describe a katana and I readily admit that the sword world is not my world. I can not play In the big boy leagues.

But from what I hear, they are functional prices of sword shaped that steel that cut well and come back to do it again.

If "battle ready" Is all your looking for, then go for it. But the question of why you actually need it does arise, then again, why do I need the stuff that I do?

Again, sword world is not my world.discussing such things is a can of worms I'm not yet ready to open but If I wanted to buy a sword shaped object to go into the backyard and cut stuff up with , I would buy a raptor tomorrow and nothing labeled "musashi", no matter what kind of magic their blades are claimed to be forged with. I've handled them, they're flea market junk and feel it. My kabar would cut it in half..
 
The only other other suggestion I feel comfortable bringing to the table is that 1095 is a great tough working steel for knives but not skmething that I would want in a sword.

Coming from knife land and to find a sword that cheap would basically desire the qualities of a big knife (no Hammon, not folded or layered,) I would desire something more long the lines of L6, 5160, "1085"(cold steels SK5), some. Good spring steel, something like that.
 
I was going to suggest something along the lines of the raptors, no they are not katanas in the way that I would describe a katana and I readily admit that the sword world is not my world. I can not play In the big boy leagues.

But from what I hear, they are functional prices of sword shaped that steel that cut well and come back to do it again.

If "battle ready" Is all your looking for, then go for it. But the question of why you actually need it does arise, then again, why do I need the stuff that I do?

Again, sword world is not my world.discussing such things is a can of worms I'm not yet ready to open but If I wanted to buy a sword shaped object to go into the backyard and cut stuff up with , I would buy a raptor tomorrow and nothing labeled "musashi", no matter what kind of magic their blades are claimed to be forged with. I've handled them, they're flea market junk and feel it. My kabar would cut it in half..

LOL... i'll have to disagree with you there. I have both a TH and DH Musashi and they are a LONG way from flea market crap. I've cut mats with both of them and they hold up very well. Neither has taken a set, and there's absolutely no damage to them.

No, they're not great, but then, for the price, who'd expect em to be. They're bottom basement entry level swords that are functional enough to handle light cutting. They don't hold a candle to my Yamakami Ko-Katana, but that's to be expected
 
The only other other suggestion I feel comfortable bringing to the table is that 1095 is a great tough working steel for knives but not skmething that I would want in a sword.

Coming from knife land and to find a sword that cheap would basically desire the qualities of a big knife (no Hammon, not folded or layered,) I would desire something more long the lines of L6, 5160, "1085"(cold steels SK5), some. Good spring steel, something like that.


I agree with you for the most part about differentially hardened 1095. I prefer steels with less carbon... though some smiths/companies work well with 1095.

A sword is not , and should never be a big knife. Distsal and profile taper are essential to mass distribution. A sword with good distal tapr needs less weight in the handle to pull back its balance because it has less material at its tip. What this means is the majority of mass is centered around the point of rotation , not at the poles. This is what makes a sword come alive in the hands... otherwise it is dead weight.
 
LOL... i'll have to disagree with you there. I have both a TH and DH Musashi and they are a LONG way from flea market crap. I've cut mats with both of them and they hold up very well. Neither has taken a set, and there's absolutely no damage to them.

No, they're not great, but then, for the price, who'd expect em to be. They're bottom basement entry level swords that are functional enough to handle light cutting. They don't hold a candle to my Yamakami Ko-Katana, but that's to be expected
Perhaps the $150 one i handled at the local flea market want truly up to par with their $100 offerings.

Maybe more like a $50 one marked way up, in retrospect that's what it looked like.
 
I really like the Hanwei Bushido. I think it's a beautiful sword and the I like the measurements. Just wished it had a more graceful kissaki.
 
Let's go back to the original.

Spend the money first on instruction.

You will not use your display sword in practice. You will use a practice sword. So spend the second money on practice swords.

There are swords of different designs (for reasons) and lengths. After you have undertaken a year or so of training, your objective may change and you may want a somewhat functional long knife or sword in contrast to a display item. So, you might be better off in waiting.
 
The idea that only traditionally made blades with traditional materials are "real katanas" is just nonsense that traditional collectors tell people.

It depends upon what you are looking at the sword for. If you are looking for things like mokume hada, ashi and a blade crafted from tamahagane as your definition of a "real katana", you will most likely want one from Japan and they will be expensive.

If you want something that is balanced and cuts like a traditionally mounted katana, there are many options that are affordable and attractive with some general caveats. I don't collect swords....I use them, I train with them and cut with them....All the models that I have will fail massively in comparison to a well made Japanese katana from an aesthetic standpoint.

For what I use them for, they work quite well. I highly recommend the Tiger Elite from CAS Iberia, but where price is a factor, the Shinto is also a winner. The Shinto can be had for about $700.00 on Amazon. The Raptor swords cut great, specifically the Shinogi Zukuri, but I miss the hamon. That is a part of the Japanese aesthetic that is unique and highly attractive.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
It depends upon what you are looking at the sword for. If you are looking for things like mokume hada, ashi and a blade crafted from tamahagane as your definition of a "real katana", you will most likely want one from Japan and they will be expensive.

If you want something that is balanced and cuts like a traditionally mounted katana, there are many options that are affordable and attractive with some general caveats. I don't collect swords....I use them, I train with them and cut with them....All the models that I have will fail massively in comparison to a well made Japanese katana from an aesthetic standpoint.

For what I use them for, they work quite well. I highly recommend the Tiger Elite from CAS Iberia, but where price is a factor, the Shinto is also a winner. The Shinto can be had for about $700.00 on Amazon. The Raptor swords cut great, specifically the Shinogi Zukuri, but I miss the hamon. That is a part of the Japanese aesthetic that is unique and highly attractive.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

^ this guy speaks sense
 
Let's go back to the original.

Spend the money first on instruction.

You will not use your display sword in practice. You will use a practice sword. So spend the second money on practice swords.

There are swords of different designs (for reasons) and lengths. After you have undertaken a year or so of training, your objective may change and you may want a somewhat functional long knife or sword in contrast to a display item. So, you might be better off in waiting.

I have to vent a little here... I hope you don't take it personally, because truthfully, there's nothing particularly bad about your advice in an ideal world. It never ceases to amaze me how people just don't bother reading the posts in the thread. You can't just read the title and come up with a relevant and informative response.

That being said...

You do realize that he already said he was already getting instruction, right? Frankly, practice blades are cheap. Many instructors use wooden practice blades on a fairly regular basis. And if he never wanted to do any cutting with the blade, why not just get a wall-hanger? The OP is clearly looking for something that's reasonably aesthetically pleasing (and, being as how it's his first, I'd wager that he'd be pretty happy with a Hanwei or DF in that price range), but still capable of performing cuts.


That being said, you did provide some excellent points, namely that the katana needs to be fit to the person, if they're a serious practitioner. Length and balance are all deeply original. However, to get a truly functional and beautiful blade that's perfect for you will almost certainly take a LOT of cash. Starting off with a ~500 dollar blade isn't an awful idea. And lets be honest here. Most people's first katana costs 100 dollars or fewer, and there's a huge difference between one of those and what the OP is thinking about getting. Not to mention, you only really NEED a custom fit katana if you have very specific performance needs, none of which were listed by the OP.

Let's get real. Only a tiny percentage of even the Blade Forums population is really into swords at all. There are some collectors, who generally have very discriminating tastes, and know exactly what they want. There are the very few serious practitioners (like STeven) who, also, have a good idea of what they want and need, and again, don't need patronizing advice. And then there's everyone else, who really just want a sword for the "cool" factor. They understand perfectly well that they have no need for a sword, and that they'll likely only cut water bottles and pool noodles with it, and the rest of the time it hangs on the wall. Since they have no real need for a sword, they just want something that's capable, reasonably good looking (most people won't know the difference between a 500 dollar katana and a "real" katana," and it would mean nothing to them to see a real one), that won't break, and also won't break the bank, because it's realistically going to hang on the wall most of the time.

Because they understand exactly what they want and why, they're not looking for suggestions that they go get instruction. Most people who buy swords don't really care enough to get instruction, because, realistically, it's a worthless skill in the modern world, and it adds nothing to what they want out of the sword, while it DOES cost a lot in time and money that they probably don't have (otherwise they wouldn't be on a budget).

I'd venture most aren't looking for Bussekin either. An OP to which a Busse or Swamp Rat would be an appropriate response, would almost have to include the word "tactical." It would probably also include the notion "hard use," "tough," or "chopping down trees," and would NOT include the word "budget."

For the serious practitioner, Busse's offerings aren't really worthy suggestions for someone who is looking for a sword. Maybe a sword-like machete object, but not a sword. Sure, they're tough, and SOME find them attractive (although I can't fathom why), and very well made, tough, etc. But they're not really swords, and I have yet to see one with decent balance and handling. They're also well beyond the budgets of most. Does that mean they should never be suggested? Of course not. But there is a time and a place for recommending them, which is pretty specialized.

Personally, I'd get one of Hanwei's offerings. As STeven mentioned, the Tiger Elite is a great offering, although outside the OP's price range. There are plenty of other offerings that are decent that, while not perfect by many of our standards, would be a perfectly respectable first sword.
 
Well he said 500+ so to me the Tiger Elite is in his price range. I'm not a "serious practitioner" but I think Hanwei has plenty of swords in the 500-1000 range that most would find functional and aesthetically pleasing.
 
Back
Top