Katars again [sans Kareena ;) ]

[ruel]

"What does this have to do with khukuris"?

Nice curves? Would be nice to handle?

Here are pix of my two katars. First one is probably Rajput, 18thc.

It's one solid piece of crystalline wootz and has gold koftgari all over the grip.

Of course, I had to go and drop it point first on the garage floor, chipping 1/4" off the tip; dumb luck alone that it didn't go straight through my foot! It's now off getting re-sharpened, polished, and scabbarded.

The other one is just decorative, probably from South India; it has a cast brass handle riveted to the blade, which has some painted images of various avatars of Vishnu.

It's alot more dangerous-looking than it really is.

 

[beoram]

Originally posted by ruel
"What does this have to do with khukuris"?

Nice curves? Would be nice to handle?

Ja! Also--from her Asoka performance--might be dangerous if improperly handled....originally it had to do with the fact that I was trying to figure out about the leather straps I've seen associated with katars, and I thought I remembered Kareena using them with her katar...but she just wraps a cord round. But the original connexion is katars...

Originally posted by ruel
Here are pix of my two katars. First one is probably Rajput, 18thc.

Vah! Very nice. There was a similar one to your 1st one on eBay that I was tempted on, with some nice elephants on it. But the seller couldn't tell me much about it and I was loath to spend too much money on something of doubtful authenticity.

Do you know anything about dating katars? I was wondering if mine was 18th or 19th century.

Cheers again, B.

 

[ruel]

I only know the age of mine because the seller -- Artzi Yarom of Oriental-Arms -- said so. He always researches his stuff before putting it out, and has been in the game longer than I've been alive!

Actually, he said the Rajput one was probably plain until the 19thc., when the chiseling and koftgari were added. You can still see remnants of the original spine running through the center of the blade fuller.

The only thing I know as a general rule is that N. Indian katars are 1-piece, while S. Indians have blades riveted to grips. Can't remember where I got that from, though.

 

[Bill Martino]

I'll still stick with Kareena.

 

[beoram]

Originally posted by ruel
I only know the age of mine because the seller -- Artzi Yarom of Oriental-Arms -- said so. He always researches his stuff before putting it out, and has been in the game longer than I've been alive!

Actually, he said the Rajput one was probably plain until the 19thc., when the chiseling and koftgari were added. You can still see remnants of the original spine running through the center of the blade fuller.

The only thing I know as a general rule is that N. Indian katars are 1-piece, while S. Indians have blades riveted to grips. Can't remember where I got that from, though.

I'm familiar with Oriental-Arms, yes. Thanks for the info on the Rajput one.

Maratha counts as N. India, and is two pieces....so. Here's what I read on http://www.ruble-enterprises.com/katar.htm:

European blades of the 16th and 17th centuries were often used, especially by the Mahrattas and were always riveted to projections from the hilt. Katars with native blades are often thickened at the point to strengthen them for use against mail and are often forged in one piece with the hilt.

so I suppose that answers my question about the blade. It's most likely European.

It's too bad that there doesn't seem to be a resident katar expert (unless I'm mistaken...). I'm going to continue to try to do research.

thanks again for your reply.

Originally posted by Bill Martino
I'll still stick with Kareena.

Well, the katar is attainable....Kareena....unless you have some tricks up your sleeve

cheers, B.

 

[ruel]

I was gonna make another general statement about Indian girls, but since the general statement on katars didn't hold, I won't take my chances.

 

[Berkley]

It's too bad that there doesn't seem to be a resident katar expert

Like the khukuri, the katar suffers from a lack of published works, and no collector of JP's stature has stepped up to fill the void. Rawson's The Indian Sword has only the briefest reference

In early times a stabbing method of sword-fighting seems to have been practised; but with the development of longer blades, partly no doubt for use from horseback, Indian swordsmanship seems to have developed in the direction of a pattern of purely cutting strokes combined with acrobatic avoidance-devices. Indian swordsmanship seems never to have made much use of the point or much use of guarding with the sword.... The only evidence of the use of the point in Indian hand-arms occurs in the specialised katars (daggers) equipped with a heavy perce-maille tip. Indian sword blades were thus not made primarily to parry with. Parrying was the function of the small circular shield in use since about the 10th century.... That some form of sword and dagger combination was employed seems to be indicated by the fact that some types of dagger, especially katars, are equipped with "sword-breaking" bars depending from their hilt

 

[Bill Martino]

Thanks, all, for good input.