Kershaw and ZT 2020 lineup

Actually there are some interesting stuff in the Kershaw released
Sinkevich makes great stuff with them
 
Gideons said:
Or... considering how fast the re-runs of the ZT 0301 and 0303 sold out... They could of just remade that exact knife in 20cv with KVT, and maybe some skeletonized liners. Many people don't like sharpening recurves, so it made sense they changed the blade shape. People liked the 0301 because of it's ergonomics, and hard use no non-sense approached. Both of those have been largely altered. Honestly, I wouldn't of been as negative if ZT themselves didn't compare it to the ZT 0301. I certainly know when I'm in the field, relying on a knife I don't want a cut out in the middle of the handle... seems like a place where mud/debris can get into the knife/framelock. I also know on a large, heavy, hard use to knife, I want the additional strength offered by having the bladestop thumbstuds which were removed from the ZT 0301. The fact is, they had a widely popular model and they needlessly changed it. They're using different hardware (hardware I like less, more parts/fancy). They stripped this knife of many of small features that made it special. There is a reason the ZT 0301 is still well liked and widely used over a decade later after it was released.

If you want to talk business, the ZT 0301 family I believe the 2nd or 3rd best selling ZT ever, behind the 0350. I have a later produced 0562 in S35VN just before they discontinued. The 0562 is one of ZT's best selling/popular models and it's serial Number is in the low 8000's... I have a ZT 0301 that has a serial number in the late 18000's...
Click to expand...

Methinks you doth protest too much. After all, let's cut to the chase: if you need a heavy, hard-use knife you can abuse "in the field", why aren't you using a fixed blade?

This new 0308 is exactly what many people have been clamoring for, and it's what many people have been criticizing ZT for years now for getting away from. If you don't like it, that's fine, but acting like it's an inferior product because it doesn't meet your personal arbitrary (and entirely subjective) criteria is a huge stretch and again, at the end of the day, if you're looking for something bombproof to abuse, why aren't you using a fixed blade? A quality fixed blade will shrug off abuse that would break both this new 0301 AND your vaunted revered old 300 series knives. That's simply a fact.

"They needlessly changed the hardware!" This is an entirely new product that is meant to invoke the spirit and feel of the old one, not be a direct copy. It's crazy to me that it seems this needs explaining.
 
Gideons said:
.Also, to your point... majority of infantry soldiers (for example) don't carry fixed blades even when working in the field/survival training.
Click to expand...
But they are going to carry a $300 high end folder?

You've started a few threads getting riled up over ZT through the years here. Maybe they aren't the brand for you. Have you tried cold steel?
 
Gideons said:
Sorry that I have a science background and I get annoyed when features are less strong/optimal than the old hardware. Or when the old lockup engineering (with the bladestops thumbstuds) means the knife won't handle force as efficiently thus make it weaker. So, the inferior comment isn't subjective by the requirements I've listed it is quite literally inferior. Also, to your point... majority of infantry soldiers (for example) don't carry fixed blades even when working in the field/survival training. A properly executed folder can be plenty strong:
Click to expand...

Oh, you have a "science background", well then that makes your criticisms super objective, then (this is sarcasm as this does nothing of the kind). Actually, the fact of the matter is that this knife (which you haven't even held, seen in person, seen any objective testing or...well you know, anything really) will almost certainly perform as well as the old knife. If you're doing work that requires an additional secure point (such as the thumbstuds), it means it's work that would be better done with a fixed blade. The new knife absolutely is not "literally inferior", and frankly I'd expect someone with a "science background" to realize that their subjective opinion does not constitute a literal state or objective review of any kind. That's just embarrassing.

Also, to your attempted rebuttal to my point, soldiers generally don't tend to carry folding knives to beat on things with in the first place, they will usually use their issued multi-tool. You know that, right? Also, talk to some actual soldiers going through survival training*, and they'll tell you that they aren't using a folding knife to do any of that. Soldiers generally aren't carrying $300 knives around in the first place, for that matter.

Listen, you don't like the new knife, that's fine. But as yet, you've essentially based your entire premise around the subjective opinion that you don't like it and attempted to compare it to an old knife. And hey, that's fine, this is a knife forum where we get to discuss stuff, but please stop with the logical "argument from authority" fallacy. Lastly, if we're being strictly objective, the fact that the 0301 needed thumbstud bumpstops is more an indicator that the framelock wasn't the best. That was an admission on ZT's part that people would possibly abuse the knife past what just having the framelock would take (AKA: doing things better done with a fixed blade). Also, I'll take a 20CV blade over an S30v blade all day long, and twice on Sunday. So, we're at a 404: literal inferiority not found situation.


*I know quite a few that have done field survival courses/SERE/etc.
 
Last edited:
Quiet said:
Also, I'll take a 20CV blade over an S30v blade all day long, and twice on Sunday. So, we're at a 404: literal inferiority not found situation.
Click to expand...
While we are making points of why the old 301 is inferior to this new knife, you forgot the big fat elephant in the room: speed safe. If that torsion bar goes, the knife blade will not stay closed in the handle on its own. That seems like a big problem for an infantry soldier in a hard use survival situation!

One of the 301s I had, the previous owner had a closing detent added so the knife could be safely deassisted. This made the knife one million times better. I've got a scientific back ground so you can trust that. Only reason I sold that knife was because I could not get past the fact it was designed by a stollen valor scumbag. Hey! Another clear advantage this new knife has over the old!
 
I have one ZT (0700?)that I bought around 10 years ago. I really like it.
I definitely prefer Kershaw. The Chinese ones make good gifts/barter.
I typically buy any US Kershaw that is about the same size, and quality level as the Blur. During slow years I can always buy different variations of the Launch, or the iconic Blur or Leek (series).

th
 
craytab said:
While we are making points of why the old 301 is inferior to this new knife, you forgot the big fat elephant in the room: speed safe. If that torsion bar goes, the knife blade will not stay closed in the handle on its own. That seems like a big problem for an infantry soldier in a hard use survival situation!

One of the 301s I had, the previous owner had a closing detent added so the knife could be safely deassisted. This made the knife one million times better. I've got a scientific back ground so you can trust that. Only reason I sold that knife was because I could not get past the fact it was designed by a stollen valor scumbag. Hey! Another clear advantage this new knife has over the old!
Click to expand...

Oooohh, that's RIGHT. Good call. Anything Mogadishu Mick has had a hand in, I want no part of. I'd have sold it too.
 
stonproject said:
In regards to the new balisong

  • Blade: 4.6 in. (11.7 cm)
  • Closed: 5.8 in. (15 cm)
  • Overall: 10.25 in. (26 cm)
  • Weight: 5.9 oz. (168 g)
A little heavy but man this is going to be sweet. I caught this in their description too
"the blade tapers so that the top has more weight to pendulum around smoothly".

They seemed to have put a lot of thought into this one. I haven't gotten excited about very many of Kershaws offerings in the last few years but this I'm definitely picking up.
Click to expand...

I'm always in the mkt for another bali at a "reasonable price" and I'm in on the Lucha as soon as it's actually in stock and available for sale from retailers and before it's discontinued for "lack of interest." Retail on BHQ is $119.95 which is about what I paid for a Kimura-Bradley. $5 pre-order deposits now being taken but I'll wait.

On the other hand, the ZT0308 doesn't do much for me.
 
the claims that the thumb stud/stop pin will make a stronger lockup that has any reasonable impact on the knifes performance than an internal stop pin is a claim I would love to see you prove in a quantifiable manner. Even if there is any measurable, repeatable difference in strength and integrity, the point at where it makes a difference is likely so far past the possible POU for the knife it would make no real world difference.

I don't care if people don't like the knife, but the claims that the design changes make their structural integrity less than its predecessors is absurdly laughable (especially before they even have one in hand)...its the same kind of silly nonsense crap people have been slinging for a few years now. Personal gripes about design queues they don't like. That's great...luckily ZT does their own thing, and it seems to be doing well enough they continue to prosper in the current marketplace, and frankly I hope they continue the pace they are on. I'd love to see more American made blades, and so should everyone else here.

Personally I think Benchmade's products for the past few years are nothing but recycled dressed up versions of their already overpriced knives...but I don't have the time or the mindset to go all around the forum crapping on the brand for no good reason and admonishing those that are excited about the designs....best of luck to those of you that do...I'm out on this one:-)
 
Am a licensed professional mechanical engineer, do not care one way or the other about external thumb studs vs. a solid internal pin. Both systems can be made more than strong enough for anything you could do to it. External stop pins in the blade also come with the risk of weakening the blade due to the addition of a hole with a press-fitted stud in it (one which isn't necessarily any larger or with more contact surface on the blade and handles than an internal pin), not to mention the more realistic issue of typically putting the stud into the cutting path of the blade. I've never seen a knife handle with a properly implemented internal stop pin experience shear/bearing failure at the stop pin location, but I have seen blades with external stop pins crack. YMMV.

I will say that I would love the 0308 if it had washers, and would even consider replacing my 0301 with it if they made that change. I quite like this new model but I'm not very happy with ZT's implementation of steel bearings. I'd love to see them make a flipper with washers like the 0200 again.
 
craytab said:
But they are going to carry a $300 high end folder?
Click to expand...

I wanted to say the same thing but was afraid someone would jump all over me with a bunch of "Well I knew a guy who..." or "I'm _____ and I carry..." nonsense. I don't know a single LEO or enlisted soldier that carries a knife that costs much more than $50-$100. Most are much more concerned with getting the bills paid because they don't make nearly enough to blow $300 on a single folder, let alone have a collection of them. If the people who would carry a knife as a tactical knife can't afford it, then is it still a tactical knife or has it become something else?

On top of that, if the bearings fill with sand or mud, the grip is too slippery to use, it has a bunch of springs to break, and it is hard to clean the gunk out of then is it really so great for a tactical role? When you have a bunch of gear to care for and firearms to maintain there's not time to disassemble and carefully clean a complicated folder, especially in the field where you're going to lose parts and most likely not want to keep track of a torx set. I think simplicity, good build quality, and low cost are the main reasons why the Skyline has seen so much success even though it's a light duty tool.
 
Quiet said:
Oooohh, that's RIGHT. Good call. Anything Mogadishu Mick has had a hand in, I want no part of. I'd have sold it too.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't sell it. I just put my tiger strip stuff on a shelf so they never see the light of day. Maybe ZT will grow a consisence and recall them now that the truth around that partner is in the clear.
 
stonproject said:
In regards to the new balisong

  • Blade: 4.6 in. (11.7 cm)
  • Closed: 5.8 in. (15 cm)
  • Overall: 10.25 in. (26 cm)
  • Weight: 5.9 oz. (168 g)
A little heavy but man this is going to be sweet. I caught this in their description too
"the blade tapers so that the top has more weight to pendulum around smoothly".

They seemed to have put a lot of thought into this one. I haven't gotten excited about very many of Kershaws offerings in the last few years but this I'm definitely picking up.
Click to expand...

I like it too, I just wonder if skeletonizing the blade that close to the pivot areas will be an issue. I think I would have preferred that remain solid. I'm sure they've tested it, did it to get good balance and they're marketing it as a flipper more than a user but I can't help but wonder if maybe it's just a bit weak around there. The cutout to the rear doesn't bother me, the side cutouts do but not as much as the big diamond in the front. I have visions of it breaking although it might be solid as a rock in all honesty.

reYv5Ph.jpg
 
JJHollowman said:
I like it too, I just wonder if skeletonizing the blade that close to the pivot areas will be an issue. I think I would have preferred that remain solid. I'm sure they've tested it, did it to get good balance and they're marketing it as a flipper more than a user but I can't help but wonder if maybe it's just a bit weak around there. The cutout to the rear doesn't bother me, the side cutouts do but not as much as the big diamond in the front. I have visions of it breaking although it might be solid as a rock in all honesty.

reYv5Ph.jpg
Click to expand...

I find it unlikely to be an issue except for maybe if it's dropped on concrete repeatedly, but thats just my hunch.
 
goldie said:
Kershaw has turned into a budget knife company; and that new ZT is going to be around 300.00 not worth it,nothing special about it.Bring back the old days of the bumps,speedform, the offset and their other great U.S. made knives.
Click to expand...

I've been a Kershaw fan since the 1990s. Have they ever not been a "budget knife company"? I've always seen Kershaw as the "budget knife" side of KAI, with ZT representing their premium side. That said, Kershaw itself runs the gamut from super-cheap Walmart knives in junk steels like 3Cr13 all the way up to premium versions of the Leek, Dividend, etc.
 
Not feeling this at all. I’m sure many will dig it though. More choices always a good thing.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top