Kershaw Cadre

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I would like to hear from the members on your thoughts with moving forward with the Art/Performance category.

To be clear, we are not producing the Cadre.

Wondering more about a production/art category. Does it make sense?

Not chisel ground. Sculpted on both sides. :)

As to the safe queen, I've pondered on that, and have wondered if that is a negative. There a plenty of folks around here that can't bring themselves to use a $150 knife.



I'd think most of these type knives would be $300 - $400

Here was the original thread:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=560926&highlight=cadre

Now trying to get this thread back on track.
It's about discovering the possibilities in the factory, and bringing a blade/knife into places that haven't been explored before. Like with any art, personal tastes will apply, but the idea here was push a piece to the limit. This was by far the most difficult knife we have ever produced.

Hello Thomas. I'm not yet ready at this time to explore the realm of odd looking (Art Category) knives. I'm doubtful that I ever will be. It's just not my thing.

Frank

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Either way, what about taking knife inlays to the seemingly next level, and putting them in the blade? Fill those holes with carbon fiber, or G10, or ceramics, or titanium, 440a, glass, epoxy, mammoth tooth, etc.! I've no idea what's really plausible in that regard. But I think it's not too far fetched... Warren Thomas has made knives with Titanium and carbon fiber/G10 blades, so I don't see why Kershaw couldn't.

Take the Cadre, put a convex edge on it twice as wide, fill the blade sections with carbon fiber. :thumbup:
 
Handle looks nice, would look nicer without the big bulging finger groove. Hate the holes in the blade. I think it would be pleasing to the eye without those two things.

And it's an art knife because of the ground out blade and the blue handle? and that justifies $300-400? Doesn't compete in that range imho
 
Hello Thomas. I'm not yet ready at this time to explore the realm of odd looking (Art Category) knives. I'm doubtful that I ever will be. It's just not my thing.

Frank

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Appreciate you keeping on track with the thread Fred. :thumbup:

How about if you look outside yourself and what you personally like. You've been around here long enough, could there be success with this category?
 
Hey Thomas,

From what I see people saying around here and at gun/knife shows and what not I really don't think there's a huge market for production art knives in this price range. I think most consumers of this genre will go custom if looking for a one hand knife with artistic flair. However thats not to say that it would be a failed venture. There are a lot of artsy production companies that seem to be doing fairly well like William Henry, Klotzli, Mcusta... I know that it has a lot to do with personal taste and I cannot talk for others in that regard but when I look to buy a fancy knife I look more for exotic materials and finishes. Possibly using more natural materials like nice cuts of wood, different jigged bones, sculpted carbon fiber, stag... Another person brought this up but I would love to see you guys do a "gold class" similar to Benchmade. Where you take a standard production model and take it to the next level in materials and worksmanship. Yes you guys do have very good fit and finish for your price point, better than most American knife manufacturers IMO but I like nothing more than a nice hand rubbed blade, polished liners that are flush with the scales, titanium slabs that are sanded before bead blasting to get rid of machining marks... I think the true knife afficianados appreciate these smaller details than an aggressively machined blade or handle. Again I can't speak for others on this but it seems to be what gets the most attention around here. Also I don't know if this would even be possible or makes sense for Kershaw as a company.

Just imagine though, a JYD II with titanium bolsters and snakewood scales. The outside surfaces of the bolsters bead blasted with the edges of the liners satined or anodized. Then a blade that is first polished and then tumbled to have a shiny stonewash finish reminiscent of whats found on a CRK or Hinderer.

Of course theres nothing wrong with the way your making knives now. The percentage of knives in my "collection" that are Kai branded can attest to that, but if you're wanting to branch out into higher end fancier knives this would be the way I'd love to see you do it.
 
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it looks like a kershaw. However a much less useful kershaw with a thick blade, and obtuse saber grind, leading to something that is what I call the Zack of all trades. Basically it's bad at everything equally, unless you're talking conversation piece.
 
I don't think there's a huge appeal for 'art' knives each available to a couple hundred people. Material variations work well in more exotic steels, carbon fiber, anodizing colors, etc, but sculptured stuff seems to be picked more for being 'one-off' in nature. For 3-400 dollars, more utilitarian designs are leading the way in recommendation (Chris Reeve, Hinderer ordered direct, etc). Add to the price, and the bling comes back into play, but again in limited numbers and to another segment. BM gold class, WH, etc use damascus and some precious metals to be called 'art', but the designs are the same as the less expensive runs. I don't even know what to call an art knife, since some say all knives are art, others say all knives are tools (I guess even Warenskis), and more opinions in between. To me, an 'art' knife is something very difficult to produce dimensionally, not just more expensive base materials.

Just speaking for myself, I would only be interested in a "sculpted" piece at about 5 times the mentioned price to start, and don't foresee myself actually doing it. Just saying, an art knife for me would have to very clearly be an investment, and thereby also much more limited than sprint runs of simply steel or handle color variants.

To comment on the Cadre in particular, the machining in the blade would be a hassle for cleaning. The price is still at a point where I would have to clean the blade because it would be a user and not an investment piece. So that sort of design element doesn't appeal to me in a using knife, and a 200 piece run doesn't pull me in due to exclusivity. 50 pieces, maybe. But this is just my feeling when these numbers come up. Put up a different knife and maybe my mind changes on the numbers.
 
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300-400$ Art knives? Definitely not my cup of tea, I'm afraid.

I prefer my knives to be practical users than works of art - looks, elaborate design features, and ornate decorations are entirely secondary concerns for me.
 
Whoa, this is impressive! Of course I realize that - from a functional point of view - the sculpted blade is not that handy as a classic one, but I still like the knife.
Congratulations to all the fine engineers and machinists who were involved in this project and thanks for the eye candy.
 
Seems like the cadre wasn't the best way to approach the subject. Seems like people associate their negative opinion of the particular knife with the idea.Instead of realizing the potential for the new designs. I think the Echelon is a good example of the out of the box thinking capable. Then add top notch materials to an appealing design and I think people will go for it.

Just because a knife is creative in design, doesn't mean it is going to be impractical.
 
For $300-400, it's going to be directly compared to other knives in the price range. Not art knives, but knife knives. The "knife" aspect would need to be comparable to these and not compromised for the sake of the "art" aspect. If it could do that, the "art" aspect could be a reason to get the fancy Kershaw instead. A large part of the competition is decidedly rather ...plain.

It might also do better in a new KAI knife line/brand. Among the criticism (however unfairly) of AG's Acies was that it was "just a Kershaw". A new line could better emphasize that these knives are truly special.

The whole integrated bolster/scale thing is really fantastic, btw.
 
interesting concept, awkward execution. The handle is nice but the blade seems bland. Almost looks like a trainer blade that someone put an edge on. Maybe it would look better in damascus but only etch the milled out areas, or vice versa ?
 
I think that there could be great success with such a category. The Buck Custom Shop has been putting out premium artistic renditions of their knives for quite some time now, and I see the art/performance category as the next logical step. William Henry Studios and Chris Reeve are somewhat in that realm presently, but there's presently a LOT of elbow room in that sector of the market. Kershaw could bring some really unique things to the market that no one else would even dream of, so why not tap in?
 
you want ppl's opinion and that's just mine. you can't expect the whole world all like your design!:thumbdn:

Start at the beginning and read. The thread wasn't about the knife. Thomas said in the original post

"I would like to hear from the members on your thoughts with moving forward with the Art/Performance category."

That's what this thread was about. Trying reading the whole thread before posting and you'll make out much better.
 
I'm not an art knife type guy. That said I think there's a market for these type knives if the price/materials/function and rarity ( size of run?) make it a winning combination. To be honest, I doubt if it would be worth Kershaws time and effort.

As much as I like S110V steel, for instance, I wouldn't buy that knife. A couple of features, and quite probably price take it out of the "must have" category that a regular Kershaw in S110V would automaticly default to.

I know that knife is not for sale, but it is the best example we have to discuss right now.

Also, remember the economy right now. IMO, all new releases should be pragmatic, and value oriented. This, along with the best W&R is what put Kershaw where it is in the market.

No disrespect towards the engineering and design staff at Kershaw for what is an amazing knife BTW.

regards, Joe/raleigh
 
Start at the beginning and read. The thread wasn't about the knife. Thomas said in the original post

"I would like to hear from the members on your thoughts with moving forward with the Art/Performance category."

That's what this thread was about. Trying reading the whole thread before posting and you'll make out much better.

Like with any art, personal tastes will apply, but the idea here was push a piece to the limit. This was by far the most difficult knife we have ever produced. We would have made a couple of hundred of these.

Ti Frame Lock
CPM-110V Steel w/Blade Sculpturing

I would like to hear from the members on your thoughts with moving forward with the Art/Performance category.

A few images for your viewing pleasure.

1st of all, I want to clear out that Kershaw is always my No.1 favorite knife brand, I think it's always good to "push a piece to the limit" but like Thomas said "like with any art, personal tastes will aply", and that's just mine personal taste about this knife. I read almost everybody's reply in this thread, I think 90% replies mentioned about personal opinions about this specific knife, I don't think I was off topic...

If he said that only ppl who like this knife can reply, then I'd be quite and delete all my posts. But anyway, lets just focus on the knife, I think I'm going stupid and off topic now:yawn: I'll just shut up and watch:p
 
you want ppl's opinion and that's just mine. you can't expect the whole world all like your design!:thumbdn:
You, (and a few others), missed the point of the thread, and apparently still are. It wasn't about whether you liked the Cadre design.

It's cool though, I think I have all the input needed.

Thanks everyone.
 
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