Khukri VS Hawk chop off - Picture Heavy

Vec I gotta disagree on this one.

My M-43 kukri weighs 27 ounces sans sheath.

I have carried it over extended distances in very rugged terrain and conditions, and had to then press it into use to build shelters, chop wood etc. It is not only a rested soldiers tool. While some kukri's may qualify as such (a few of the larger Ang Kholas etc.) most do not.

The M-43's edge is thinner than some other kukri's. It has addedd drop to the blade and the handle which increases its chopping performance as well as it's tip speed. This results in exceptional cutting performance. Equals less work for me. It also greatly improves the blades handling characteristics providing an exceptionaly live and agile blade in use (including combative use). It is in its own breed unlike any other kuk I've used.

I have seen mine outperform axes in experienced hands. And when I've compared it to a hawk the hawk didn't even come close.

I love em both Hawk and Kuk. But the M-43 wins out and is my choice in the woods most the time.
 
Here's a type of M43:
100_0123.jpg
 
wildmike said:
Vec I gotta disagree on this one.

My M-43 kukri weighs 27 ounces sans sheath.

........
Click to expand...

okay, that's a 27 inch proper hawk (observing the ounce per inch principle). - you have a 27 inch hawk that werighs 27 ounces?

if you include the mass of your carry system, one could probably bring a Forest Axe for that weight.

i'll believe it when i see it. - and i think i've seen an M-43 in action.

let's see it.

vec
 
Wonder if the modern designed RTAK 2 ,and other type of this design , would do in this copper contest, against the Kukri, and hawks?
 
Wonder if the modern designed RTAK 2 ,and other type of this design , would do in this copper contest, against the Kukri, and hawks?
 
SLOW2RUN said:
Wonder if the modern designed RTAK 2 ,and other type of this design , would do in this copper contest, against the Kukri, and hawks?
Click to expand...

i had an original RTAK, which was probably better than the following designs(?) because of livesays famous handle finishes, etc.

i loved the knife, but that's what it was; a knife.

not a chopper.


it was a great foraging knife - if it was all that i had, especially in a snow or jungle situation, i'd be pretty happy.

vec
 
vector001 said:
no offense meant - but your hawking skills apparently need some review, given the photos here - all those pictures show the hawks hitting low on the bit - a proper strike will be on the top 3/4" of the bit. - the worn spot pon a good hawk usually shows that it only needs a 1" bit.

you haven't generated any power to speak of, when the hawk meets the wood that low.

the handle should be leaning into the strike.

yours are leaning away from it.


a good hawk is like a flying chisel on a string. - these tests don't really tell me anything, to be honest and candid. - how deep can a saw chop after all? LOL.

it's immaterial.

irrelevent.


the two tools compared, hawks and khukris, work differently, is what i am suggesting; you should be pecking with that hawk - you can work all day that way, and you will likely beat the khukri in extended tasks that way.


try the test again please, with that later strike in mind, and see what your penetration does.


there is no disputing that khukris will do well against a proper hawk in the sense of one chop, when you are rested, ...but add travel energy lost, and the length of the task, and you will see a proper hawk beat the khukri. we've proven that already in the early days of the humble Hawk Project.

- go build an advanced shelter after trekking 10 miles, and let's see what ya think.

i want a refugee's tool, not a rested soldier's.

these are just my tastes, based on what i do - travelling light and fast, with low energy expenditure.


so there are some real objectives, for real tool-dependent users IMHO;

1) use the hawks correctly - strike higher on the bit. - you should see a marked difference in results - clsoer to the khukri, but not surpassing it, i reckon.

2) travel on foot with both types of tools, at an extended distance.

3) make an advanced shelter that requires alot of work, not just one or two logs.

real survival is what i am interested in in my tools' uses...;


if someone just loves to chop, brother wild's existing tests are great IMHO.

....but if you want a real idea of how these tools act in the field, you need to use them during a state of personal hardship, when 90% of the energy that you put in your tool is just carrying it.


again, i think the khukris are especially good to have in ones tools and i don't want to seem like i am knocking them - i just want to draw attention to the fact that a hawk is not used the same way as a khukri or an axe or hatchet is, despite its appearances - not if you want to use it efficiently.

thanks for this great work, brother wildmanh - your work on this contributes greatly to the quality of this forum and this community.

press on, brother.

vec
Click to expand...

Hi Vec, Thank you for your input. Some of the information you provided is exactly what I've been looking for. BTW This test was very usefull, you told me how to hit properly, so all was not lost. :thumbup:

I went to Nebo Friday afternoon as planned but instead of doing any testing, we loafed around, ate good food and did some walks and hikes. In the next few days I'll take what I've learned from you and others in this thread and chop the log.

By the way, one friend used my French hawk and Pole hawk to gather fire wood and after wards he liked the French hawk better. I think Both hawks could benefit from longer handles.

Heber
 
wildmanh said:
Hi Vec, Thank you for your input. Some of the information you provided is exactly what I've been looking for. BTW This test was very usefull, you told me how to hit properly, so all was not lost. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

:cool::thumbup:

i think your original test was a good one, brother - i just saw some things i thought would improve it.



I went to Nebo Friday afternoon as planned but instead of doing any testing, we loafed around, ate good food and did some walks and hikes.
Click to expand...

i applaud that!

nothing better than paying attention to folks who matter in your life, and having some fun.

In the next few days I'll take what I've learned from you and others in this thread and chop the log.

By the way, one friend used my French hawk and Pole hawk to gather fire wood and after wards he liked the French hawk better. I think Both hawks could benefit from longer handles.

Heber
Click to expand...

did you mean that trade axe-looking thing, brother?

i always think of French Axes as those fluid-looking heads.
example:
fs-167.jpg


i really love the Frenchies too. - the Fast Axe 2 is kind of like a streamlined version of those, when i put a haft on them.

i think of most French Axes as kind of a hybrid between an axe and a khukri, because of their neat weight displacement characteristics.

vec
 
vector001 said:
:cool::thumbup:

i think your original test was a good one, brother - i just saw some things i thought would improve it.

i applaud that!

nothing better than paying attention to folks who matter in your life, and having some fun.

did you mean that trade axe-looking thing, brother?

i always think of French Axes as those fluid-looking heads.
example:
fs-167.jpg


i really love the Frenchies too. - the Fast Axe 2 is kind of like a streamlined version of those, when i put a haft on them.

i think of most French Axes as kind of a hybrid between an axe and a khukri, because of their neat weight displacement characteristics.

vec
Click to expand...

Vec, I'm glad I spent more time doing stuff with friends instead of testing over the weekend. My friend Lyndsie was planning to go up Mount Nebo with me in College back in 2001 but broke her anckle a week before we went. So Friday after almost 9 years she finally got to see what all the hubub was about.

Yeah, I was talking about the Trade axe/hawk. Great River forge calls it a French trading hawk so I call it a French for short. Sold my custom Pole hawk yesterday to help pay some college expences. But I'm keeping the other one and after college is paid for I'll probably get a 30" haft for it and cut it down to the size I want. I bet a 24" or so haft on that 16.5oz head (trading hawk) would be awesome. What do you think?

By the way, I've applied to go to school at Snow College in Ephraim. Campus is 5 to 7 blocks away from a Wildlife/recreational area and the national forest is a 15 minute drive south eath. Will be surrounded by mountains and hills to play in. My hawk and Khukri will get some more good work outs. I'm from Ephraim, so I know where to go to have tons of fun! So if I don't get any more practice in the next 2 months, it's okay cause I'll get tons starting in August.

Heber
 
wildmanh said:
Vec, I'm glad I spent more time doing stuff with friends instead of testing over the weekend. My friend Lyndsie was planning to go up Mount Nebo with me in College back in 2001 but broke her anckle a week before we went. So Friday after almost 9 years she finally got to see what all the hubub was about.

Yeah, I was talking about the Trade axe/hawk. Great River forge calls it a French trading hawk so I call it a French for short. Sold my custom Pole hawk yesterday to help pay some college expences. But I'm keeping the other one and after college is paid for I'll probably get a 30" haft for it and cut it down to the size I want. I bet a 24" or so haft on that 16.5oz head (trading hawk) would be awesome. What do you think?
Click to expand...


sounds like an awesoome hawk.

i made the Daisy Cutter head about that same weight, to keep it hawk-like, but move it up to a bit more axe-like punch and utility.

that axe/hawk oughtta turn out great for you.

pity about the pole hawk - how long was it?

By the way, I've applied to go to school at Snow College in Ephraim. Campus is 5 to 7 blocks away from a Wildlife/recreational area and the national forest is a 15 minute drive south eath. Will be surrounded by mountains and hills to play in. My hawk and Khukri will get some more good work outs. I'm from Ephraim, so I know where to go to have tons of fun! So if I don't get any more practice in the next 2 months, it's okay cause I'll get tons starting in August.

Heber
Click to expand...

you suck - i love it up there. :cool::thumbup:

- i am going up to see my people in the Black Hills late this summer, and I always try to mill around in the Bear Lake area - my travel pattern is like a laser until i hit Utah - then i go into Drunken Fly Pattern, and i am out visiting and getting dirty for the entire state, then another bee-line to the Dakotas after my last high-5 to my brethren in the Snowy Range - LOL.

vec
 
vector001 said:
sounds like an awesoome hawk.

i made the Daisy Cutter head about that same weight, to keep it hawk-like, but move it up to a bit more axe-like punch and utility.

that axe/hawk oughtta turn out great for you.

pity about the pole hawk - how long was it?

Handle on the Pole hawk is 19" Long. The French Trading hawk has an 18" handle but just feels like it needs a longer one.

you suck - i love it up there. :cool::thumbup:

- i am going up to see my people in the Black Hills late this summer, and I always try to mill around in the Bear Lake area - my travel pattern is like a laser until i hit Utah - then i go into Drunken Fly Pattern, and i am out visiting and getting dirty for the entire state, then another bee-line to the Dakotas after my last high-5 to my brethren in the Snowy Range - LOL.

vec
Click to expand...

The Wildlife area North East of Ephraim is called the Black Hills. There aren't many tree's but the trails around the hills make it worth spending time up there.

Bear Lake is cool. Went there once in the late 90's for a family reunion. Would love to go back for a visit one of these days. If you come to Central Utah, I'd love to give you a tour of some great places to go backpacking, rock climbing, Mountain biking and fishing.

There's a campsite and fishing hole up Ephraim canyon. Hoping to spend a bunch of time up there hiking the trails and fishing the pond.

Back on topic for a bit, how long of a handle would you put on a hawk that has a 16.5oz head?

Heber
 
lot of folks got alot to say with no pics of they're test wildmanh keep on testin and make those folks with all the advice bringforth an example of how they think it sould be done,if they can.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top