- Joined
- May 2, 2004
- Messages
- 6,848
-
The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
Knife Design using the Golden ratio.
- Thread starter Fred.Rowe
- Start date
Mike.
The great thing about 'The Knife' is that being the oldest of tools, it's history encompasses both great aesthetic opportunities as well as great functional ones. There is no such thing as an ideal knife. In my rather recent and rudimentary interest in blades as tools, I noticed that the Scandis often have very anthropometric proportions vis a vis blade length VS handle length. Japanese blades seem to have proportions that reflect similar sensibilites. These should be good cases to study for functionality as neither culture has delved too deeply into the aesthetics.
One of the 'problems' of modern marketing is that it's often the aesthetics that sell the product.
Therefore, for users... you must handle the product prior to buying it
For collectors, that plain doesn't matter.
I just met a giy yesterday that showed me a but ugly blade he fashioned from some scrap steel. I played with it and realised that it was one of the functional class!
The great thing about 'The Knife' is that being the oldest of tools, it's history encompasses both great aesthetic opportunities as well as great functional ones. There is no such thing as an ideal knife. In my rather recent and rudimentary interest in blades as tools, I noticed that the Scandis often have very anthropometric proportions vis a vis blade length VS handle length. Japanese blades seem to have proportions that reflect similar sensibilites. These should be good cases to study for functionality as neither culture has delved too deeply into the aesthetics.
One of the 'problems' of modern marketing is that it's often the aesthetics that sell the product.
Therefore, for users... you must handle the product prior to buying it
For collectors, that plain doesn't matter.
I just met a giy yesterday that showed me a but ugly blade he fashioned from some scrap steel. I played with it and realised that it was one of the functional class!
The golden ratio is a lovely thing. It has been pointed out to me several times when working on armour. Since that has to fit the body, and there are many instances of the golden ratio on our bodies, such as our fingertips to out wrist. each bone increases by that amount.
One other helpful formula to use for knifemaking is the Fibonnacci sequence.
1,1,2,3,5,8,13,21,34,55,89,144.....
Each number is the sum of the two previous numbers. If you take any two numbers out of that sequence, you will have a pleasing ratio, one that is very close to the golden ratio. Not all of them work for knives(as Mlovett pointed out earlier 3 and 5) but many of them will.
If you use millimeters instead of inches, some of the higher numbers work out quite well.
One other helpful formula to use for knifemaking is the Fibonnacci sequence.
1,1,2,3,5,8,13,21,34,55,89,144.....
Each number is the sum of the two previous numbers. If you take any two numbers out of that sequence, you will have a pleasing ratio, one that is very close to the golden ratio. Not all of them work for knives(as Mlovett pointed out earlier 3 and 5) but many of them will.
If you use millimeters instead of inches, some of the higher numbers work out quite well.
Mmm... here's my counterpoint.
I wrote my thesis on the visual perception and cognition of the rule of thirds.
When I design VISUALLY, I utilize the rule of thirds and golden section.
When I design TOOLS, I design for ergonomics and function.
For the most part, I will use the following principles when designing a folder:
- Blade length: As close as possible to one of the major legal markers without surpassing it: 4.0", 3.5", 3.0", 2.5", depending on the purpose.
- Handle length: Just enough to hide the blade for a long blade, or just enough to have a comfortable 3-finger or full-5-finger grip on the handle.
- Handle swells/curves: Enough to be comfortable, but not so much that the handle isn't generic enough to fit the majority of hands and users.
- Blade height: Enough to provide a sharp point and a high grind.
- Handle height: Enough to hide the edge, provide sufficient lockbar mate face leverage, clearance for a backspacer and stop pin, and yet have a decent amount of relief for an 'integral' front guard.
For the most part, I don't think these guidelines tends to result in compliance with either principle.
I'm not saying golden ratio is a bad thing, or is something to not think about, as it is definitely important to keep in mind.
But I AM saying that I've seen boundless examples of knives that look pretty, flowing, and elegant, but are downright painful to hold, whose blade length is a hair over legal carry in a number of jurisdictions, or compromises lockbar strength for a swooshy handle.
Just my $0.02.
-j
I wrote my thesis on the visual perception and cognition of the rule of thirds.
When I design VISUALLY, I utilize the rule of thirds and golden section.
When I design TOOLS, I design for ergonomics and function.
For the most part, I will use the following principles when designing a folder:
- Blade length: As close as possible to one of the major legal markers without surpassing it: 4.0", 3.5", 3.0", 2.5", depending on the purpose.
- Handle length: Just enough to hide the blade for a long blade, or just enough to have a comfortable 3-finger or full-5-finger grip on the handle.
- Handle swells/curves: Enough to be comfortable, but not so much that the handle isn't generic enough to fit the majority of hands and users.
- Blade height: Enough to provide a sharp point and a high grind.
- Handle height: Enough to hide the edge, provide sufficient lockbar mate face leverage, clearance for a backspacer and stop pin, and yet have a decent amount of relief for an 'integral' front guard.
For the most part, I don't think these guidelines tends to result in compliance with either principle.
I'm not saying golden ratio is a bad thing, or is something to not think about, as it is definitely important to keep in mind.
But I AM saying that I've seen boundless examples of knives that look pretty, flowing, and elegant, but are downright painful to hold, whose blade length is a hair over legal carry in a number of jurisdictions, or compromises lockbar strength for a swooshy handle.
Just my $0.02.
-j
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2004
- Messages
- 678
Some Bird & trout knives,some Scandi knives have more handle than blade and look pleasing, Is that just the proportion reversed? 1.62 handle to 1 blade? I am not disagreeing with this post by the way just wondering. I really
like the "look" of some Bird & Trout knives, maybe this proportion is why?!?
like the "look" of some Bird & Trout knives, maybe this proportion is why?!?