Knife for automobile accidents

G

Gabe Newell

Joined
Jan 6, 2003
Messages
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Today while driving along the Long Beach peninsula, I saw a large wave pass over the roadway. This was ... odd to say the least as there was no body of water for a couple of hundred yards of any significance, and it was a sunny day.

As I slowed, one of the passengers in the car with me said "oh, my god". The wave that had gone over the road was caused by a car flipping off the road at about 50 mph and into a drainage ditch.

We were on the scene in about 10 seconds, and the car was wedged into the ditch, upside down, filling with water.

One passenger called 911 as I and the other passenger jumped out. When we got to the car, we could see the car was half full of water, and the air inside was filled with smoke.

Much to our surprise, there was a response to our shouts, and the single passenger, Louise, said she thought she was OK, but she was worried for her cat (Sam). We could see her hand, half-in and half-out of the water pressed up against the rear driver-side window, which was the only window not buried in the mud or water.

Wisely or not, we decided we needed to get the window open to see if we could get Louise out, and also get some breathable air into the passenger compartment. My friend tried hammering on the window with the butt end of his knife (Boker 89) to no avail. He then tried hammering it with a plastic coated steering wheel anti-theft device another driver handed us. It wasn't until we took the device apart and I climbed down into the ditch to get better leverage that we were able to smash the window. Smoke poured out, and I was able to reach in and shake Louise's hand and tell her that we were going to take care of her (one of the odd things was that everybody was being quite polite or as polite as you can be upside down in a drainage ditch, and there were no histrionics on anyone's part).

We got Sam out, and had started to take her car seat apart to get at her from the rear passenger area when the volunteer fire department showed up. Louise was extracted and walked herself to the waiting gurney, and I shook her hand again before she was whisked off to the hospital.

I still feel like the whole episode was vaguely unreal, starting with the surreal "tidal wave" crashing over the road. Talking about it with the other two as we finished the rest of our drive helped quite a bit. We thought we had done OK, although in retrospect a) we were worried that smashing the window might have spread a fire if there had been one in the passenger compartment, and b) I had gotten cut up and down my arm by metal and glass as we had tried to get into the vehicle before the real emergency people showed up, and it probably wouldn't have made any difference if we had simply waited until they got there.

One thing that did occur to both myself and the passenger with the Boker was "there must have been a better set of tools we should have had with us for this kind of problem."

I started looking on Google for "window breaker" and saw some stand-alone units:

OMB Police Window Breaker

and also some knives, such as:

Masters of Defense CQD Mark 1

Then I realized that I could probably get much better suggestions from the people at BladeForum than I'd be able to come up with on my own.

So, any thoughts on what we did right and wrong, and any suggestions on a knife or tool set to store in your car in the (hopefully unlikely) event that we are first on the scene of this type of accident in the future?

Also, if this isn't the right place for this thread, please let me know where it should go.

Gabe
 
Just my kind of question

Try the following

"life hammer"

I would also recommend Smith and Wesson's rescue tool, not sure of the exact name. It comes with a spring loaded window punch and a seat belt knife.

Alot of us are awaiting the new Spyderco called "The Assist" same idea as the Smith and Wesson.

I have never tried a window punch on a rear window or windsheild, but I know they work well on side windows which includes transit buses.
 
Most hardware stores carry spring loaded center punches for less than $10, cheap enough to keep one in all your vehicles and emergency kits.
 
I keep a Life Hammer knockoff in my car for emergencies. The lifehammer is like $49 and this knockoff I bought from Galls and it is practically identical but costs $10. Here is the link to that.

I also found this on the Galls website which may be useful as well.

Did you ever find out what caused the car to crash?

Pascal.
 
You might be able to get Meyerco's old Rescue knife if you get it direct from Meyerco. I got one for my wife's car and mine. Blunt point serrated blade and a glass-breaker tip on one end of the knife. Pocket clip.

This little thing works.
 
An 18 or 20 inch OAL khukri with a 1/2 inch or greater thickness spine can crack glass with the spine, penetrate laminated glass, and even pry and cut thru sheetmetal. It can clear fallen trees blocking roads, dig out rocks and dirt. I'm not advocating hauling one around on your belt. Keep one in a emergency kit in the truck or car trunk.

But I'm also telling you there are worse tools to keep on your belt that a khukuri with a heavy 8 inch blade ( 12 inches overall ), or even a light 15" OAL.
 
I might be able to offer a little insight to this, seeing this is what I do for a living. I highly recommend the pen style window punch like the OMB. It is very compact, easy to carry in a pocket, and works great. I would also recommend the Life Hammer for personal carry in your car. Not only does it function as a hammer for breaking glass, it also has a seatbelt cutter. Most of these styles have a mounting bracket to attach it inside your car so it will be readily available. Just don't make the mistake that a lot of people do by installing it between the driver's seat and door. This little area is very commonly crushed in accidents, making it impossible to get to the hammer. As far as you opening the window, concerned about fire spreading, you need to realize that a car isn't perfectly sealed, and allows plenty of air to feed a fire whether or not the window is open. As far as the smoke that you saw, most likely it was from the air bag. When it fires, it will usually fill the passenger compartment with some smoke and powder. People often mistake this as being their car on fire. Glad nobody was hurt in that wreck. Sounds like the lady had her seatbelt on because unrestrained passengers are very commonly ejected in rollover accidents. Good job on doing what you did, even if it might not have made a difference in that particular situation.

Mike
 
Where would you recommend keeping the Life Hammer in a car so it is accessible in an emergency? Also, can those spring loaded window punches break skin if held up to a person ? - Maybe I'm overly paranoid but I'd be concerned that it might be regarded by police as some type of out-the-front automatic dagger.
 
Pascal,

As far as the cause, it looked like she just drifted off the side of the road. It was the middle of the day, sunny, a straight road, and no other cars.

We could see where she had first gone off-road as it was a soft shoulder, but there didn't seem to be any skid marks (although I don't know enough how to tell if someone is skidding in muddy grass). There was a small hillock along her route, which is what we thought had flipped her into the ditch.

She didn't seem drunk, and she didn't seem to have any other overt impairments (stroke, heart attack, ...).

Our best guess was that she either simply dozed off, or was otherwise distracted (given her concern for Sam, we liked the idea that she was opening a can of cat food for him).

Gabe
 
Originally posted by AlonzoMosely
Where would you recommend keeping the Life Hammer in a car so it is accessible in an emergency? Also, can those spring loaded window punches break skin if held up to a person ? - Maybe I'm overly paranoid but I'd be concerned that it might be regarded by police as some type of out-the-front automatic dagger.
Click to expand...

The punch sticks out the tip when not in use. It works by pressing the tip against the window, which compresses the powerful internal spring. Once you press it to a certain point, the spring automatically releases something inside it that hammers on the back of the tip. This causes just enough shock to break the glass. The only place it could really damage a person is maybe on the skull. As far as the police are concerned, there isn't a cop out there that won't know what it is, and what it is used for. As far as mounting the hammer, I would recommend anywhere near the center console. That is one of the least damaged areas in a vehicle during a crash.

Mike
 
Yes, the firefighters said the smoke in the vehicle was from the air bag.

I was surprised by two things - the first that there was so much smoke (making it impossible to see into the vehicle until we broke the window), and the second that the smoke from what turned out to be the air bag was so acrid. I had stuck my head down through the window with the idea that I might try crawling into the car to help Louise try to release the driver's seat recliner, but the smoke was irritating enough that I backed off until it started to clear.

As a non-firefighter, I was surprised at how unpleasant even a little smoke can be. I had unconsciously assumed (assumptions that in retrospect seem silly) that it would be like wood smoke, or that, as in the movies, that the smoke could be billowing around me with no negative effect other than causing the occasional cough.
 
The airbag smoke is an irritant to eyes, skin, and lungs. I get so many people who are involved in minor fendor bender accidents complaining about the fact their airbag didn't deploy. They think it was defective because it didn't fire. I tell them to be thankful, because it usually causes a burn on people's arms from friction of the bag inflating, and the powder irritating the skin. I also get people that are in relatively minor accidents who's only injury is from the airbag, be it rub burns on their arms, or people's glasses getting smashed into the bridge of their nose. Also, a lot of people don't realize that airbags are only supposed to go off with a direct frontal impact. So many people get shocked that their airbags don't deploy when they flip their car, get t-boned or get rear-ended. I'm surprised that lady's airbag fired. I suppose that when flipping the car, she had a hard impact to the front end somehow. Maybe she flipped end over end or something.

Mike
 
She was still going really fast when she hit the ditch upside down. That's what I assume triggered her airbag.
 
the airbags of the car deploy when the crash is severe enough...there are sensors in the crash zones of the car...and sometimes airbags do deploy even when there is no frontal collision...there are a few types of airbag sensors and in some accidents the forces act in such a way that it tricks the airbag into opening...

and also, depending on the car there are several airbags in different positions throughout the car...there are side impact airbags as well as passenger airbags...so any of these could be triggered in a collision...

personally i think a car should never be without a small fire extinguisher as well as a life hammer...usually you can mount the lifehammer somewhere on the dashboard and the fire extinguisher somewhere in the foot well...

question for mike...
i was wondering whether it would be useful to have a glass cutter rather than a hammer since the glass cutter will not shatter the glass and will make it safer to enter the car rather than having to go through sharp glass...

hmmm...i would think that for rescue personnel this would be alright but when you're in the car and you want to get out you just need to break the glass....
 
Originally posted by gaben
She was still going really fast when she hit the ditch upside down. That's what I assume triggered her airbag.
Click to expand...

Either way, she would have to have had a direct impact with the front bumper at some point in the roll. The sensors for the airbags are like firing pins that require a certain amount of direct force. I have seen some wrecks that were pretty high impact where somebody is driving along at a good speed and the person in front of them is stopped. Well, for some reason, the person driving wasn't paying attention, then slams on brakes just a bit too late. This causes the nose to dive to a level below the rear bumper of the other car. When impact is made, it is to the very front of the hood of the moving car. This causes the hood to completely buckle, and the car to stop rapidly. This speed would normally fire an airbag, but the bumper that the sensors are behind actually went under the rear of the other car, causing nothing to happen to the firing mechanism. No airbag is going to deploy without hard direct frontal impact of the bumper. That is why I assumed that she either flipped end over end, or hit the ditch hard with the front of her car.

Mike
 
Yes, what Medic1210 said. The side and rear windows are made from tempered glass, and when it shatters it breaks into cubes with the thickness of the glass. That is why when you "punch" the corner the whole window will shatter (the corner is better). The window (machinist center-) punch has a ball bearing inside, when it displaces the punch fires. A screwdriver, or a substantial knife, that is hit by a hammer (again in the corner) will also work. The windshield is made up of 3 layers, glass, plastic, glass. This stuff breaks up into tiny SHARP shards that will hurt you, the windshield usually will have to be cut out (if it can't be avoided). EJ
 
The spring-loaded center punch is a good back-up to a hammer device because there may be situations where a trapped occupant may be constrained and unable to windup for a leveraged swing at the glass with the hammer.

Also, would inexpensive letter openers (the type with a slit and a nested razor blade) work in a pinch to cut seatbelts? I wouldn't want my life depending on a 5-cent novelty item but it seems that alot of people have a few of these laying around and could spare one or two for strategic placement in a car. This is a suggestion for those who refuse to carry a knife and/or are too cheap to buy the right tool that was designed to maybe save their life someday.
 
Good Evening All-

Wouldn't it be easier and cheaper to spraypaint a small crowbar "dayglo" orange or green and affix it to your car interior with very strong Velcro fasteners? To cut seatbelt webbing, you could either use the knife in your pocket....or my suggestion is to secure a lightweight Benchmade Rescue Hook around your rearview mirror. It is always within reach.

A crowbar could easily smash ANY window and could (naturally) be used as a pry if you encountered upon an accident.

Not trying to start a flamewar, just interested if others think this combination might be a good, cost-effective solution.

Regards,

~ Blue Jays ~
 
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