Knife Maintenance in the Field w/out Tools

tueller

tueller

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This is old and a lot of you may have already seen it but I found this clip interesting and figured I would pass it along.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erphOlSzKwY&feature=related

It got me thinking.

First of all, any other ideas on sharpening blades in either the wild or urban setting w/out sharpening tools?

Second, how about we take it a little further? Any ideas on cleaning and lubricating our loved ones w/out our normal cleaning/lubricating agents. For example if I am putting one of my carbon blades through heavy use in the field and don't have break free/ mineral oil/ etc avail, how do I prevent rusting. Is there some miracle plant that works as a good lubricant :)
 
Not really. Any place that there is concrete or rocks or ceramic cups (the very bottom is not usually glazed) or even blacktop or on the edge of some types of glass, there is a place to sharpen. Inmates inside prisons have been doing it for centuries. Not that hard to use the imagination for that. I just figured that with the easy avail & low price of todays modern products, it's really not necessary.

The Fluid Film is made from sheeps wool. Any kind of animal oil or fat would do in a pinch. Heck, even the dipstick from a car would work to lube your blade. Again though, with the easy, small, inexpensive stuff of today, just not necessary. A precision oiler pen can be had for $8 & is shaped like a pen & clips right to your pocket.

I would just strongly prefer to count on being prepared myself rather than looking for a plant or animal that may never be found when you need it, thats all.

Have fun. Hope you get lots of responses.
 
Thanks TwinStick, yes I try to carry/ pack such items but you never know. Things run out, break, fail, get lost, etc. Nice to have a plan B and I feel that this kind of knowledge is power. Thx for the input. I never thought of using animal fat and the bottom of ceramic cups. I thought this post would get more responses. Maybe it would have been better off in the general or outdoors subforums. Or heck maybe my "cool" idea for a post just wasn't that cool after all.
 
When it comes to improvised weapons, i can be a plethora of knowledge. After working in prisons for 24.6 + yrs, you learn a thing or 2. Yes sir, nothing like hearing a weapon being sharpened on the concrete in a quiet cell block, on the midnight shift, & everytime you move, the sound stops, knowing it is for you or your co-workers. Things that can be used are almost unlimited. One of the worst is a chair leg brace. Bent-twisted & removed, they are cut at an angle (like a hypd needle) & then sharpened. Once used, it cuts a perfect hole & acts as a spigot, to drain the blood FAST from the body. If removed, the skin usually comes out with it, leaving a large perfect hole to still drain the blood FAST. Razors melted into toothbrush handles, etc... etc... Only limited by your imagination.
 
And when you have nothing to do all day but sit in a cell using that imagination... I bet you have seen some crazy sh*t.
 
As long as you are not trying to cut paper or shave arm hair, it should not be too challenging to find a rock that will put a usable edge back on a knife. It won't be perfect but if the knife has been worn down far enough to need touched up using a rock/concrete, there are few things that are perfect at that point.

For rust proofing a blade, your skin has oil on it. The sides of your nose have quite a bit. Considering you likely haven't showered regularly or at all, you should have plenty of excess oil to coat the blade and help to prevent corrosion.

As for the modern products, I agree that they are easy to have on you. However, we could find ourselves with only the items we currently have in our pockets to survivie with over the course of a few days. I do not carry a sharpener on me at all times. There is no way I have a bottle of oil on my person. There is usually one nearby but who knows why I need to get away from a situation. Experience from working in a prison is great survival training as many prisoners face death at any time and have to keep constantly aware of their surroundings.
 
If the knife is getting used frequently, that alone will help keep rust at bay. Just focus on keeping it relatively clean & dry as possible (wipe it down frequently). Blades rust a lot more if they sit unused & neglected for too long, especially if they're put away wet/dirty. Assuming one has the means to build a fire, heat some water and wash/rinse the knife in that. Exercise the pivots while washing/rinsing, to flush out grit/dirt from them. Hot water does a great job heating up the internals of a folder and that helps evaporate off moisture from all nooks & crannies.

Knives that are kept clean & dry won't have as much need for special lubrication, either. If it's fairly clean, most anything will do. Personally, if my knife were being exposed to a whole lot of dirt/dust, I wouldn't want much oil in the pivot anyway; it'll just trap & hold more of that dirt.

If I were fortunate enough to foresee one of these 'survival' scenarios possibly developing, I'd think seriously about carrying a fixed blade anyway. :)

As mentioned, in a 'desperate' situation, most any rock or other abrasive surface will suffice for putting a basic working edge on a blade. I'd personally avoid getting caught in a situation like this with a 'supersteel' blade, however. Those will be much tougher to sharpen or repair a damaged edge with a simple 'rock', as the carbides in the steel may be too hard. A simple carbon steel blade (something like 1095) at mid-to-high 50s RC would be ideal, I think, knowing what might be available as a sharpening tool. I've noticed lately, a simple stainless steel like 420HC or 440A seems to respond pretty well to very simple sharpening media, like sandstone.
 
Also, how about something that's not really been mentioned here? A small patch of your belt inside rubbed with BRKT black stropping compound, then vigorously rubbed again with a rag to get off the stuff that would end up on your pants is pretty good for quick touch-ups, and is with you always.
 
Komitadjie said:
Also, how about something that's not really been mentioned here? A small patch of your belt inside rubbed with BRKT black stropping compound, then vigorously rubbed again with a rag to get off the stuff that would end up on your pants is pretty good for quick touch-ups, and is with you always.
Click to expand...

:thumbup:
I've got a 'green patch' on the inside of one of my belts, for that very purpose. :D

Used like a hanging strop, with the belt looped around a tree limb or fence post/rail (or a bed rail, as I usually use mine at home), it works very nicely. It's actually my favorite stropping method for carbon-steel blades and simpler stainless, like 420HC (Case, Buck). They really respond to it.
 
I actually use mine two ways, either as you do like a hanger, or laid flat across a suitable surface like a bench strop. They both work!

I've got a patch of black on one side, and a patch of green on the other. :D Use the black more, though, to be honest. I put 'em both there when I first got the compounds a year and some change ago, and they are both still working without any additional compound additions.
 
Nice, I will have to try that belt trick.

awestib, thx for the heads up. I have some reading to do. FYI, I am a fixed guy myself. I have yet to find anything more reliable than a chunk of quality steel. Even my dogs will die someday :(
 
Komitadjie said:
I actually use mine two ways, either as you do like a hanger, or laid flat across a suitable surface like a bench strop. They both work!

I've got a patch of black on one side, and a patch of green on the other. :D Use the black more, though, to be honest. I put 'em both there when I first got the compounds a year and some change ago, and they are both still working without any additional compound additions.
Click to expand...

Meant to ask you yesterday, but lost track. I was wondering, what steels are you stropping on your belt with the black compound? And at what degree of edge finish (coarse/fine)? I have some black 'stick' compound (Ryobi SiC 'Emery Buffing Compound' @ 1-3 micron, according to the labelling), and have experimented a little bit with it on strops, but sometimes felt it was a bit too aggressive on some of the blades I tried. Pretty easy to over-polish with it, if not being careful. I think I'll re-visit it though, to see if that was a fluke.

Thanks.
 
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Obsessed with Edges said:
Meant to ask you yesterday, but lost track. I was wondering, what steels are you stropping on your belt with the black compound? And at what degree of edge finish (coarse/fine)? I have some black 'stick' compound (Ryobi SiC @ 1-3 micron, according to the labelling), and have experimented a little bit with it on strops, but sometimes felt it was a bit too aggressive on some of the blades I tried. Pretty easy to over-polish with it, if not being careful. I think I'll re-visit it though, to see if that was a fluke.

Thanks.
Click to expand...


Holy Cow, the Ryobi black is rated 1-3 micron?! I would have thought it was much closer to 18-20. I mixed some up with mineral oil gave it a good stir and looked at it under the microscope. I'm sure the particles could fracture down smaller, but based on what I arrived at they looked much, much larger to start - might have to go back and take a second look. The Ryobi yellow is probably closer to the 1-3 micron, and the white is probably in the .5-1 range, very similar to flexcut gold and Sears white. The Sears black starts closer to 30 micron.

Edit to add:
I use the black compound for all sorts of minor repair - on my machetes and hatchets I just strop on newspaper dosed with black compound and follow with some white or yellow - restores a battered edge to arm hair shaving in very short order - not sophisticated, but it works. I've even used the black compound on hardwood to raise a burr/ grind a fresh bevel before moving up to white compound on hardwood and finally white compound on newspaper - can get a hair whittling edge this way if one is careful.

Edit_2:
The abrasive in these black compounds appears to be AlumOx, the same as the finer compounds. I initially thought it was SIC but is most assuredly not. Natural Emery contains Aluminum oxide and a host of lesser abrasives, the man made version of Emery appears to be just (or mostly) AlumOx
 
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HeavyHanded said:
Holy Cow, the Ryobi black is rated 1-3 micron?! I would have thought it was much closer to 18-20. I mixed some up with mineral oil gave it a good stir and looked at it under the microscope. I'm sure the particles could fracture down smaller, but based on what I arrived at they looked much, much larger to start - might have to go back and take a second look. The Ryobi yellow is probably closer to the 1-3 micron, and the white is probably in the .5-1 range, very similar to flexcut gold and Sears white. The Sears black starts closer to 30 micron.
Click to expand...

You know what? I'm looking at the tube again, and it is 1-3 micron. BUT, it's not SiC. It's corundum ('Emery Buffing Compound', as labelled), which is aluminum oxide. Based on the apparent aggressiveness, and the black color, I'd assumed it was SiC. But no. Edit: And I'm seeing in your edits, you've noticed this too. :)
 
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Obsessed with Edges said:
Meant to ask you yesterday, but lost track. I was wondering, what steels are you stropping on your belt with the black compound? And at what degree of edge finish (coarse/fine)? I have some black 'stick' compound (Ryobi SiC 'Emery Buffing Compound' @ 1-3 micron, according to the labelling), and have experimented a little bit with it on strops, but sometimes felt it was a bit too aggressive on some of the blades I tried. Pretty easy to over-polish with it, if not being careful. I think I'll re-visit it though, to see if that was a fluke.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I'm working A2, 3V and 154CM for the most part, although I use it on more or less whatever I have around. Often that will be ZDP-189, ELMAX, M4 or M390. Just depends on what I have in my pocket at the time, really.

I use BRKT's compounds, I really have NO idea how they'd compare to Ryobi's stuff. For the most part, the black seems to work quite well for me. Pressure control, of course, is mandatory to avoid rounding, as with any strop.
 
Obsessed with Edges said:
You know what? I'm looking at the tube again, and it is 1-3 micron. BUT, it's not SiC. It's corundum ('Emery Buffing Compound', as labelled), which is aluminum oxide. Based on the apparent aggressiveness, and the black color, I'd assumed it was SiC. But no. Edit: And I'm seeing in your edits, you've noticed this too. :)
Click to expand...

Part of this might be apples to oranges - I was looking at the Ryobi stuff that comes in a wax crayon, not a tube. FWIW, we used to use compounds from a co called Dico, the binder was real easy to work with and the compounds themselves seemed to be of a very high quality. I also have suspicions that many of the common compounds use abrasives sourced from the same suppliers and the only real difference is in the vehicle. How the vehicle interacts with your stropping surface makes a huge difference in how it will go to work.
 
HeavyHanded said:
Part of this might be apples to oranges - I was looking at the Ryobi stuff that comes in a wax crayon, not a tube. FWIW, we used to use compounds from a co called Dico, the binder was real easy to work with and the compounds themselves seemed to be of a very high quality. I also have suspicions that many of the common compounds use abrasives sourced from the same suppliers and the only real difference is in the vehicle. How the vehicle interacts with your stropping surface makes a huge difference in how it will go to work.
Click to expand...

I think we may be on the same page, as to which one I'm using. Mine is in a cardboard 'tube', but with what I'd call a 'wax crayon' in it. Very hard & dry stuff. Doesn't apply to leather real easily, which is why I hadn't used it much thus far. But, I did 'crayon' some of it onto a wooden dowel recently, and have 'stropped' some knives on it with very good results. Your recent thread on finding a new use for a honing steel (which you taped with compound applied to it) put that idea in my head. :thumbup:

Here's a stock pic of the Ryobi compound I was referring to:
c5a5c2c2-3d08-452e-aba1-5e566f2c8a38_300.jpg
 
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