"Knives and the Second Amendment" Legal Article Published

[MikeC]

The simple fact that were at the point where constitutional lawyers are having to write opinions like this and a orgization such ad knife rights is even necessary is just bad news. Knives are not arms their tools and we're just setting ourselves up for more heart ache trying to attach knives to 2 nd amendmant.

It shouldn't even be an argument their pocKet knives for gods sake. Pathetic utterly pathetic we are at this point.

 

[USArmyRecon]

while I think of my knives as tools, not arms, I think this is certainly a good thing for all of us.

Was going to say the exact same thing

 

[Stiletto Raggio]

It shouldn't even be an argument their pocKet knives for gods sake. Pathetic utterly pathetic we are at this point.

You are right, but here we are. Little kids are getting thrown out of school for drawing anything that resembles a weapon. British newspapers talk about "knife crime" as though a knife were some sort of novel invention made purely for evil purposes. The basic tool of human civilization is being demonized by domesticated consumer-culture adherents. Time to start making legal cases before "common sense" makes this an uphill battle.

 

[N8N]

Next on the hit list: fire and the wheel. Seriously, I appreciate it that someone is trying to preserve my right to carry a knife, but I look at it more like an EDC flashlight than I do a concealed handgun. It's likely to live a long life keeping me safe from ragged envelopes and unpeeled oranges, maybe occasionally sharpen a pencil or field-shape a piece of wood, maybe cut a gasket in a pinch if I don't have a razor blade handy, etc... I really don't think of a knife as a weapon.

 

[archieblue]

Knives have been used as weapons. That's a clear fact and they should be considered an "arm." But it seems to me that all law leans heavily on "definitions" as defined in the law. Clearly defining a knife as an "arm" could bite us law abiding folks in the butt. There is no comparison between a knife and a pistol but if it is defined that way I see it as a problem.

The heart of the heart of the heart of the problem is widespread distrust, lack of respect and ultimately fear of ones fellow man. That is why "the sheep" support disarming you and I.
I don't like lumping knives in with guns. It's like lumping asprin in with morphine because a few people have expired from it & it could be used to do harm to ones self or others. But they are both drugs, right?
It seem obvious to me that the real disgrace, supported and caused by irrational fear, is that a POTENTIAL criminal is seen as an ACTUAL criminal by "law" based on that person having an instrument which is first and foremost a tool. It is a blanket statement saying "People are inherently bad." This viewpoint can only be true if the person who believes this consciously or subconsciously realizes they themselves have stepped on a few toes to get where they are and have what they have.

We have all been thoroughly impregnated with seeing ourselves as victims at worst and potential victims at best but it's primarily theoretical. However, our actions, past and present, are very real. Love your fellow man. Not a select few. If you really do, he'll know it. Always remember, if you have any fear at all it controls you and then you ARE "the sheep."
In the words of Aaron Freeman: "If you could save yourself, you'd save us all."

 

[N8N]

Knives have been used as weapons. That's a clear fact and they should be considered an "arm." But it seems to me that all law leans heavily on "definitions" as defined in the law. Clearly defining a knife as an "arm" could bite us law abiding folks in the butt. There is no comparison between a knife and a pistol but if it is defined that way I see it as a problem.

The heart of the heart of the heart of the problem is widespread distrust, lack of respect and ultimately fear of ones fellow man. That is why "the sheep" support disarming you and I.
I don't like lumping knives in with guns. It's like lumping asprin in with morphine because a few people have expired from it & it could be used to do harm to ones self or others. But they are both drugs, right?
It seem obvious to me that the real disgrace, supported and caused by irrational fear, is that a POTENTIAL criminal is seen as an ACTUAL criminal by "law" based on that person having an instrument which is first and foremost a tool. It is a blanket statement saying "People are inherently bad." This viewpoint can only be true if the person who believes this consciously or subconsciously realizes they themselves have stepped on a few toes to get where they are and have what they have.

We have all been thoroughly impregnated with seeing ourselves as victims at worst and potential victims at best but it's primarily theoretical. However, our actions, past and present, are very real. Love your fellow man. Not a select few. If you really do, he'll know it. Always remember, if you have any fear at all it controls you and then you ARE "the sheep."
In the words of Aaron Freeman: "If you could save yourself, you'd save us all."

I think you and I have the same concerns about this approach, but you possibly explained your position more eloquently. I fear that defining *all* knives as arms would then result in requiring a CCW to carry *anything* with a blade in one's pocket; that is, concealed. Now should I need a CCW to carry, say, a CQC-7? Maybe. No skin off my nose, I actually have a CCW. But where do you draw the line? Case stockman? SAK? Leatherman? Are those really "weapons?" If nothing else, it's already happened with handguns, there's a perception that only "gun nuts" and criminals want to carry handguns. I personally don't; I applied for my CCW simply to allow for the possibility that I may want to someday and to be counted among the ranks of those who do not believe that it is an exceptional or extreme thing to do. I don't want to see that also happen to the humble pocketknife, which I *do* carry, along with a small flashlight, because I use them both on a quite regular basis.

 

[McVeyMac]

I think it's great that I can carry my knives legally and have things stay that way but I'm not sure how I feel about knife legislation being turned into a Second Amendment issue, since I tend to see them as tools first.

When I was growing up, firearms were also tools first.

 

[B.F.U]

Definitely gonna read through this after finals. Seems like a good thing.

 

[Shotgun]

I think it's great that I can carry my knives legally and have things stay that way but I'm not sure how I feel about knife legislation being turned into a Second Amendment issue, since I tend to see them as tools first.

I understand and agree but you have to realize that the public at large doesn't agree with you so fighting them on their level of perception is wise. To most people a pocket knife, especially modern folders, are regarded as weapons by almost everyone I've talked to about it with. Cool to know that some ground work is being laid.

 

[Shotgun]

Sure they are. What about a guillotine? What about the thousands of devices and tools specifically made to kill people? To define a tool or weapon with it's ability to kill or it's intent of use is irrelevant.

Calling a gun a tool is like calling a square a rectangle. It may be technically correct but no one is buying that argument and I think gun owners do themselves a disservice by repeating that mantra.

 

[McVeyMac]

A gun is a tool to put food on the table to feed my family, and to protect theirs or my life. It is a tool that I always carry, like my Leatherman and a variety of folding and fixed blade knives.

 

[fetzer85]

A gun is a tool to put food on the table to feed my family, and to protect theirs or my life. It is a tool that I always carry, like my Leatherman and a variety of folding and fixed blade knives.

So you always carry your gun for the purpose of putting food on the table? No. You carry it for self defense.

 

[McVeyMac]

So you always carry your gun for the purpose of putting food on the table? No. You carry it for self defense.

But the firearm is still a tool, no matter if killing game or protecting life or limb of myself or of someone else.

 

[SOLEIL]

It does not matter what anyone thinks is a tool or not. It is all about protecting your future rights to own and obtain knives of your choice. If you can't see the trend going from the demonization of firearms to knives then you're not paying attention. Even if you are anti-gun you have to realize that knives will be next. Even if knives do fall under the 2A there is no need to assume that they will be regulated the same as firearms. Why would they? The 2A has nothing to do with any regulations. Regulations are born and evolved due to peoples beliefs. Current knife and gun regulations are the examples. As soon as the anti-gun forces achieve their goals knives will be their next agenda. It has happened in the UK in particular. This legislation is to protect your rights to own, obtain, and carry knives of your choice in the future. It really seems ironic that people on this forum are anti-gun. If guns are banned and regulated in the way many politicians want, your knives will be next.

 

[N8N]

Agreed, but IMHO defining a knife as an 'arm' is *inviting* those who define all weapons as inherently bad and want to restrict them to start banning them, no matter what the 2nd Amendment says. I think we're all in agreement that a) knife carry should not be restricted and b) there are people who disagree with the statement I just made, where we disagree is how best to change the minds of those people or worst case prevent them from getting their way.

for the record, I'm not anti-gun either. I don't carry but do actually hold a CFP because I support the right of law abiding citizens to do so if they choose.

 

[SOLEIL]

Lol, wasn't referring to anyone in particular. But over the years many people have made it apparent in various forums here. I also understand that we are global in nature so many posting here may live in areas where individual rights like the 2A have never existed.