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Good job on this thread Gary. I really like that Taramundi knife. :thumbup:
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Knives from My Spanish Holidays
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5K Qs
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Thanks, Bob; sounds like you could use some photos of blue Spanish skies with all the snow you've been getting the past couple of weeks!
The Taramundi looks great to me, and it really slices. It reminds me in that sense of the chestnut bone Sodbuster Jr I won in your GAW; I can just sit and look at both of those knives for a long time. I've been carrying the Sodbuster every day since it arrived, but I didn't really start using it until this week (partly as a little patina experiment I wanted to try).Thanks, Greg! Maybe 20 years from now you'll have the chance to do a similar thread if your daughter decides to go live in a foreign country.
The Vic Electrician you sent me didn't go to Spain with me, since I didn't want to risk it disappearing during a TSA customs inspection or something. But other than that, I've carried it every day since last October! It's a wonderful knife for which I'm ever grateful.- GT
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The morning of Dec. 28 was the end of our time in Sevilla. About 11:30am we boarded a bus for the 3.5 hour trip to Granada. My daughter went to sleep almost immediately once the bus left the station, but I found the scenery far too interesting to doze off! Lots of orchards of olive trees and of orange trees, little towns, mountains, old buildings in various states of repair that may have dated back to Moorish times, based on architecture. The bus was very comfortable, and I was very impressed with Spanish buses and trains throughout my visit.
By the time we arrived in Granada, the weather was rather dreary, cold, and drizzly. Once we checked into our hotel (after a thrilling cab ride from the bus station), we went looking for food. To my surprise, we ended up in an incredibly busy Burger King. The familiarity was probably comforting to me, although beer as a beverage choice was a surprise!
We explored the central city for a while, and then tried to tour the Granada Catedral, the 2nd largest in Spain. It is apparently large enough to hold the "touristy" cathedral as well as a "regular" cathedral. Somehow we went in the wrong door and ended up "crashing" a christening, I think (we were not alone in making this error). Eventually we found the correct entrance, paid our admission, and spent an hour and a half touring the cathedral. To a mostly small-church Protestant guy, the cathedral was pretty awe-inspiring! Here's one pic to suggest some of the cathedral's grandeur:
There's also a Royal Chapel attached to the Cathedral; we visited it the next day. It contains the tombs of Queen Isabel and King Ferdinand, who drove the last of the Moorish sultans out of Granada and sent Columbus off to find India, both in 1492. Isabel and Ferdinand are revered in Spain for ushering in Spain's Golden Age with their triumphs in Granada. The Royal Chapel also includes the tombs of the next rulers, Philip the Fair and Juana the Mad, who kept Philip's embalmed body in her bedroom for 2 years after his early death.
The real attraction in Granada is the Alhambra, an old Moorish fortress/palace/town. It reminded me of the Alcazar we'd visited in Sevilla, but on a bigger scale; I suspect I'd have been more impressed by whichever example of medieval Moorish rule I'd seen first. Here are a couple of pics showing the incredible decorating details (all done by hand) on every surface throughout the palace.
It was a very cold morning when we visited the Alhambra. Here's one of the countless "selfies" my daughter took during our travels, this one showing us bundled up for subfreezing sightseeing.
The Alhambra "complex" also includes extensive gardens and a summer palace:
From the towers of the Alhambra fortress, you have incredible views of Granada. Here's the Moorish Quarter and the Sierra Nevada:
Here's a view of downtown Granada, with the Cathedral in the center of the photo:
Just behind the cathedral in that shot is a small plaza that contains TWO side-by-side cuchillerias. They both have the same last name on their signs, but the first names are different; I don't know the story behind the relationship between these knife shops. But I thought the one on the right had a more interesting selection of knives, better prices, and more helpful staff. I bought another of my "Spanish grail knives" there, a navaja de campana (I don't know how to add a tilde over that last n) from JJ Martinez:
This knife had been highly recommended, and I saw one in trevytrev's epic sodbuster thread. The resemblance is very strong:
I like this knife, but I've been working on it ever since I got back to the US. The pull was VERY strong, especially the first quarter and last quarter of its "opening arc"; I didn't dare try to open it without wearing a glove or gripping the blade with a towel. After much flushing, lubing, storing with backspring maximally "stressed", and opening/closing, it's getting better. No half-stops, but the cam on the tang seems kind of "high" or "pointy", and it looks to me like that's the cause of the "sticky" spots in opening; maybe I should try filing the cam down a hair?
The finish on the knife is a little rough, too. I can feel burrs at various spots on the liners, and the wood covers aren't nicely "blended" into the bolsters. But those little "imperfections" are relatively easy to fix (even for someone like me, who's woefully lacking in mechanical aptitude
). It's an inexpensive working knife, and expecting "showpiece" fit and finish from a knife that cost under $12 US is unrealistic.
My biggest frustration with the knife is that, although my daughter stressed that I wanted the carbon steel version of the knife (and even went so far as to give a brief description of my advanced age and farm upbringing to the cuchilleria guy to show that I'd be able to care for such a knife) and the guy went to the "back room" to find a carbon steel model, I've concluded that the blade is stainless steel! :grumpy: Once I had the pull lightened up a little bit, I started to use the knife for food prep in the kitchen, hoping to enjoy the development of patina, as I've done with my Opinels. But after a week of this, the blade still looked pristine. As a "control", I tried the same thing with a new Case Sodbuster Jr I'd recently won in BigBiscuit's GAW, and one breakfast was enough to start a patina going there! Here's another picture (well 2 pictures of low quality) comparing the two knives and the difference in blade color.
I hadn't bought this model knife from Señor Rafael in Sevilla because he didn't have it in carbon steel. I was thrilled to find what I wanted in Granada, but I guess I actually didn't!
By the time we arrived in Granada, the weather was rather dreary, cold, and drizzly. Once we checked into our hotel (after a thrilling cab ride from the bus station
), we went looking for food. To my surprise, we ended up in an incredibly busy Burger King. The familiarity was probably comforting to me, although beer as a beverage choice was a surprise!We explored the central city for a while, and then tried to tour the Granada Catedral, the 2nd largest in Spain. It is apparently large enough to hold the "touristy" cathedral as well as a "regular" cathedral. Somehow we went in the wrong door and ended up "crashing" a christening, I think (we were not alone in making this error). Eventually we found the correct entrance, paid our admission, and spent an hour and a half touring the cathedral. To a mostly small-church Protestant guy, the cathedral was pretty awe-inspiring!
Here's one pic to suggest some of the cathedral's grandeur:
There's also a Royal Chapel attached to the Cathedral; we visited it the next day. It contains the tombs of Queen Isabel and King Ferdinand, who drove the last of the Moorish sultans out of Granada and sent Columbus off to find India, both in 1492. Isabel and Ferdinand are revered in Spain for ushering in Spain's Golden Age with their triumphs in Granada. The Royal Chapel also includes the tombs of the next rulers, Philip the Fair and Juana the Mad, who kept Philip's embalmed body in her bedroom for 2 years after his early death.
The real attraction in Granada is the Alhambra, an old Moorish fortress/palace/town. It reminded me of the Alcazar we'd visited in Sevilla, but on a bigger scale; I suspect I'd have been more impressed by whichever example of medieval Moorish rule I'd seen first. Here are a couple of pics showing the incredible decorating details (all done by hand) on every surface throughout the palace.
It was a very cold morning when we visited the Alhambra. Here's one of the countless "selfies" my daughter took during our travels, this one showing us bundled up for subfreezing sightseeing.
The Alhambra "complex" also includes extensive gardens and a summer palace:
From the towers of the Alhambra fortress, you have incredible views of Granada. Here's the Moorish Quarter and the Sierra Nevada:
Here's a view of downtown Granada, with the Cathedral in the center of the photo:
Just behind the cathedral in that shot is a small plaza that contains TWO side-by-side cuchillerias. They both have the same last name on their signs, but the first names are different; I don't know the story behind the relationship between these knife shops. But I thought the one on the right had a more interesting selection of knives, better prices, and more helpful staff. I bought another of my "Spanish grail knives" there, a navaja de campana (I don't know how to add a tilde over that last n) from JJ Martinez:
This knife had been highly recommended, and I saw one in trevytrev's epic sodbuster thread. The resemblance is very strong:
I like this knife, but I've been working on it ever since I got back to the US. The pull was VERY strong, especially the first quarter and last quarter of its "opening arc"; I didn't dare try to open it without wearing a glove or gripping the blade with a towel. After much flushing, lubing, storing with backspring maximally "stressed", and opening/closing, it's getting better. No half-stops, but the cam on the tang seems kind of "high" or "pointy", and it looks to me like that's the cause of the "sticky" spots in opening; maybe I should try filing the cam down a hair?
The finish on the knife is a little rough, too. I can feel burrs at various spots on the liners, and the wood covers aren't nicely "blended" into the bolsters. But those little "imperfections" are relatively easy to fix (even for someone like me, who's woefully lacking in mechanical aptitude
). It's an inexpensive working knife, and expecting "showpiece" fit and finish from a knife that cost under $12 US is unrealistic.My biggest frustration with the knife is that, although my daughter stressed that I wanted the carbon steel version of the knife (and even went so far as to give a brief description of my advanced age and farm upbringing to the cuchilleria guy to show that I'd be able to care for such a knife) and the guy went to the "back room" to find a carbon steel model, I've concluded that the blade is stainless steel! :grumpy: Once I had the pull lightened up a little bit, I started to use the knife for food prep in the kitchen, hoping to enjoy the development of patina, as I've done with my Opinels. But after a week of this, the blade still looked pristine. As a "control", I tried the same thing with a new Case Sodbuster Jr I'd recently won in BigBiscuit's GAW, and one breakfast was enough to start a patina going there! Here's another picture (well 2 pictures of low quality) comparing the two knives and the difference in blade color.
I hadn't bought this model knife from Señor Rafael in Sevilla because he didn't have it in carbon steel. I was thrilled to find what I wanted in Granada, but I guess I actually didn't!
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Nice pics GT. I like your newest addition here with the comparison to the Soddie Jr.
I was just watching some documentary a couple nights ago about that palace at Alhambra. Beautiful scenery inside and out. :thumbup:
I was just watching some documentary a couple nights ago about that palace at Alhambra. Beautiful scenery inside and out. :thumbup:
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Wow, a real Sunday treat! Thanks GT, your photographs are stunning, great write-up too. Looks like a trip you'll remember for the rest of your life my friend :thumbup:
That's very disappointing about the 'carbon' turning out to be stainless I've had the same thing happen more than once. Still a nice knife though.
Your story about the Burger King made me think about a bar that some friends and I ducked into in Barcelona once. The place was quite crowded and everyone was happily drinking beer and wine. We noticed some guys drinking at the bar who were wearing white coats. After a while, we realised we were actually in the hospital canteen!
That's very disappointing about the 'carbon' turning out to be stainless
I've had the same thing happen more than once. Still a nice knife though.Your story about the Burger King made me think about a bar that some friends and I ducked into in Barcelona once. The place was quite crowded and everyone was happily drinking beer and wine. We noticed some guys drinking at the bar who were wearing white coats. After a while, we realised we were actually in the hospital canteen!
Greetings from the Pyrenees Mountains.
Nice trip to Spain.
The Taramundi knife is awesome and a real knife farmer. Manufactured in the small towns of Asturias to have something more effective when in winter you could not cultivate the fields.
This type of blade is "punta caida" similar to the sheepfoot or lambfoot blade.
The "Navaja de Campaña" is popularized by the german during de Spanish Civil War ( 1936-1939 ) many soldiers continued to use this type of knife after the war and became part of the Spanish soldier equipment for years.
Nice trip to Spain.
The Taramundi knife is awesome and a real knife farmer. Manufactured in the small towns of Asturias to have something more effective when in winter you could not cultivate the fields.
This type of blade is "punta caida" similar to the sheepfoot or lambfoot blade.
The "Navaja de Campaña" is popularized by the german during de Spanish Civil War ( 1936-1939 ) many soldiers continued to use this type of knife after the war and became part of the Spanish soldier equipment for years.
5K Qs
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Thanks, Bob. The Alhambra really is a stunning place; the amount of hand labor that went into the details is mind-blowing!
I couldn't have done the knife comparison without your contribution; thanks! Wow, a real Sunday treat! Thanks GT, your photographs are stunning, great write-up too. Looks like a trip you'll remember for the rest of your life my friend :thumbup:
That's very disappointing about the 'carbon' turning out to be stainless
...
Thanks for the kind words, Jack!
If an experienced knife enthusiast like you has had the same stainless-not-carbon "glitch", I guess there's not an easy "field test" that will allow me to determine blade composition??Thanks for the additional background information on these knives, Kerrmak! :thumbup::thumbup: I appreciate getting the "local knowledge."
Thanks, Dave. Don't recall seeing your face posted, but I think I saw a nice pic of your pants/pocket in a fairly recent thread about how folks carry their knives, right??
- GT
Thanks Sir.
A little correction, is "international knowledge" I'm not spanish ( Spaniard???).
The traditional knives is very rare, Albacete is a great factory of knives but only make your traditional models.
The traditional kinives in Spain is very large and lost a lot of their local blacksmith, knifemakers, typical folders ( Jarota, Paternera.... ), typical knives ( Macho riojano, de Sabateta,... )
Good day and GBA.
A little correction, is "international knowledge" I'm not spanish ( Spaniard???).
The traditional knives is very rare, Albacete is a great factory of knives but only make your traditional models.
The traditional kinives in Spain is very large and lost a lot of their local blacksmith, knifemakers, typical folders ( Jarota, Paternera.... ), typical knives ( Macho riojano, de Sabateta,... )
Good day and GBA.
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My apologies, Kermmak! You mentioned the Pyrenees, and I jumped to the conclusion that it was Spain. I saw the Andorra location at the top of your post, but my knowledge of European geography is less than ideal, and I didn't recognize it as an independent principality. I hope you'll forgive my ignorance; no offense intended!
- GT
You mentioned the Pyrenees, and I jumped to the conclusion that it was Spain. I saw the Andorra location at the top of your post, but my knowledge of European geography is less than ideal, and I didn't recognize it as an independent principality. I hope you'll forgive my ignorance; no offense intended!- GT
eisman
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I've been waiting on a continuation of this thread, as these always bring some memory back to the top.
After four years of living in Germany I ended up in a McDonald's with my brothers in California. Not paying attention I ordered in German (of course including beer) and then had to explain to the staff that they really do serve it in Europe. My brothers (one of who also resided in Germany for several years) thought it was hilarious.
The ability of the Arabic artists to do intricate work still exists, and you could see traces of it in Hussain's Baghdad palaces, and throughout the middle east, but it's dying as the young don't want to take the time to learn, and there's so few able to afford the time to make it practical. Incredible stuff, and it influenced a lot of architecture over the years. I wish I knew more about how their metallurgy and blade shapes transitioned thru the ages; guess I've got some reading to do.
You may be able to reshape the cam point using a thin stone, or a jewelers file, but go slow; it doesn't take much to make a change.
After four years of living in Germany I ended up in a McDonald's with my brothers in California. Not paying attention I ordered in German (of course including beer) and then had to explain to the staff that they really do serve it in Europe. My brothers (one of who also resided in Germany for several years) thought it was hilarious.
The ability of the Arabic artists to do intricate work still exists, and you could see traces of it in Hussain's Baghdad palaces, and throughout the middle east, but it's dying as the young don't want to take the time to learn, and there's so few able to afford the time to make it practical. Incredible stuff, and it influenced a lot of architecture over the years. I wish I knew more about how their metallurgy and blade shapes transitioned thru the ages; guess I've got some reading to do.
You may be able to reshape the cam point using a thin stone, or a jewelers file, but go slow; it doesn't take much to make a change.
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eisman, your McDonald's story gave me a good laugh. I wonder how many "cultural slip-ups" my daughter will have if she moves back to the States someday?
Thanks for the advice on tang modifications. Just by working the blade for a little while each day, I seem to have it to a point where I can deal with it without resorting to "special protective gear." So I probably won't be messing with the tang.
- GT
I wonder how many "cultural slip-ups" my daughter will have if she moves back to the States someday?Thanks for the advice on tang modifications. Just by working the blade for a little while each day, I seem to have it to a point where I can deal with it without resorting to "special protective gear."
So I probably won't be messing with the tang.- GT
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Thanks for the kind words, Jack!
I think that you've already worked it out my friend
I bought a Sodbuster from a UK dealer a couple of years back, and he was insisting it wasn't stainless even though it said 'Inox' on the blade! 
Hey, I've seen that film!
:thumbup:
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... I bought a Sodbuster from a UK dealer a couple of years back, and he was insisting it wasn't stainless even though it said 'Inox' on the blade!
...
I'd think you were kidding if I hadn't experienced that sort of thing at least twice in Spain.
I tend to be sort of a trusting soul, but I should probably have known that knife dealers span the same range of credibility as anyone else. (Maybe I've been misled by the quality of the folks I've met here at BF, and just generalized that all knife-related people are highly principled.
)- GT
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I'd think you were kidding if I hadn't experienced that sort of thing at least twice in Spain.
I tend to be sort of a trusting soul, but I should probably have known that knife dealers span the same range of credibility as anyone else. (Maybe I've been misled by the quality of the folks I've met here at BF, and just generalized that all knife-related people are highly principled.
- GT
I sent him a polite e-mail and he sent me one back telling me that the knife was "NOT stainless, it is INOX, as the blade plainly states." I think I posted the email exchange at the time, a Robert Klaas Black Angus. I sent the knife to a poster here for his brother-in-law Angus
I also had another stainless/carbon experience with fancy-dress Viking here!
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...d’s-Quest-Part-10-Vikings-and-Thieving-Varlet
I don't think it's always down to a lack of principal, sometimes they're just plain STUPID!
I´m glad you enjoyed my country and the cities where I live (Sevilla) and where I travel to whenever I can (Granada).
Thank you for your mention, but I really enjoy the chances to help a knifepal.
Focusing on knife issues, to avoid our moderators to frown :grumpy:, let me say a couple of things about the bunch of blades you got.
Carlos Quintana is a wise selection for a Taramundi: perfect quality/price ratio. It´s a pity that you couldn´t get the carbon steel version of the Martínez 'navaja de campaña'. By the way, I don´t know exactly the date when this sort of Spanish sodbuster came to Spain, but there´s references regardind the use of this pattern as a military knife in the Maroccan War, in the beginning of XXth century, long before our Civil War with German forces presence.
Third and fifth folders are versions of a traditional Catalonian (NE Spain) pattern, called 'solsonesa'. Unluckiliy, the one marked as 'Palles' is a Chinese rip-off of a cheap, carbon steel, plastic handle folder made by "Pallarés", a honest and very traditional EDC knife for a lot of Spanish workers. The Joker version, made in Albacete, on the other hand, can be considered an upgraded version of the Pallarés. This 'navaja solsonesa' is still being made by some skilled bladesmiths the old style. This one - forged carbon steel, window lock and bull horn handle with brass pins - is made by Antonio Pedrosa. I hope no one minds if I post this pic from the Spanish Foro de Armas Blancas.
The laguiole style knife is another straight Chinese fake, probably imported by Martínez-Albainox.
Finally the two other Jokers are simple working knives, well made and - I hope- not too expensive.
Let me know if you think I can help you any other way.
Best regards.
Thank you for your mention, but I really enjoy the chances to help a knifepal.
Focusing on knife issues, to avoid our moderators to frown :grumpy:, let me say a couple of things about the bunch of blades you got.
Carlos Quintana is a wise selection for a Taramundi: perfect quality/price ratio. It´s a pity that you couldn´t get the carbon steel version of the Martínez 'navaja de campaña'. By the way, I don´t know exactly the date when this sort of Spanish sodbuster came to Spain, but there´s references regardind the use of this pattern as a military knife in the Maroccan War, in the beginning of XXth century, long before our Civil War with German forces presence.
Third and fifth folders are versions of a traditional Catalonian (NE Spain) pattern, called 'solsonesa'. Unluckiliy, the one marked as 'Palles' is a Chinese rip-off of a cheap, carbon steel, plastic handle folder made by "Pallarés", a honest and very traditional EDC knife for a lot of Spanish workers. The Joker version, made in Albacete, on the other hand, can be considered an upgraded version of the Pallarés. This 'navaja solsonesa' is still being made by some skilled bladesmiths the old style. This one - forged carbon steel, window lock and bull horn handle with brass pins - is made by Antonio Pedrosa. I hope no one minds if I post this pic from the Spanish Foro de Armas Blancas.
The laguiole style knife is another straight Chinese fake, probably imported by Martínez-Albainox.
Finally the two other Jokers are simple working knives, well made and - I hope- not too expensive.
Let me know if you think I can help you any other way.
Best regards.
Last edited:
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Thanks for your informative post, sevilla! My daughter and I certainly enjoyed our visit to Sevilla; I thought your city was fascinating and the weather was very pleasant. Señor Rafael at the cuchilleria in Sevilla was very friendly and helpful; thanks for recommending him. I also enjoyed the cuchillerias in Granada, even if we had a misunderstanding about the carbon steel version of JJ Martinez navaja de campana.
I appreciated learning the term "navaja solsonesa" for the Catalonian knives; the version of this type of knife you showed is very attractive! :thumbup: The Cudeman version came from Toledo, and I probably paid more than I should have; so many stores in Toledo had blades they wanted to sell to tourists, and maybe the prices are higher than normal. I suspected the Palles knife and the laguiole were Chinese, and later found that they are available through the Martinez-Albainox website. I bought both in a shop in Denia for not very much money; I'm not completely unhappy that I found examples of "junk knives" in Spain just like some I've bought in US. The horn-handled Joker also came from Toledo, and was the knife I paid most for in Spain. I actually saw one like it in Granada, and told my daughter on our way to check out of our Granada hotel that I would buy it if the cuchilleria was open, but they were closed in early afternoon. So when I saw it in Toledo, I decided to buy it there, even though the price was a little higher than in Granada. The "big" carbono Joker came from Valencia.
Thanks again for your help!
- GT
Señor Rafael at the cuchilleria in Sevilla was very friendly and helpful; thanks for recommending him. I also enjoyed the cuchillerias in Granada, even if we had a misunderstanding about the carbon steel version of JJ Martinez navaja de campana.I appreciated learning the term "navaja solsonesa" for the Catalonian knives; the version of this type of knife you showed is very attractive! :thumbup: The Cudeman version came from Toledo, and I probably paid more than I should have; so many stores in Toledo had blades they wanted to sell to tourists, and maybe the prices are higher than normal. I suspected the Palles knife and the laguiole were Chinese, and later found that they are available through the Martinez-Albainox website. I bought both in a shop in Denia for not very much money; I'm not completely unhappy that I found examples of "junk knives" in Spain just like some I've bought in US.
The horn-handled Joker also came from Toledo, and was the knife I paid most for in Spain. I actually saw one like it in Granada, and told my daughter on our way to check out of our Granada hotel that I would buy it if the cuchilleria was open, but they were closed in early afternoon. So when I saw it in Toledo, I decided to buy it there, even though the price was a little higher than in Granada. The "big" carbono Joker came from Valencia.Thanks again for your help!
- GT