Knives Reflect Culture

[Halbie]

Of course they did. They relied on them for protection and food gathering. Food products didn't come nicely packaged back when, it had to be removed from its protective covering (hide, peel, husk). Furniture, eating utensils, clothing, tools, had to be fashioned by hand.

Andy

BUT.. And this is a BIG BUT ... What did they do special? Everyone did what you're talking about. How did American pioneers distinguish themselves in these efforts?

What knives are special to that experience?

 

[nephildevil]

yeah, pioneers into africa did the same thing with their blades, i suppose

 

[nephildevil]

...or in australia, or wherever new territory


nessmuk designed a special style of knives i think, but they are suited for wilderniss in every part of the world, not especially for american use


you could say that a machete might be a special design for jungle like growth, mainly to hack a path

 

[Esav Benyamin]

BUT.. And this is a BIG BUT ... What did they do special? Everyone did what you're talking about. How did American pioneers distinguish themselves in these efforts?

What knives are special to that experience?

Not sure who else you're talking about, but in Europe meat was domesticated, in the early colonies and certainly on the frontier, much of it was still wild. That made for differences in the equipment needed to take the animals down and process them. The frontiersmen's knives also had to serve more as tools -- camp knives -- and the entire kit was more portable than a townsman's equipment.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

nephildevil, please, please try to comment on something you actually know something about. Watching movies and reading comic books doesn't count as experience.

 

[azn1stknightsoul]

Heres an interesting thought. Take a look at 'traditional' American knife designs. What is most prominent? The Bowie, Arkansas Toothpick, etc.

But look to other countries' traditional knife designs. Look at the Indonesian Islands. You have the Kriss, Espada, Kampilian, Janap, Guinunting, Krabong, etc. So many different designs but they are all equally adept at doing their job as offensive weapons. Does necessarily reflect upon their culture as being warlike and bloodthirsty?

Not really trying to prove a point, but rather to provoke thought.

 

[nephildevil]

nephildevil, please, please try to comment on something you actually know something about. Watching movies and reading comic books doesn't count as experience.

watching movies ok, but its been a two digit number since i read a comic book

it is not like any of us were there when new territories were discovered and colonies made, so then we shud all just say nothing anymore /

 

[Halbie]

Heres an interesting thought. Take a look at 'traditional' American knife designs. What is most prominent? The Bowie, Arkansas Toothpick, etc.

But look to other countries' traditional knife designs. Look at the Indonesian Islands. You have the Kriss, Espada, Kampilian, Janap, Guinunting, Krabong, etc. So many different designs but they are all equally adept at doing their job as offensive weapons. Does necessarily reflect upon their culture as being warlike and bloodthirsty?

Not really trying to prove a point, but rather to provoke thought.

No, but that is the very point.

Different needs and the ability to adapt. Knives used for living, hunting, killing.

I think we can say something about a culture by looking at its knives. Theare are some of the basic tools of all cultures, after all.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

No, nephildevil, there are primary sources available. You just have a greater than average ratio of totally clueless pronouncements than most others, and this thread being particularly appropriate to the forum and interesting when intelligent comments are added ... you could help by not distracting us with babble.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Heres an interesting thought. Take a look at 'traditional' American knife designs. What is most prominent? The Bowie, Arkansas Toothpick, etc.

Are those really the traditional American knives, though? For the colonial/frontier period, they were not. Tradeknives, butcher knives, knives that looked more like a leuku were the norm.

The "Bowie" and "Arkansas toothpick" (a name originally used for the Bowie anyway) were a later development, just as often carried by people for show.

Americans from the start had guns as weapons, unlike southeast Asia where the blade was it, as in ancient Europe.

 

[nephildevil]

No, nephildevil, there are primary sources available. You just have a greater than average ratio of totally clueless pronouncements than most others, and this thread being particularly appropriate to the forum and interesting when intelligent comments are added ... you could help by not distracting us with babble.

that is close to saying
'use google, you'll find everything you'll need, dont bother asking for our opinions'

maybe i should look up everything first, then post in 3+ line answers with link to sources

and refrain from using smilies

and the wikipedia ofcourse

 

[Brutus013]

that is close to saying
'use google, you'll find everything you'll need, dont bother asking for our opinions'

maybe i should look up everything first, then post in 3+ line answers with link to sources

and refrain from using smilies

and the wikipedia ofcourse

Sounds good to me!

 

[nephildevil]

Sounds good to me!

too boring

hehe

is not gonna happen

 

[Andrew Colglazier]

I would say that the American experience is shaped by the fact that from the moment Europeans came to the New World, they brought firearms with them.

When the Vikings first came, they had none. Their encounters with the Skraelings ended in a stalemate, as iron swords didn't provide a large enough technological advantage to overcome the larger indigenous numbers.

Firearms, however, are what made the difference in taking territory from the Native Americans, whether in South or North America. So one could argue that no specific knives were particularly important or reflected the culture, such as could be said of the scimitar, the kris, the backsward, the rapier, the Claymore, etc.

Firearms have always been present in our culture. Not so elsewhere around the world. There are many iconic "American" firearms. In other cultures, particular types of swords or knives take those spots.

Certainly they were important, they could not be done without on a daily basis. But I would say that, other than the Bowie, no particularly American genre of blade is so wrapped up with our culture as to be iconic.

Andy

 

[mhawg]

I think that the shape, size and names of knives reflect some aspects of culture as does the growing societal fear of knives as a large segment of the population see knives only as weapons and prefer to be 'protected' by law enforcement and allow government to strip the population of anything they consider a weapon. As seen in prison, if you take away all of mans tools or weapons he will just fashion one out of something else.

 

[Halbie]

I think that the shape, size and names of knives reflect some aspects of culture as does the growing societal fear of knives as a large segment of the population see knives only as weapons and prefer to be 'protected' by law enforcement and allow government to strip the population of anything they consider a weapon. As seen in prison, if you take away all of mans tools or weapons he will just fashion one out of something else.

I remember watching a special on TV, shortly after 9/11, where a terrorism expert and ex-CIA operative demonstrated just how feckless the new airport security measures were. He was able to construct about a dozen deadly weapons with typical carry-one items. The credit card sharped to a razor edge was particularly clever, as were the three ways to kill with shoe string and the ball-point-pen-threat.

 

[Thalestin]

I think most knives that wre used for hnting survival etc were just tools that the persons didnt even think about. Much like a hammer, saw or a cup for water. Knives are cool to us because we are knife knuts but for the average joe that uses a knife today (most likely made in China) and the Joes of the past they were nothing special.

I think saying knives basically allowed the pioneers to survive is kind of ignorant. It was the skills of these people that allowed them to survive. Im sure they could have done fine without a knife--axes and hatchets are equally useful tools and most likely more useful.

Just my opinion.

 

[Gollnick]

When I traveled several years ago to Russia to attend the Klinok knife show in Moscow, I learned that the culture of knives there is definitely different. Knives there are seen much more as "legitimate" art. Just as wealthy people in America adorn their homes with great paintings and sculptures, the wealthy Russian man is expected to include some great knives in his personal collection. Great knives are often given as business and personal gifts, often as part of elaborate sets.

George Bush is a knife collector; it's not well-known because some people might find that an inappropriate hobby for a head of state in America. Vladimir Putin is well-known as a knife collector, on the other hand, because that is seen as a very appropriate hobby for a head of state in Russia.

 

[theonew]

all things reflect culture

until filthy multiculturality principles destroy all cultures and turn them into one big gray sludge

"Deep Thoughts with Jack Handey" meets Hitler

 

[shecky]

Knives, like just about anything else, reflect culture. But when looking solely at knives, I'd say it's near impossible to glean many specifics. Like anything else, some designs reflect pure aesthetics, some reflect practicality, most probably a combination of the two.

I'd say it's difficult to make a case that US Americans have been particularly adventurous, resourceful or clever in in any particular field. Except for one: Free enterprise. The US has been extremely successful at creating markets for new ideas. This applies to everything, not just knives. One merely has to look at the wide range of knives available to American consumers today. More variety in shape, size, steel etc than ever before. They don't reflect practical needs, but rather, created needs. The market creates objects of desire, fulfilling our needs well beyond the practical. This is perhaps one of the most visible difference between a free market economy, and a centrally controlled one such as the old Soviet system, where the market may have enough goods to fulfill your needs, but that's all. The US has been a leader where markets are free to fulfill not only our needs, but every desire, too.

So I'd say, if some space alien visitor were to view an American knife store, understanding the function of knives, they might deduce that Americans must have an awfully prosperous existence in order to support such a wide array of items that all essentially do the same thing.