Large Folder

I believe we're talking about trademarks, not copyrights. Here's Spyderco's registration for the thumb hole.

http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=74624039

"Description of Mark: The mark consists of the configuration of a portion of the goods, namely a circular through hole formed in the body of a knife blade"

It's a Section 2(f) registration, which means it's based on "acquired distinctiveness". This would suggest that in 1995, Spyderco told the Trademark Office that their use of a circular thumbhole was substantially exclusive - meaning that virtually no one else was using that design at the time. I'm guessing that because they had continuously and exclsively used the design, had pumped a lot of $ into advertising the spyderco hole and had pretty substantial sales, they were able to convince the Trademark Office that the circular thumb hole, which is purely functional and therefore generic, had become distinctive. The public now associated round thumb holes with Spyderco.
 
"I believe we're talking about trademarks, not copyrights."
I stand corrected as to the terminology. :o Thank you, Brewthunda.
 
FullerH said:
"I believe we're talking about trademarks, not copyrights."
I stand corrected as to the terminology. :o Thank you, Brewthunda.
Click to expand...

No problem. I've been through the trademark registration process a number of times, so my ears perk up when I see this stuff.

Just as a quick quide, there are four basis mechanisms for protecting intellectual property:

Patents = a patent protects an idea. A design idea, a process idea, a chemical compound design idea, etc.

Copyrights = a copyright protects the expression of an idea. So it's the expression, like a drawing or a song or a story or a photo .. . but not the underlying concept. The Who wrote songs about teen angst - you can't copy their song, but you can write your own song about teen angst if you want.

Trademarks = a trademark is a distinctive phrase, design, symbol, shape, sound, smell, etc. that is used to designate the origin of a good. If you're halfway around the world and you see the golden arches, you know it's a McDonalds and you have a very good idea of what the taste and quality of the food will be like, for better or worse. Service marks are the same thing, except they indicate the origin of a service.

Trade Secrets = the fourth major mechanism for protecting intellectual property. Trade secrets are all the IP you develop in-house and keep secret. If Microsoft sends spies into Sun's headquarters and steals their super secret next generation code, Sun will be able to sue them if they actually try to use it.

-Mark
 
Has there ever been a court challenge of the Sprider hole trademark? I'd like to see Spyderco take one of the hole users to court if they feel their trademark would stand up. I question though whether the function of the hole wouldn't get in the way of Spyderco's defense of their trademark. But I'm no lawyer so who knows.
 
There is not much to challenge here. The case is pretty cut 'n dry. It's been all discussed in length in many, many recent posts. The important word here is "circular". An oval (square, pentagon etc.) shaped hole serves the same function but doesn't infringe the trademark. Only a *circular* hole is a distinctive sign of a Spydie. So it is a design parameter, not a function. Just because the grill (air inlet) on the front of a BMW is functional doesn't mean somebody else can just copy it. The kidney shape of if is distinctive to BMW and part of their trademark.
 
Go with the Camillus Maxx. Its over a 5 inch blade made out of D2 steel with a very solid lock and lighting fast deployment with the flippers.

I 've had many a big folders:
Cold Steel Voyagers / Vaquaro Grande - Good knives for money

REKAT Sifu- Awsome but no longer made (kind of heavy) some prone to lock problems.

Tops CQT Magnum - very heavy, no pocket clip (good outdoor knife)

Sog Pentagon 5 inch - Junk!!!- has ton of blade flex screw comes out of lock get a Cold Steel before you buy one of these.

One that is a little smaller but built like a tank is the Buck Strider, go with the spear point, great outdoor knife.
 
i would go with either a :

*cammilus maxx stiletto, just better looking to me than the bowie, or a

*crawford perfigo or kasper folder, if price is no problem, or a

*MT SOCOM elite, or a

*spyderco police
 
Could I take a different approach? For hiking (I'm thinking dayhikes, are we really talking about backpacking?), here are the things I've used my knife for:

1. Food prep: far and away the most frequent use.
2. Light woodworking: whittling fuzz sticks, walking sticks, hot dog sticks
3. Miscellaneous cutting: cordage, moleskin, etc.
4. Protection from bears and cougars: ha ha! Just kidding!

Okay, given the above, here is my thinking:

1. A recurve is contraindicated. Recurves get in the way for most food prep, and can get in the way of some light woodworking.
2. Optimal blade length is 4" max, maybe 4.25" on the outside. You just don't need a big blade for the above things, and indeed too big and it gets in the way. That said, you specified 4.5" minimum, so I'll assume there's something you're doing that I'm not factoring in, and that you know what's best for you.
3. Sharp point: can come in handy for some kinds of food prep
4. Straighter edge is better (since there's no mention of field dressing or the like).
5. Light weight a huge plus for backpacking, not as important for day hiking.

Frankly, given the above, the Spyderco Endura may very well be the best choice going, except for blade size. It's very lightweight, sharp point, reasonably straight edge, 4" blade, extremely versatile for everything from food prep to moleskin to everything in between. The Spyderco Police is a solid option if you want that extra quarter inch reach, and a more robust platform overall. Neither are over 4.5", but the Police is close.

I don't think knives like the Mad Maxx bowie are a great fit here, despite the fact that it's one of my favorite knives. Just way bigger than it needs to be, for my hiking uses at least. But it fits your criteria just fine. Overall, I'd urge you to stay away from curvey recurved blades and handles that are extremely form-fitting (e.g., many fighters with big finger notches), since you need a more versatile handle rather than one that's very secure in just one position.

Maybe what I really should be doing is urging you to carry a second, smaller folder, which will probably end up being the one you actually use and cut with! The Spyderco Calypso Jr or delica are very lightweight, and so quick and easy to deploy and cut with, that it'd be well worth it to clip to your pack.

Joe
 
Joe has a very good point, there. Back BA(Before Arthritis), when I did hiking with Scouts, I carried an older Gerber Folding Hunter and then a Spyderco Police. Both did most of what was needed on those hikes. I kept my Randall 6" Bowie in my pack for heavier work, as needed, since I was setting an example and Scouts weren't supposed to carry fixed-blade knives. If John Greco at grecoknives.com has any left, one great smaller fixed blade for a really good price would be one of his Dangler Series at $35.00 or a Companion for $50.00.
 
Don't forget the Cold Steel XL clip-point Voyager. 5" AUS-8A steel, 5/32" thick. Zytel handle (light weight) for hiking. And a good leverlock lockback (possibly the strongest in its class). All this for under $60. You can't go wrong with that! ;)
 
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