Lastest from NOLA

There is a 150 mile strip of coast that is just....gone. it is something like
9000 square miles that have been wiped out.

We will never hear the full story about what happened.

And there is no way the community could have done anything, a youth gang
of 25 people roaming the streets, and granny is supposed to say something?

No, IMO "Havoc" was declared and the Dogs of War were cut loose.

Yeats "second coming" sums up this situation rather well.
 
Danny, before we find out that you have a grudge against hundreds of thousands of strangers ("those people") because of something that happen to a relative fifteen years ago -- when thousands of them were not even alive, perhaps you should stop and think. The majority were children and the old and you persist in speaking of "choice." The mote in in your eye, brother. Do not chose to have your life defined by hate.
 
I will think about that.
Let me just say that the people where I live were in no way surprised by the actions of the people who stayed behind.
I will honestly consider your suggestion, Thomas.
You can see how it would be hard for me to see them as victims, though, right?
Bad then, bad now. (it looks like it to me)

Didnt Led Zeppelin write something about all this?
 
we will, of course shortly be moving into the lawsuit phase, where those who remained behind will sue anyone they can think of, NOLA city, po-leece, army corps of engr's, federal government, the tobacco industry, ford motors, power company, phone company, etc, seperately and together because someone has to be blamed, and it, of course could not have been the po' folk (and their lawyers, who of course are assisting out of the goodness of their hearts - and a 'small' fee). those that left will come home to find they've been wiped out, either by the weather or looters.

i tend to agree with danny, if they'd started walkin' towards high ground they'd been better off. they can carry babys & walk, of course cain't carry a TV at the same time. they did have a choice, they did not heed instructions. if they were too sick or elderly, where were their families & neighbors? hate to say it, but there are always casualties, and there is no way that everyone can be helped in situations like this.

if you want to give dictatatorial powers to the govt. and pay 90% taxes to pay for men & equipment to wait on standby with fuel, water, and food along with tanks, armoured cars etc, response times could be lowered, but when the railroads, fuel systems and even the roads are gone, even an air-drop would take time to organise & that which could have been set up in the first few days would have been a drop in the ocean, especially when they're being fired on by gangs of sharks.

i used to live in NOLA, not too far from lake ponchartrain, but that was late '60's when it was still safe to walk around at nite almost anywhere in the city. i was also there for the last big one, i was in the coast guard on active duty at the time so i had to stay. all my civvie friends who could headed up north asap before it hit.
 
Aggravating mess. :grumpy:

The genuine victims deserve genuine help, and lots of it. The self proclaimed victims deserve the toe of my size 13 combat boot right square up their a$$.

Heroes? Plenty of 'em. There's Arkansas National Guard folks helping out in the recovery effort who've only been home from Iraq a matter of weeks. We've got 4th Infantry guys from here at Fort Hood, along with a whole slew of helicopters, down there right now. There's doctors dead on their feet from working to save lives, search and rescue teams tackling the grim and dangerous task of going through the wreckage, Red Cross and Salvation Army folks busting their humps to get food and water to people, and untold numbers of private citizens pitching in anyway they can. Heroes? Damn skippy.

It twists my guts to see the "bad actors" getting all the attention. But, that's pretty much how our media works ain't it? The whiners and thugs need to be dealt with, and they will be. My concern is for the decent folks still suffering, and the decent folks doing their best to ease that suffering.

Sarge
 
everybody on the Gulf Coast has been expecting what befell New Orleans (or MUCH worse) the same way most of the US expects California to sail over the western horizon with catastrophic loss of life and property...the folk who live in NO made their choice, if not recently, then long ago, and chose to ignore the risks....and if folk think NO got hit hard by this storm, picture what would have happened had that storm angled in from the east and hit the Greater NO area with the same force the MS coast was hit...the surge is like a bow wave on a giant ship, the highest surge always at the 12-3 o'clock tangent off the storm's direction of travel as the winds spiraling around the core assist the surge, and NO got almost nothing in comparison....had this same force which leveled Gulfport and Biloxi surged inland up into Lake Ponchartrain and the Mississippi River, I doubt much would have been left standing and believe the entire metro area would largely have been swept away including most large buildings failing as the subfloors failed from storm wash...and when California crumbles and falls into the ocean, it will make this current crisis into a footnote in history, both as to loss of life, drain of resources, and the disasterous effect on the US economy....and what you will see happening to forestall such an occurance is exactly what you saw happening to forestall the national disgrace that is New Orleans.....nothing.....and THAT, my friends, is the true tragedy, the tragedy of man who by his refusal to plan for long term goals, may very well procrastinate himself out of existance, if not by fire, flood, or willful act, then by Earth impact or global pandemic..... the only true innocents are the children and the childlike, and I grieve for them, no matter where they live.....the rest of us would do well to heed the warning of this event and get out there to do our best to wake people up the real dangers that effect us....but while you are out there preaching, remember most folk, even the poorest, in NO had a TV and watched it, so don't go out expecting to win many converts.....
 
Danny,

I lived in San Bernardino Ca for many years. I know. We understand there were scum and go alongs left behind in New Orleans. What I and others are saying is that it is not that simple; there were working poor, children, infirm, elderly, etc etc also, and in fact the majority.

We are all of us aware painfully there is a breakdown in our society, and it did not take long in NO.

There was a Mexican slum in Riverside Ca that was famous for rotten actions. There'd be a shooting and then the ambulance would be shot at. The firetrucks were shot at. You couldn't get in.

This isn't new. Now, let's see if American Governmental agencies and our society can focus on how to respond quicker and why there was so much resisitance.

munk
 
Female Katrina victim on CNN, holding MRE, crying: I want my real food!

Eh. When Byron pointed out to me the size of the lake that borders NO, even I, tied as I might be to the idea of defending the domicile, would have evacuated.

(Byron says that, if he had grown up in NO, and couldn't convince his parents to leave before then, he would have been out of town on his 18th birthday!)

My family in Mobile is okay. Some damage, but no injuries.

John
 
Glad to hear all are fine, Spectre.
Would Byron live in San Francisco, I wonder? Or how about San Bernardino Ca. due for a 8 plus Richtor scale quake with the water table just 8 feet below the surface?


munk
 
Well, that's not to say New Orleans wasn't a death trap waiting to happen. If there were a buffer zone of wetlands between the river channel and the levy I understand it would have been much safer.



munk
 
Sometimes in the Bible, God would defeat Israels enemies by causing them to get confused, and fight among themselves.

No matter what the pledge of allegiance says, we are not, in my opinion, one nation under anything at this point.

My response? To listen to wise counsel, discern what I can, try to prepare for what may be, love my family and friends, and try to be in a position to help those who may need and accept it.

I try to anticipate ingratitude, and account for it, and let my anger at it go as much as possible. As an exercise is spiritual discipline, I really need to make it a point to help people whom I expect won't be grateful.


"He who has the most can afford to give the most" Me


Life is very good for me, and I am sorry it is not so for everyone else.

I am so glad it was not as bad as it could have been. I prayed for that, if not a total sparing of the city.

Danny, I am so sorry to hear about your relative... It brings me to tears.

Spectre, glad to hear your folks are OK. How are things progressing for you?

Take care all,

Tom
 
In his book The Control of Nature, John McPhee states that 1 mile if wetlands reduces storm surge 1 inch, and that at the time of writing (1989) 50 miles of wetland had been lost. What is it now? There has been huge draining and development going on in the Delta wetlands in the last 5 years.
It's a very complex puzzle.

Walking out of NO isn't easy, since, as I recall, it is surrounded by marsh and water.
 
IMHO, many cities in the US have a population percentage which is only restrained from mayhem by police presence. When this presence is taken offline, a certain amount of raping, murdering and pillaging will happen - not might happen. It wasn't always this way in America, but four generations of public assistance recipients and "correction" v. "incarceration" are bearing results>>>>>>>> Cliff355

While I agree a certain group will commit crime, that is not the important feature here. What is important is that the majority of displaced people sharing the Convention Center and Superdome with the shooters did not stop them. That response was not there. That is critical and a breakdown of society. The crime has always been here in America.

munk
 
Cliff, if you are now being specific to the shooting at rescuers, you probably make a valid point. Your original statement though was about crime and looting. There has always been crime and looting during disasters.

<<<< When this presence is taken offline, a certain amount of raping, murdering and pillaging will happen ->>>>>> Cliff

I'm most concerned about the lack of vigilanteism towards the shooters. I've spoken very occasionally here about the appalling conditions on the local ndn reservations. Even there though, the elders and families would not have permitted young criminals to drive away rescuers. Many of them are former military.

munk
 
cliff355 said:
... During the San Fransisco earthquake looting was not an issue.

I found this image.

SFEarthquake.jpg


also see http://www.nps.gov/prsf/history/1906eq/lawenfor.htm .
 
Back
Top