Lobster pens?

J

jackknife

Joined
Oct 2, 2004
Messages
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Okay, of late you all know I've been having some problems with my left hand. A combination of arthritis and a tendon sheath issue. My choice of good old pocket knives are limited at best.

But... it seems like one design of a multibladed small knife that I have no problem with is the old fashioned lobster pen. Of all the ridiculous things, I can still operate a Victorinox classic and executive pretty easy due to the easy springs on them. It seems like they have a fair tension to keep them closed or open in the using mode, but the spring presure is very light by other type of pocket knives.

My question is this; how are the springs set up in a lobster pattern pen knife? They seem to be pretty well burried down in there, so I wonder if any of you have a cutaway or drawing of how they work?

I can carry a lockblade and use it with no problem, but last night a friend was over and he had a Victorinx executive, and it reminded me in it's layout of all those nice gentlemens pearl penknives that smiling-knife displays for us to drool shamlessly over. Maybe I'll have to go get a new pattern for the Sunday suit wearing times when a large lockblade soddie is just a little too much.
 
Don't start accumulating knives again, JK, because in a few months you'll start giving them away again. You already have the Classic. Why another Lobster?
 
I don't have a drawing or picture at the moment, but the springs on a lobster are made like the wishbone of a turkey, more or less (assuming the usual type of lobster with blades on both sides, directly opposite each other). This concept is then elaborated as necessary. A rectangular lobster with blade pivots at all four corners would have springs like two narrow wishbones joined at the centers. I hope that's slightly clearer than mud. Or you can think of them like a tuning fork - perhaps that's a bit more accurate image - thus the rectangular lobster above would have a spring like two tuning forks joined at the bases.
 
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zerogee said:
I don't have a drawing or picture at the moment, but the springs on a lobster are made like the wishbone of a turkey, more or less (assuming the usual type of lobster with blades on both sides, directly opposite each other). This concept is then elaborated as necessary. A rectangular lobster with blade pivots at all four corners would have springs like two narrow wishbones joined at the centers. I hope that's slightly clearer than mud. Or you can think of them like a tuning fork - perhaps that's a bit more accurate image - thus the rectangular lobster above would have a spring like two tuning forks joined at the bases.
Click to expand...


Thats a lot clearer than mud, thanks zerogee. I was mainly really curious as to how they were set up. The executive my friend showed me was larger than the classic, not that that takes much, but the spring pressure felt the same. But since everything is burried down inside, I couldn't see how it was set up. Your explainatin made it clear. Thinking about all those nice old beautys of S-k's, it must have taken a master cutler a great deal of skill to assemble one and get it all right. Lots of fine fitting.

Don't worry Voltron, I'm not accumulating again, just curious about a pattern I had never really looked at and knew nothing about.
 
I always though of SAK classics are crawdads. hehe But they have been making a come back in my heart thanks to you.

God Bless
 
Since the actual working spring parts of a lobster are so short, it's probably a good idea to shoot for making them a bit on the weaker side -- with very short springs and short blades you can very easily create a total nail breaker otherwise. IIRC, the springs of the Victorinox lobsters are actually spring wire that is formed and welded together to create the spring assemblies. Although making lobsters by hand like the old Sheffield boys did can't really be anything else but an enormous pain, there is one big saving point: no worries about finetuning to make the springs level to anything in any blade position, because the springs are all buried. They just had to be sure to be very consistent about tang geometry for all the blades and make sure the springs don't deflect far enough while opening/closing any blade to interfere with the opposite spring of the "tuning fork" - so short tangs are good.

Of course, there are exceptions - like this NYKCo pre-Hammer 3 blade serpentine sleeveboard lobster (one of my very favorite patterns - it's a flat whittler basically). But at least at the lobster end they didn't have to worry about springs being level at all positions.

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Now I think I want to go and take apart one of my 2 dollar TSA classics to see how it's layed out in there! But I can see what you mean about in one way it was actually a little easier to for those Sheffield guys to make. With the springs all concealed inside, it could be a little sloppy and if the spring was not too strong, nobody would know if it was not fitted exactly. It's all covered over by the liners and scales.

But I still like to drool over s-k's knives!:D

Beautiful relics from another age, like fine double Purdy shotguns.
 
Ah, here's what I was looking for - from MATSUSAKI KNIVES - the making of a custom 24 blade repro of a Sheffield exhibition lobster pattern (site's in Japanese, but the pictures tell plenty). You can see exactly what is going on with this sort of monster (he says it was done over 3 to 4 months):
making of a custom Sheffield 24 blade exhibition lobster repro -- and finished: 24 blade - all done

Here's another Sheffield exhibition knife he did - a sportsman's knife - one end has the lobster springs setup:
exhibition sportsman's knife -- and finished: Rodgers sportsman's knife repro - all done
 
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zerogee said:
Ah, here's what I was looking for - from MATSUSAKI KNIVES - the making of a custom 24 blade repro of a Sheffield exhibition lobster pattern ...
Click to expand...

It never fails to blow me away how much cool stuff we knife geeks can learn here. :) Thanks, zerogee :thumbup:
 
The lobster pattern is one of my favorites. I have a MOP lobster that I will get pics of and post tonight.....I love the fact that it is two blades, but is very flat so its a nice fit in the pocket. If I am not mistaken, it is an Ulster. Very nice little knife.
 
Thanks to zerogee for the link showing that fascinating lobster knife under construction. Here are some Sheffield examples for you. I hope you enjoy them.

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Anyone have any "modern" lobster knives? I mean, we have Classics, Executives, Ramblers, etc, but other then SAKs, anyone have any by another maker?
 
Ahhh, smiling-knife and his wonderful Sheffield treasures!

That had to be the hight of the cutlery industry of Sheffield, the late 1800's to early 1900's. Looking at s-k's lobsters I think of wood paneled drawing rooms, strait stemed Dunhill pipes, good English blend tobacco, and a nice brandy after a day afield with a nice light side by side Holland and Holland. Can't help it, it's the romantic in me. Now I'll go make myself a nice pot of tea and smoke one of my Petersons.:D

Zerogee, thanks a bunch for the photo's of the lobster under construction. Very informative. Answered all my questions of what's going on in there.:thumbup:

One of the curses of being a machinist is that I'm always wanting to take something apart to see how it's made.
 
My holy grail of antique slipjoints is a Keen Kutter Orange Blossom or Gunstock lobster whittler.
 
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Did you know the Lobster that was posted by ZEROGEE was the original knife named for Thomas Bradley Jrs. (Pres of NYK) Civil War Brigade from Orange County, NY. The ORANGE BLOSSOMS? At one time this knife bore the etch.
NYK%20ORANGE%20BLOSSOM.jpg
 
1fartsmella said:
Did you know the Lobster that was posted by ZEROGEE was the original knife named for Thomas Bradley Jrs. (Pres of NYK) Civil War Brigade from Orange County, NY. The ORANGE BLOSSOMS? At one time this knife bore the etch.
NYK%20ORANGE%20BLOSSOM.jpg
Click to expand...

Thanks for this! I knew the basics of the history of the Orange Blossom pattern, but everyone seemed sure that the four blade gunstock style whittler lobster was the "real" Orange Blossom pattern.

I had seen a cut in an old catalog somewhere that called this particular NYKCo pattern the Orange Blossom - though the image was of the MOP version, so I thought maybe only the pearl version was so named (also, I didn't really consider it definitive, since it wasn't a NYKCo catalog and I couldn't see any blade etch on the cut).

-- Dwight
 
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