Lockbacks may be classified as switchblades!!!!

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Here's a copy of the definition out of the Tx penal code for switch blade.

(11) "Switchblade knife" means any knife that has a blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath, and that:


(A) opens automatically by pressure applied to a button or other device located on the handle; or


(B) opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force.


It is written in broad enough terms to cover a knife that will open with a flick of the wrist. I don't really agree that such a knife should be considered a switch blade and I would not want to be the one to make that arrest and be the test case but I'm sure there's an officer out there somewhere who will.

 
Hey Uncle when you read this if you don't mind put the link to those cases up here or send them to my email. I've been looking for them since you posted this in the Auto forum and would really like to read them.
 
Clay, everything I have read indicates the opposite. Could what I'm reading be propaganda from well intentioned brethren? It could be. But I'll look into it and post my findings here in a few days.
How's that Mate?
 
Uncle, that's fine by me. I'll be interested to see what you come up with. I might add that, from my own experience, this is a pretty safe place to live, and nothing has happened over the past few years to change that perception.

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Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.
 
Brad, here is some info on those cases. I found them at www.lexisone.com under free case law, Texas, switchblade knike. Here is the "best" of the cases:1997 Tex. App. LEXIS 6243, *


IN THE MATTER OF K.E.S.


NO. 01-96-00701-CV


COURT OF APPEALS OF TEXAS, FIRST DISTRICT, HOUSTON


1997 Tex. App. LEXIS 6243

Appellant was charged with "unlawfully, intentionally, and knowingly possessing a switchblade." Appellant argues that the knife was designed only as a folding knife and not as an illegal knife, and there was no evidence to show he knew the knife was capable of being used in a contrary manner.

The Texas Penal Code defines a switchblade as:

any knife that has a blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle of the sheath, and that:

(A) opens automatically by pressure applied to a button or other device located on the handle; or

(B) opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force.

TEX. PENAL CODE ANN. § 46.01(11)(A), (B) (Vernon 1994).

The evidence is legally and factually sufficient. Appellant's mother testified the knife was hers, that she investigated whether it was legal before she purchased the knife, and she believed the knife was legal. Dunn testified that the knife could be opened by centrifugal force, and he demonstrated how, with [*6] just the flick of his wrist, the blade released. No objection was made to Dunn's testimony or his qualifications when the State introduced the knife at trial. Absent an objection, such testimony is sufficient to bring the knife within the language of the statute. See Albert v. State, 659 S.W.2d 41, 43 (Tex. App.-Houston [1st Dist.] 1983, pet. ref'd). Dunn also testified the knife was locked in an open position when appellant first showed it to him. The trial judge, when sitting as the sole trier of facts, is the exclusive judge of the credibility of the witnesses and the weight to be given to their testimony. Joseph v. State, 897 S.W.2d 374, 376 (Tex. Crim. App. 1995). The trial judge apparently chose to believe Dunn's testimony and disbelieve that of appellant's mother.

Hope this helps.
 
No question that CCW laws are arcane, and vary wildly from state to state. Here in Missouri, our antiquated statute prohibits carrying "dirks, daggers, and 'springback' knives", without defining any of them.
This leaves it up to local prosecutors to determine if a particular weapon is illegal or not, based on a number of factors. BTW, the statute also prohibits carrying a "slung shot"; so all you primitive weapons fans better watch out! ( fortunately, you can carry an atlatl....)
 
Clay- no, my post was not directed at you or your post in any way. Had it been I would have adressed you when I wrote it. Rather, it was directed at the current state of affairs in our own nation (USA), and the lengths to which those in power will go to in achieving their goals, the obfuscation of truth being the most common. Frankly, I care little what the laws are in Australia.

[This message has been edited by x39 (edited 03-03-2001).]
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by x39:
Clay- no, my post was not directed at you or your post in any way. Had it been I would have adressed you when I wrote it. Rather, it was directed at the current state of affairs in our own nation (USA), and the lengths to which those in power will go to in achieving their goals, the obfuscation of truth being the most common. Frankly, I care little what the laws are in Australia.</font>
Click to expand...

 
Thanks for clearing that up x39. I'm sorry if I came on a bit strong. I'm afraid my skin has got thinner with age
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and I was a bit quick to react to a perceived insult. I don't worry too much about the laws in the US either, except that they do have the potential to influence lawmakers here.

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Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.
 
Thanks Uncle that's what I've been looking for. I seem to have mixed luck with lexusone.com sometimes I can get a lucky search and find what I'm looking for but the rest of the time I sort through a bunch of cases and find nothing.
 
I just want to point out that the Texas case says nothing about lockbacks. We don't know what kind of knife was involved in that case from what LexisOne shows us.

What the Texas Penal Code is trying to prohibit is "gravity knives". The knife in that case could have been a genuine gravity knife. Or, it could have been a linerlock without a ball bearing.

If it was a lockback, it was probably modified by the owner to open easier. I personally cannot open any lockbacks with "just a flick of the wrist". I can open some models without touching the blade by slamming the knife down hard through the air or shaking the blade partially open and then flicking my wrist, but both of those methods are very difficult. In those cases, the knife doesn't open just by the application of centrifugal force; the opening also requires pracitce, dexterity, and a lot of physical effort.

Since the defense didn't object to the way the knife was opened in this case, you have to assume that the defense attorney was a complete idiot or the knife was not a normal locking folder.

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Cerulean

"My good reason to carry a knife is that God gave me rather weak teeth and rudimentary claws in an evolutionary trade-off." - J.K.M.
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Bikewer:
BTW, the statute also prohibits carrying a "slung shot"; so all you primitive weapons fans better watch out! ( fortunately, you can carry an atlatl....) </font>
Click to expand...

A "slungshot" is not a "slingshot." The "Classic Slungshot" is a large, Monkeyfist type of knot with a wooden, steel or brass ball in the center of the not. Think Macrame with a weight in it. "Sandclubs" are another form that are mentioned in some State Laws with regard to prohibited weapons. All of these being some form of Blackjack or Sap in the eyes of the law.

The very term "Slungshot" hints at the origin. Large steel or lead pellets, grape cannister shot possibly, used in a "slinging" fashion, sort of like a "David Sling" without a detachable projectile.


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"You are no more armed because you are wearing a pistol than you are a musician because you own a guitar." ~Jeff Cooper
And the same goes for a knife...
And, I'm a Usual Suspect.
 
Clay, check out this link and see if it doesn't confirm my assertion that violent crime has greatly increased in Australia since guns were outlawed.
Sorry to be the one to break it to you, mate.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/Lookup/NT00010586
Here are some excerpts:
The number of victims of crime recorded by police in Australia decreased in all offence categories from 1998 to 1999, except for murder (increasing by 20 per cent), theft other than motor vehicle theft (increasing by 8.3 per cent), kidnapping/abduction (increasing by 8.2 per cent) and assault (increasing by 2.1 per cent).

Murder victims increased by 20 per cent, from 285 victims in 1998 to 342 victims in 1999. This translates into an increase in murder victimisation from 15 victims per million people in 1998 to 18 victims per million people in 1999. Of the murder victims in 1999, 21 victims were accounted for by the discovery of 12 bodies in Snowtown, South Australia and nine victims related to two family murder/suicide incidents in Western Australia.
The number of attempted murder victims decreased by 7.5 per cent in Australia, from 387 victims in 1998 to 358 victims in 1999. However, the number of attempted murders involving a firearm increased to a seven-year high of 32 per cent from 1993.


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[This message has been edited by uncle (edited 03-04-2001).]
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Clay Kesting:
I too am proud to live in a democracy
</font>
Click to expand...

I don't know about Australian politics Clay but the U.S. is not a democrocy its a republic. There is a huge differance and it makes me ill to think that the liberals that attack our right to bear arms try to perpetuate this untruth about the U.S.

Arthur D. Washburn
ADW Custom Knives

[This message has been edited by BeowulftheGeat (edited 03-05-2001).]
 
C'mon uncle, fair crack of the whip
smile.gif
, you can hardly use these figures to support your claim that violent crime is "skyrocketing" in Australia. If you take out the 21 deaths due to serial and family murders the increase comes down to about 12% over the year before. In any case the per capita rate is still only 18 per million (what is it in the US?) hardly enough to have me looking over my shoulder every time I go out
smile.gif
. In any case, if you check the statistics in the second link in my earlier post you will see that from 1982 to 1992 the murder rate was always above 300 per year with a peak in 1987-88 of 379. Note too that during those years the rate was always above 18 per million. Clearly 1998 was a particularly good year. Then there is this figure which you neglected to quote: "The number of robberies involving a firearm has also decreased to a seven-year low of 6.3 per cent compared to 16 per cent in 1993". Hardly a picture of rampant crime
smile.gif
.

To really be able to see a trend you would need to be able to graph all the figures for the last 10 years. My gut feeling is that you will always have fluctuations in both directions and that none of the changes in the past few years have been influenced, either one way or the other, by the firearm control laws.

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Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.



[This message has been edited by Clay Kesting (edited 03-05-2001).]
 
Clay, I know you love your country and want to see the best in it. But, any statistician seeing even a 5% increase in a crime category of a population of 18,000,000 would be concerned let alone a 20% increase. And if you want to discount the murder suicide figure then you have to eliminate such figures from all years in order to make things consistant. But, I don't think you can do that, because murder is murder. And then you've got the fact that attempted murder WITH A GUN rose to a 7 year high of 32%.
The fact is that outlawing the means of individual self protection constitutes an immoral infringement upon the natural rights of individuals without truely advancing the stated goal of reducing crime. It is an element of tyranny and enslavement, however slow or incremental the process. What's next, outlawing automobiles? A lot more deaths because of them than because of guns. Doctors and nurses? More deaths from "medical misadventure" than from guns. No, freedom means a certain amount of risk, and those unwilling to live with the risk will live as prisoners, no matter how big the prison.
The outlawing of guns and knives of any type is in reality either the covert plan of tyrants or the incremental encrochment by feminized, nanny-state professional politicians, whatever country.

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Sorry uncle, I think you've missed my point. The fact is that the murder rate has stayed very stable over the past 20 years. I can only find figures from 1973 to 1992 (my second link) but in that period there were between 265 and 379 murders a year and the rate was never less than 19 per million (you haven't told me the rate for the US
smile.gif
). On that basis the 1999 figures represent a slight improvement. I do however feel justified in at least removing the 12 serial deaths from those figures as they had happened during previous years. As I said before 1998 was a particularly good year and would not be on a "line of best fit".

As for the increase in attempted murders with a firearm it is a fairly meaningless figure in isolation. Was the previous highest figure 31%? The fact that it is part of a general reduction in attempted murders will also affect that proportion.

As I said before, you (and I) don't have enough information to draw any hard and fast conclusions. It is not statistically viable to take two years in isolation and use them to predict trends.

One last point for you to consider I live here
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. If there was this supposedly huge increase in violent crime, I think I would be aware of it. I read the paper daily, watch the television news and current affairs etc. and I have seen no indication of any great escalation of violence. Gun control laws might be all that you say they are, but I'm afraid you will need to find an example other than Australia to prove your point.

Take care,


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Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.

[This message has been edited by Clay Kesting (edited 03-05-2001).]
 
This is heading for Knives,News and your Views.

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AKTI# A000150
NC Custom Knifemakers Guild member
NC Knife Knuts member
 
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