Looking for a specific kind of tanto point...

[Khalnath]

Well, this question got no responses when I posted it in the Cold Steel Tanto thread, so I thought I'd post a new thread for it.

Does anyone else out there make knives with the same style of tanto point that Cold Steel uses on their fixed blade tantos? I really find this style of point visually appealling, even though Cold Steel as a company is a bunch of wieners.

Specifically, I'm talking about a v-ground tanto point with an angled transition between the main edge and the tip edge, where the spine has absolutely no clip or taper. Like this:

Some backwards curving in the Japanese style is acceptable, but ideally the spine would be ruler straight.

I welcome opinions of why people prefer tantos with tapered or clipped spines to this style also. I don't understand why this kind of point is not more common.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

My tanto Sebenza has that sort of point, so I imagine the one-piece tanto he makes (rarely) does also. The main edge is hollow ground, the forward edge is convex. There is no swedge. The spine tapers to the point from about 3/16".

 

[Khalnath]

Yeah, the spine tapers. That disqualifies it.

The most important thing is that there is absolutely no spine taper or clip whatsoever.

The spine must either be straight from the grip to the tip or curve backwards (away from the edge).

 

[johnu2]

They have what is called an "Americanized tanto" tip. Here are two that don't taper. A Kabar and a Spyderco Bob Lum. Most of the examples that I can think of taper towards the point.

 

[AfterTFD]

If you want a cold steel tanto why not buy a cold steel tanto?

Whether you intended to or not what you asking is if we know of any cold steel knockoffs that aren't too crappy. Any knife you find with a blade and point like that is ripping off cold steel's design.

Surly I must be jesting or mistaken, you might be thinking. After all, the tanto is an old Japanese style isn't it? Sure, but not with that point. They looked more like this-

 

[Khalnath]

They have what is called an "Americanized tanto" tip. Here are two that don't taper. A Kabar and a Spyderco Bob Lum. Most of the examples that I can think of taper towards the point.

Aha, thank you, that was what I was looking for. But why is the taper so much more common?

AfterTFD: I'm not looking for "A Cold Steel Tanto". For that matter, I already own a Recon Tanto (one of the Carbon V ones) that I am quite happy with. I'm looking for other knives with this style blade. Using the same style point as someone else does not automatically make your knife a ripoff.

 

[AfterTFD]

Using the same style point as someone else does not automatically make your knife a ripoff.

Copying and reselling commercial designs is exactly what makes something a ripoff. Insignificant changes to avoid copyright/trademark lawsuits do not purge oneself of the immorality of intellectual theft.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

I believe Bob Lum first introduced that tip to the American market and CS popularized it. It IS an old Japanese design, just not a common one, and not what had been referred to as a "tanto".

 

[Khalnath]

Copying and reselling commercial designs is exactly what makes something a ripoff. Insignificant changes to avoid copyright/trademark lawsuits do not purge oneself of the immorality of intellectual theft.

Perhaps I am not making myself clear. I am not looking for knives that are very similar to the Cold Steel offerings. I'm looking for knives that are different designs that have the same kind of tip. The Ka-Bar tanto and the Spyderco Bob Lum are good examples. I'd also be curious about a folder with that sort of geometry for example (which Cold Steel's tanto folders do not have). Like you said, if I wanted a Cold Steel tanto, I would buy one. For that matter, I DID.

I believe Bob Lum first introduced that tip to the American market and CS popularized it. It IS an old Japanese design, just not a common one, and not what had been referred to as a "tanto".

Interesting. Do you know what the old Japanese design WAS called? Does Bob Lum have any other designs with this style of blade? I like the looks of that Spyderco.

 

[AfterTFD]

I'm looking for knives that are different designs that have the same kind of tip. The Ka-Bar tanto and the Spyderco Bob Lum are good examples.

I get it now, you're looking for something that's generally visually the same. Unless my eyes are deceiving me neither of those knives actually has the same kind of tip as the cold steel tanto. The angle of the spydie tanto is significantly different from the cs tanto and the whole thing is a lot more rounded. The tip geometry of the kabar is only really similar if you're looking at the visual outline. They're also both double-edged, which in my experience makes a big difference at the point.

 

[J85909266]

He just likes the angular tanto point with nice, straight spines. I actually agree. I think any clipping or dropping of the spine really ruins the lines.

 

[Lycosa]

Esav,
Nice blades! Would you sell me the Reeve tanto? lol. Is that Strider blade satin? Very nice. Thanks for the pics.
Lycosa

 

[johnu2]

Aha, thank you, that was what I was looking for. But why is the taper so much more common?

My guess is that it makes it easier to handle when dealing with more precise work whereas the ones you are after are more commonly found on combat knives

Interesting. Do you know what the old Japanese design WAS called?

Most people just refer to it as a traditional tanto tip. The Americanized tanto basically borrows the same tips on katana swords, wakizashis etc and modifies to make it more angular.

both double-edged, which in my experience makes a big difference at the point.

I'm pretty sure the top edges are just false edges

 

[Esav Benyamin]

I'd also be curious about a folder with that sort of geometry for example (which Cold Steel's tanto folders do not have).

Some years ago, CS made a series of folders with an augmented linerlock, what they then called an ultralock -- not the axis-style ultralock they use today -- and the ultralock tanto was straight-backed, with no drop to the point. Tough little knife with a 3" blade.

Very rarely will you find these even on the secondary market.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Lycosa, of course the Sebenza is not for sale. Actually, it's my usual EDC. I think I was at least the fourth owner, it came to me totally gunked up but easily cleaned, naturally, and is now so smooth, it almost opens too fast.

The Strider was modified by a previous owner: satin blade and the G-10 was sanded smooth. Ordinarily, that would have been a deal-breaker since I like rough G-10, but the Strider handle geometry is so good, it's still non-slip.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Aha, thank you, that was what I was looking for. But why is the taper so much more common?

My guess is that it makes it easier to handle when dealing with more precise work whereas the ones you are after are more commonly found on combat knives

That's a great guess and makes a lot of sense. Thank you!

 

[Esav Benyamin]

By the way, Khalnath, what you are referring to as taper, most of us call drop where the back of a blade angles down toward the tip.

Taper is the progressive thinning of a blade or a tang, generally as it recedes from the bolster, i.e., distal taper. Tapering a blade gives a thinner point for slicing or penetration and tapering a tang lightens it to put more weight forward towards the blade.

 

[Khalnath]

By the way, Khalnath, what you are referring to as taper, most of us call drop where the back of a blade angles down toward the tip.

I stand humbly corrected. Thank you.

My guess is that it makes it easier to handle when dealing with more precise work whereas the ones you are after are more commonly found on combat knives

That makes sense. But then, I've never really thought of any kind of Americanized Tanto, with the sharp bevel between the edges, would make a good utility knife. To me what we're discussing is pretty looking weapon-type knives. When it comes to utility blades I'm partial to drop points.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

It depends on what you use a utility knife for. I've used tanto points for art work: the secondary point is great for trimming edges. A sheepsfoot or wharncliff will do it, but may stick into the material or cut too deep if you're not careful.

Check out the Graham Brothers' Razel. The name comes from razor-chisel, but the blades are all v-ground, including the forward edge. Look strange at first, but also great for utility once you get used to them. http://www.grahamknives.com/

 

[johnu2]

and some people just prefer a tanto point