Looking for advice on sharpening an M390 push dagger

[Kerneldrop]

Glad it worked out.
There are diamond rods for it that'll sharpen your M390.
Some prefer a larger surface and a surface they can put some force into....but i imagine those rods will sharpen well.

Is what you'll find, is that once the blades are sharp they can be kept sharp for a long time by honing often on the Sharpmaker.
I just sent off three knives to Traditional. They need more work than I can handle.
I'll maintain those new edges with the Sharpmaker.

 

[Valheru]

Wow sweet. So the instructions that came with it said 40 degrees and I sharpened pretty much all my blades using that. They got super sharp. Hopefully I shouldn’t have been using 30 degrees? What do you use? (Wish I’d thought to ask before…)

do you use a strop too?

 

[Kerneldrop]

Wow sweet. So the instructions that came with it said 40 degrees and I sharpened pretty much all my blades using that. They got super sharp. Hopefully I shouldn’t have been using 30 degrees? What do you use? (Wish I’d thought to ask before…)

do you use a strop too?

So that’s 20 degrees per side and 15 degrees per side. You use the angle that better removes the sharpie marker you draw on your edge ;-)

15 better lines up with Traditional’s sharpening.
20 or 15 better lines up with my David Mary edges, depending on what he does.
So just all depends

 

[Valheru]

Hmm… that went right over my head. Hoping I didn’t mess my knives up sharpening them all at 20 degrees per side (40 total). I watched the Sharpmaker video on bladehq and they didn’t really specify. I’m going to pick this thing up that they recommended and a strop when I can figure out which one to get and some ultra fine sharpening rods

https://www.bladehq.com/item--Richard-Kell-Solid-Brass-Bevel--16412

Hmm… now that I think about it, it seems like sharpening at 20 degrees per side would remove less material than 15 per side. So it would seem that I have the option to go to 15 if that’s what I should’ve done originally.

The analogy that comes to mind is getting a haircut. You can look in the mirror and decide to cut it shorter but you can’t decide to make it longer

 

[Kerneldrop]

You didn't mess anything up... it's just shaping metal. Simple as that.
Shape it one way, reshape it another way, shape it back, transform it anyway you want really.
If you mess it up beyond your repair abilities, send it off to Traditional and it'll come back corrected. (2 of the 3 I just sent him need repair)
Then you start the cycle all over again.

I wouldn't mess with an angle gadget when you're options are 15 or 20. Draw a line with a sharpie along the edge. Sharpen it a couple strokes....see if the sharpie is removed along the edge. it's as simple as that. If it's not removed then you know that's not the current angle. So you're options are to either rebevel it to the angle choices you have (15 or 20) or change angles to match the current bevel.
Now I do have some plastic angle blocks so I can visualize what 15 and 20 look like...those have been the most helpful. Naturally my eyes and hands want to hold about 10-12 degrees. So 20 for me was a learning process.
I got them off amazon. The blocks can create any angle from 5-90 degrees so you can see what that looks like.

My recommendation is to read through some posts on this site, or google, to get an idea on what exactly is taking place when you sharpen and hone.
Build that knowledge foundation, then you can work on the actual sharpening-mechanics.

 

[000Robert]

^^^

Well he said that price was no object. I recommended a Wicked Edge. I get perfect edges every single time. So evidently price is an object.

 

[Kerneldrop]

Bezos would have bought the Wicked Edge, no question.

I would buy one if I could hide it from my wife.

 

[Valheru]

Hey 000Robert so my hesitation on the Wicked Edge wasn’t so the price but that I’d not be able to figure out how to use it. How do you think the learning curve would be, assuming basically no knowledge of sharpening?

I just looked on the Wicked website and they have the WE130 for only $649 but the Pro Pack 3 is $1,645. I wonder if I need to get that pack or if the “regular” one would have everything a beginner needs.

For only $1,100 I could get the Generation 3 Pro.

*head spinning*

Thanks again for the help

 

[Valheru]

Do you guys use leather strops?

 

[Kerneldrop]

I wonder most about the time commitment for the guided systems.
For example, this morning I took a Cutco 9" filet knife from scratching skin to razor-hair-shaving-phonebook-slicing sharp in 90 seconds on a HF bench grinder and paper wheels.

As an alternative the diamond kit from KME is $200.
Then use the other money on stones and machines and learn all the techniques...

 

[toker]

Hey 000Robert so my hesitation on the Wicked Edge wasn’t so the price but that I’d not be able to figure out how to use it. How do you think the learning curve would be, assuming basically no knowledge of sharpening?

IMO, there is less of a learning curve on the Wicked Edge than there is to the Sharpmaker. You simply set the angle you want on each side of the blade and then sharpen the knife. You go from lower grits to higher grits. The only learning curve comes when you have longer blades due to the sharpening radius of the arms. If you use a sharpie on the edge, you'll see exactly what the sharpening arc is.

The biggest benefit of the the Wicked Edge over the Sharpmaker is when you want to reprofile the blade angle. The stones on the Sharpmaker aren't really made for reprofiling.

I just looked on the Wicked website and they have the WE130 for only $649 but the Pro Pack 3 is $1,645. I wonder if I need to get that pack or if the “regular” one would have everything a beginner needs.

The WE130 (plus base) is probably more than enough for what you are looking to do. You can also get it for cheaper than the $649 MSRP. If you want to buy some additional stones, you can go for the 800/1000, but 600 grit is more than enough for razor sharp edges. If you want to buy some strops, you can do that. I like to have a working edge, so the only time I'll take time to use a strop is on some of my nicer folders.

 

[000Robert]

Hey 000Robert so my hesitation on the Wicked Edge wasn’t so the price but that I’d not be able to figure out how to use it. How do you think the learning curve would be, assuming basically no knowledge of sharpening?

I just looked on the Wicked website and they have the WE130 for only $649 but the Pro Pack 3 is $1,645. I wonder if I need to get that pack or if the “regular” one would have everything a beginner needs.

For only $1,100 I could get the Generation 3 Pro.

*head spinning*

Thanks again for the help

It's really pretty intuitive. But I'm more mechanically inclined than most people so it's simple to me. Wait until the new model comes out in a couple of months or so. I can't say much about it yet, but it's nice! It will probably become their most popular unit. A lot of the price is in the diamond stones. Once you have the stones everything else doesn't seem so expensive. And the stones are actually two sets of two grits. Each stone of the pair have different grits on each side. So you are actually buying four stones.
Everything that I have bought from Wicked Edge has been very high quality.
The $1645 price includes the case. You don't have to buy the case if you don't want to. I have the case and it is nice. Whether it has everything you need depends on your needs. I have every adapter that they offer and they are great! If your needs are pretty simple and you don't want to spend much money on a sharpening kit, then wait a couple of months until the new unit comes out.
Me and some other guys have been Beta testing the new Wicked Edge WE60 Series sharpener for a couple of weeks or so now, and I love it! Sorry, but I can't say much about it yet. I started a thread about it here on BFC and pretty much have my article on the new unit written with plenty of photos. I will upload it to the thread when I am given the go ahead.

 

[toker]

Me and some other guys have been Beta testing the new Wicked Edge WE60 Series sharpener for a couple of weeks or so now, and I love it! Sorry, but I can't say much about it yet. I started a thread about it here on BFC and pretty much have my article on the new unit written with plenty of photos.

Is it an upgrade over the existing models?

 

[000Robert]

Bezos would have bought the Wicked Edge, no question.

I would buy one if I could hide it from my wife.

Bezos? Come on, you probably have a flipper that costs more.

 

[000Robert]

Is it an upgrade over the existing models?

Yes. It's not really an upgrade of the WEGO 50, but is a brand new redesigned unit. Part of the problem with saying anything is that there may still be changes made to the final product. So I have to wait until I know exactly how everything will be done. Every time I find out something new I have to change or add to my article. Which is fine with me.
Clay has a short video about it from the last Blade Show with Big Daddy Unlimited on YT. I'm not sure if he made any other videos except some unlisted videos that he made for the Beta testers.

 

[000Robert]

IMO, there is less of a learning curve on the Wicked Edge than there is to the Sharpmaker. You simply set the angle you want on each side of the blade and then sharpen the knife. You go from lower grits to higher grits. The only learning curve comes when you have longer blades due to the sharpening radius of the arms. If you use a sharpie on the edge, you'll see exactly what the sharpening arc is.

The biggest benefit of the the Wicked Edge over the Sharpmaker is when you want to reprofile the blade angle. The stones on the Sharpmaker aren't really made for reprofiling.


The WE130 (plus base) is probably more than enough for what you are looking to do. You can also get it for cheaper than the $649 MSRP. If you want to buy some additional stones, you can go for the 800/1000, but 600 grit is more than enough for razor sharp edges. If you want to buy some strops, you can do that. I like to have a working edge, so the only time I'll take time to use a strop is on some of my nicer folders.

I bought the 50/80 stones and they help a lot for reprofiling blades. But they can hog off a lot of steel and leave some deep gouges. So when I use them I stop about a mm or so from the apex and go to my 100 stones until I'm near the edge apex and then go to the 200 stones. That way I'm removing the gouges while I'm approaching the edge apex. But the 50/80 stones save a lot of time! I hated myself for not buying them sooner.

 

[Valheru]

Well you guys have convinced me on the Wicked Edge. I was literally about to pull the trigger today, but was just trying to decide between the WE130 and the Generation 3 Pro.

The G3P is obviously a little more more expensive, but it seems to come with a base and more stones. Also, your example 000Robert sounds like something I'll probably never need to do:

It got the 'edge' over the Gen 3 Pro because I could profile asymmetrical edges with the WE130

But it sounds like maybe I should just wait on the new model you're talking about and roll with my Sharpmaker until then. Do you know if the pricing will be similar? i.e. between ~$650 and ~$1,100

By the way, my initial comment about "price is no object" was in the context of knife sharpeners in that price range, not life in general I live in a little house, drive a modest car, and I don't even own a watch let alone a rolex. But spending a grand on a machine that will let me sharpen knives for years or even decades is something that I want to get a really good one so I'm not regretting not doing so and wanting to get a higher end in a few years

 

[toker]

Yes. It's not really an upgrade of the WEGO 50, but is a brand new redesigned unit. Part of the problem with saying anything is that there may still be changes made to the final product. So I have to wait until I know exactly how everything will be done. Every time I find out something new I have to change or add to my article. Which is fine with me.
Clay has a short video about it from the last Blade Show with Big Daddy Unlimited on YT. I'm not sure if he made any other videos except some unlisted videos that he made for the Beta testers.

I'd be interested in seeing it, but I'm most likely not going to upgrade since my current setup does everything I need it to.

I bought the 50/80 stones and they help a lot for reprofiling blades. But they can hog off a lot of steel and leave some deep gouges. So when I use them I stop about a mm or so from the apex and go to my 100 stones until I'm near the edge apex and then go to the 200 stones. That way I'm removing the gouges while I'm approaching the edge apex. But the 50/80 stones save a lot of time! I hated myself for not buying them sooner.

Same here. I spent a few hours reprofiling a few M390 blades with the 100/200. The last knife I did with the 50/80 was very easy. I wish I had purchased it sooner.

The G3P is obviously a little more more expensive, but it seems to come with a base and more stones. Also, your example 000Robert sounds like something I'll probably never need to do:

It got the 'edge' over the Gen 3 Pro because I could profile asymmetrical edges with the WE130

It's nice to have the option for different angles on each side of the blade. I have a few Emersons that have a chisel edge. The blade height can also affect the angles needed. A lot of the time, I have to set the left angle at 1 degree lower than the right angle due to the blade thickness.

 

[000Robert]

Well you guys have convinced me on the Wicked Edge. I was literally about to pull the trigger today, but was just trying to decide between the WE130 and the Generation 3 Pro.

The G3P is obviously a little more more expensive, but it seems to come with a base and more stones. Also, your example 000Robert sounds like something I'll probably never need to do:

It got the 'edge' over the Gen 3 Pro because I could profile asymmetrical edges with the WE130

But it sounds like maybe I should just wait on the new model you're talking about and roll with my Sharpmaker until then. Do you know if the pricing will be similar? i.e. between ~$650 and ~$1,100

By the way, my initial comment about "price is no object" was in the context of knife sharpeners in that price range, not life in general I live in a little house, drive a modest car, and I don't even own a watch let alone a rolex. But spending a grand on a machine that will let me sharpen knives for years or even decades is something that I want to get a really good one so I'm not regretting not doing so and wanting to get a higher end in a few years

Many people love the Gen3 Pro. I bought the WE130 in the Pro Pack III for the extra versatility. Then I added the other adapters and stones and stuff later as I could afford them. I also got the aluminum base to save a little money. I love it and it's not as heavy as the Granite base.
The WE60 series should be cheaper than the larger units. Depending on the model and upgrades that you choose, I would guess from $600 - $900, but that's just a guess. I really don't know much about marketing and stuff and I'm pretty sure that everything is still all made in the USA.

I got ya on the 'price is no object'. I also believed after my research that I would end up with a Wicked Edge anyway so I may as well buy it first and save myself time and money for trying other systems. But WE has their own forum and also the Knowledge Base that has much info to help people understand how to use the sharpeners.

 

[000Robert]

Same here. I spent a few hours reprofiling a few M390 blades with the 100/200. The last knife I did with the 50/80 was very easy. I wish I had purchased it sooner.

The 50/80 stones were a life saver for reprofiling my chisels also! I had my chisels messed up a little from freehand sharpening them with the cheap chisel sharpener that has the wheels on the bottom. The 50/80 stones saved me so much time reprofiling my chisels!! Reprofiling them with my 100/200 stones would have taken much longer. Now I have chisels with perfect edges. I'll bet my chisels are sharper than most peoples knives.