Looking for advise on steel

[BD_01]

First, buy a Spyderco Sharpmaker ($60-ish) or if you’re on a reall tight budget a Smith’s CCD4 ($20-ish).

Then, buy a knife with 8Cr13, AUS-8, VG10 or 154cm.

Use, sharpen, repeat. Being able to keep your knife sharp is paramount and will make your experience with the knife much more gratifying.

Good experiences with AUS-8 & a CCD4 helped launch me into the world of knives. Worry about costlier knives and “super steels” later.

Dean’s Ontario Rat recommendation is a good one. Delica/Endura are always good recommendations, albeit a bit costlier.

 

[Tommy-Chi]

I'm a complete knife newbie....

Obviously I'm looking for the ideal knife, which I think that starts with finding the best steel. I've been reading about which steel is hardest, has best edge retention, most corrosion proof, easiest to sharpen, etc. But more knowledge comes with more confusion

For me a knife is a tool. I'm not the type of guy that handles his stuff with great care. The ideal steel for me isn't just razor sharp but can take lots of abuse.

Cutting boxes, plastic (buckets), rubber, electric wiring, tin cans.
Prying open paint cans. Some chopping. Some digging. Scraping some dirt away, etc

I have vitually no experience sharpening and am planning to buy one of those small $10 sharpners.

I've read and watched quite a few reviews and most are totally useless. Endless talking about esthetics, weight, unboxings, etc. But hardly every real cutting tests. Or even less bending and chipping tests. Remarks like it feels good in my hand but never anything about slipping with wet, dirty hands. I often get the impression most reviewers never really use knives but just look at them like a stamp collection.



But I'm drifting of… I'll try to pick my own folder with the steel as a starting point. The way I understand steel is very often a trade-off. That's why I'm not asking for the perfect steel. But I would like to know which steels certainly outperform other steels.

For example I've read that CPM-S35VN (vastly) outclasses S30V, S60V, S90V, 154, 420HC and M390 steel.
Source: http://blog.bladeops.com/what-is-cpm-s35vn-steel.html

I would be most grateful for similar little comparative lists.
A list of utter junk steel to avoid is very helpful too.
I also welcome suggestions on which steel fits best with my demands.
I'm simply overwelmed by the 1000s of knives to chose from. But if could focus on just 1-3 types of steel, thins would be much easier for me.


Blades come in many thicknesses. Ignoring weight and price, what are the advantages of a thick blade? They are stronger when comparing the same steel. But at what cost does that come? Harder to cut things? I've seen 2mm thich blades and 5mm blades. As I wrote I have zero experience but it's just my feeling that for peeling an apple the 2mm blade is better....

Thanks for any advise!

Regardless of what you read in the BladeOps article satisfy yourself and go an buy a knife made out of S35VN, S90V, or M390 steel and a KME sharpener with diamond stones.

You will be starting at the high end, and this will rub many the wrong way, but it's what I did. Knock yourself out.

Go very very slow with the sharopening....maybe work on a knife that you are going to throw out to get the hang of it before tackling your new knife.

 

[Blunt Axe]

My pick for a first knife is my first folder, a Kershaw blackout 1550T i like the serrated blade but it also comes non serrated.
A 3.25 inch (8.4 cm) Blade Matl. is Sandvik 14C28N and is DLC coated,Handle is Glass filled Nylon.
Price under $100 US this makes it a really good choice for EDC.

I have tiny knife with a serrated blade which is hardly an inch. Built quality is crap, but it cuts surprisingly well. I would really consider a serrated blade for very cheap blades, because for me it would be throw away knives because I don't have the skills (and patience) to sharpen them.
That said I certainly don't rule them out as an option. What are the pros and cons of serrated blades?

The reason I suggested the Kabar Dozer or Ontario Rat is because AUS-8 is easy to learn to sharpen and both are good bangs for the buck.
S35vn is a good steel but not for $10 sharpeners.

What about CPM-M4? Looks like a very nice steel to me.

Been studying steels a bit more and if the info I found is correct then CPM-M4 is the ideal steel for me. Easy to sharpen, keeps a usable edge for a long time and it's though.
Unfortunately I can't find many EDCs with that steel.
VG-10 is second on my list. Looks a bit less in all respects but still good and lot's of EDCs use that steel.
So likely I'll buy a knife made with one of those steels.

The other steels on my list ranked on my preference: (high to low)
S30V/ZDP189, 154CM/ATS 34, 9Cr17MOV/440C/AUS-10

 

[Blunt Axe]

Good experiences with AUS-8 & a CCD4 helped launch me into the world of knives. Worry about costlier knives and “super steels” later.

The reasons of I picked those super steels was because they had a reasonable price (so why buy crap) and I assumed they were used in knives with an good built quality which is important to me. But I've learned most super steels are super hard to sharpen...

The ideal for me is a good steel and a $10 sharpener. I know many advise a more costly sharpener and I'm not totally ignoring that. But I looked at them and I think I don't have the patience and skills for them.
For me the ideal looks this: A good all-round knife with an above decent blade. That's enough for most of the time.
When I know I have to cut a lot, I take Link Removed, read the site rules with me and when needed I quickly sharpen my knife.
What I also like about that sharpener is that it has angles. That's way I can't mess up things as easily as with the Spyderco Sharpmaker...

 

[ponykid]

The reasons of I picked those super steels was because they had a reasonable price (so why buy crap) and I assumed they were used in knives with an good built quality which is important to me. But I've learned most super steels are super hard to sharpen...

The ideal for me is a good steel and a $10 sharpener. I know many advise a more costly sharpener and I'm not totally ignoring that. But I looked at them and I think I don't have the patience and skills for them.
For me the ideal looks this: A good all-round knife with an above decent blade. That's enough for most of the time.
When I know I have to cut a lot, I take *** with me and when needed I quickly sharpen my knife.
What I also like about that sharpener is that it has angles. That's way I can't mess up things as easily as with the Spyderco Sharpmaker...

those sharpeners will Reprofile your edge more than likely the knife you buy wont have the same angle on the edge bevel . I can understand not wanting to invest the time in other systems. I have tried some myself and it is very frustrating and time consuming. But youre asking people who have a passion for this stuff so the answers you get probably wont be something you listen to or follow anyway.

Most flippers have bearings and I see bearing knives as light duty not heavy duty tools.

I would suggest you look at Cold Steel knives. they have many options in good solid all around performing steel and the bang for your buck is very high. the Triad lock will stand up to huge amounts of abuse as well. something like the Lawman . or the Voyager series.

It seems like you have already done some research and know a good bit about steel and edge geometry and the never ending game of compromise and balance in the knife world so I think you have really already answered your questions don't you think?

 

[Dean51]

I have tiny knife with a serrated blade which is hardly an inch. Built quality is crap, but it cuts surprisingly well. I would really consider a serrated blade for very cheap blades, because for me it would be throw away knives because I don't have the skills (and patience) to sharpen them.
That said I certainly don't rule them out as an option. What are the pros and cons of serrated blades?


What about CPM-M4? Looks like a very nice steel to me.

Been studying steels a bit more and if the info I found is correct then CPM-M4 is the ideal steel for me. Easy to sharpen, keeps a usable edge for a long time and it's though.
Unfortunately I can't find many EDCs with that steel.
VG-10 is second on my list. Looks a bit less in all respects but still good and lot's of EDCs use that steel.
So likely I'll buy a knife made with one of those steels.

The other steels on my list ranked on my preference: (high to low)
S30V/ZDP189, 154CM/ATS 34, 9Cr17MOV/440C/AUS-10

The reasons of I picked those super steels was because they had a reasonable price (so why buy crap) and I assumed they were used in knives with an good built quality which is important to me. But I've learned most super steels are super hard to sharpen...

The ideal for me is a good steel and a $10 sharpener. I know many advise a more costly sharpener and I'm not totally ignoring that. But I looked at them and I think I don't have the patience and skills for them.
For me the ideal looks this: A good all-round knife with an above decent blade. That's enough for most of the time.
When I know I have to cut a lot, I take *** with me and when needed I quickly sharpen my knife.
What I also like about that sharpener is that it has angles. That's way I can't mess up things as easily as with the Spyderco Sharpmaker...

Quoting you,
M4 is not a steel I would want to sharpen on a $10 sharpener. I think you'll just be back posting "Why can't I sharpen my M4 xxxxx on my $10 sharpener. You'll most likely wind up unhappy with your new M4 wonder.
Work your way up to M4, S90v etc when you have more patience and are ready for better sharpening gear.

 

[GermanyChris]

Buy a small pocketable fixed blade.

I do everything you want to do almost daoda with a folder but if my Jeep is close I switch over to a fixed blade

 

[115Italian]

Rat 1 in aus 8 would suit you well. Stainless that holds a decent edge and can be sharpened easily.

 

[sXePhenomenal]

Oh boy

 

[RBid]

If I were trying to get it all done with one knife, I’d probably go with an Ontario Rat 1 in D2. It’s a high performing steel, at a low enough price point that you won’t be depressed when the wiring or rocks (digging) chip or otherwise jack up the blade.

If you prefer to jump straight into premium, maybe try a Benchmade Griptilian in G-10 and CPM 20CV steel. Fair warning: that steel is going to be miserable to use once it fills, if you don’t invest the sharpening side of things.

 

[allenC]

Obviously I'm looking for the ideal knife, which I think that starts with finding the best steel.

There is no "best" steel.
Every reputable knife company (Spyderco, Benchmade, Buck, Kershaw, Victorinox, etc...) uses good steel for their blades.
Some are tougher. Some are easier to sharpen. Some hold an edge a bit longer. But none are truly junk.


Cutting boxes, plastic (buckets), rubber, electric wiring, tin cans.
Prying open paint cans. Some chopping. Some digging. Scraping some dirt away, etc

It sounds like you're looking for a multi-tool.
Multi-tools are great because you can keep your main blade sharp and use it exclusively for cutting things while using the other tools for non-cutting tasks.


I have vitually no experience sharpening and am planning to buy one of those small $10 sharpners.

A simple Arkansas stone will satisfy 99% of your sharpening needs, and a good size one will last for decades.
Having said that...
Buy a Spyderco Sharpmaker! You will not regret it!


For example I've read that CPM-S35VN (vastly) outclasses S30V, S60V, S90V, 154, 420HC and M390 steel.

No. S35VN does not "vastly" outclass S30V etc....
It is a good steel, but it's not a light saber.
It still gets dull and you will still need to sharpen it


Blades come in many thicknesses. Ignoring weight and price, what are the advantages of a thick blade? They are stronger when comparing the same steel. But at what cost does that come? Harder to cut things? I've seen 2mm thich blades and 5mm blades. As I wrote I have zero experience but it's just my feeling that for peeling an apple the 2mm blade is better....

Blade thickness and effectiveness really depends upon what you're cutting.
Chopping down large trees might be best done with a thick blade ax or hatchet.
But cutting sugar cane or kudzu all day would be easier with a thin blade machete.

With a good multi-tool you can have a thin blade for cutting and thick blunt tools for prying and such.

 

[Ryanol]

Go to any gas station near an interstate and buy whatever strikes your fancy. Use it to do whatever you want and when it gets dull or breaks throw it away and buy another.

 

[TheEdge01]

If it’s going to be an abuser, I suggest a cheap throw away knife. Any knife won’t hold up for long if it is abused. If it is a user, then there are plenty of options out there. The Benchmade Adamas has a nice tough thick D2 blade, and will hold up nicely, but with D2 you will need to consider a better sharpener than the 10$ one.

 

[uxo2]

For me a knife is a tool. I'm not the type of guy that handles his stuff with great care. The ideal steel for me isn't just razor sharp but can take lots of abuse.
Cutting boxes, plastic (buckets), rubber, electric wiring,





tin cans.

Prying open paint

Some chopping. Some digging. Scraping some dirt away, etc

!

knife is a tool. I'm not the type of guy that handles his stuff with great care. The ideal steel for me isn't just razor sharp but can take lots of abuse.
Cutting boxes, plastic (buckets), rubber, electric wiring,

tin cans.

Prying open paint

Some chopping. Some digging. Scraping some dirt away, etc

I hope it helps op.

 

[Larrin]

But I'm drifting of… I'll try to pick my own folder with the steel as a starting point.

That’s not the starting point for choosing a folder.