Looking for Fairbanks hammer operating manual...

Is the rear bushing designed to stick out the back by about 1/4" for our hammers?

Edit- Never mind, I forget to read when I haven't had coffee. I'm gonna make a spacer for where the rear bushing on mine should extend to. I guess Harvey didn't know about that when he rebuilt the hammer.
 
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Not having taken our hammer apart, all the description and pictures has gotten me a lot more understanding... that, and having to articulate what I've seen and done on ours in relation to what I've seen and you-all are doing on yours has caused me to do a lot of alternative point of reference thinking... always a very good thing for me.
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Dan...

Still haven't called Harvey... too much other stuff in the way... but I will get to it sooner or later. Sid is connecting with a "belt expert" and I need to yap with him again, too. Will post pertinent stuff, for sure.

Mike
 
The remade rear bushing arrived today as well as the sleeve to replace the drive pulley. The bushing barely started in and stopped. It needs to be dressed down a little in diameter on the taper. This is trial and error. The sleeve was just a little too long and will need to be turned down a little in length. Back to the machine shop.
 
Mike Krall said:
Not having taken our hammer apart, all the description and pictures has gotten me a lot more understanding... that, and having to articulate what I've seen and done on ours in relation to what I've seen and you-all are doing on yours has caused me to do a lot of alternative point of reference thinking... always a very good thing for me.
----------------------------------------------------

Dan...

Still haven't called Harvey... too much other stuff in the way... but I will get to it sooner or later. Sid is connecting with a "belt expert" and I need to yap with him again, too. Will post pertinent stuff, for sure.

Mike
Click to expand...


Mike,

I saw Harvey in town the other day. I talked it up with him on this and that and asked about the belt. The guy he got the belt from died and from what I understand the belts are no longer available, he didn't give much more information than that.

Are you using cow or buffalo leather for your belt?
 
A friend of mine runs a Champion stitcher.He uses an outfit in the Chicago area.
Contact me offlist for his info. Or go to Backroom Leather and look under the listing for 'Friends"
 
Hey Fellas. I made some progress today. Two trips to the machine shop and I was able to get the rear bearing that was drilled off center pressed in. It took a little bit of honing, but I got the shaft all the way in as well. I honed the sleeve a little and got it installed, also. The shaft and sleeve need to come back out, so I can take the shaft back to the machine shop and have them put the crank back on. They will heat the crank and press in the shaft.

This is how I did things. I pushed the tapered rear bearing in by hand as far as I could get it. I then put the shaft through the front bearing and up to the rear bearing. Thankfully, we were close enough with the hole this time that the shaft entered the rear bearing. I then rotated the rear bearing several times and pushed the shaft in as far as it would go each time, until I found the alignment that would allow the shaft to go into the rear bearing the farthest. I marked that alignment on the yoke and the bearing, and then pressed the bearing in all of the way with the contraption that I have already posted pictures of. I was careful to try to keep everything straight in order to try to make the bearing stay on my mark as it was pressed in.

The shaft went in the bearing about half way, pretty easily. I then went through a process of rotating the shaft to leave a witness mark inside the bearing and honing the rubbing spots with a die grinder and a 1" flapper wheel that was 60 grit and then pushing the shaft in again and rotating again. I went slowly and didn't take much off each time. After 20 minutes or so, I got the shaft all the way through. The fit is great. Even if I just put the shaft in the rear bearing alone that I honed, there is very little movement. It is almost the same amount of play as the front bearing that has never been honed. With the shaft through both bearing there is almost no movement at all. In fact, I could probably add a little play, but I don't know if I will. I assume the hammer running will loosen things up a little like it wants.

I am really glad that I had another bearing made. Making careful measurements and drilling it off center really worked well. Thanks for the encouragement.

I will need to drill the oil hole and the set screw hole in the rear bearing, and the set screw hole in the front bearing. I had them make the new rear bearing with no holes, so I could rotate the bearing to get the best fit.
 
Dan Seaver said:
Mike,

I saw Harvey in town the other day. I talked it up with him on this and that and asked about the belt. The guy he got the belt from died and from what I understand the belts are no longer available, he didn't give much more information than that.

Are you using cow or buffalo leather for your belt?
Click to expand...

Dan,

Well, that's too bad. I guess it saves me "one more thing to do" but I'd have liked to have found out more about your belt.

I'm not using leather at all. Got it on good recommendation leather was more pain than it is worth... at least in this application. Years back, there was a replacement material invented... multi-ply, rubber impregnated, canvas. It works great as a replacement for leather. Has a 4-5% permanent stretch, that is, it stretches that amount then quits, which leather never really does.

Why doesn't it work on our machine when leather obviously did, when it works on Bruces? Probably I'm not running as much belt as needed. The one I have is narrower than spec. and it's running on a 4", instead of 5" motor pulley. Both of those combine to be a significant reduction in friction surface... 17% width loss on the drive pulley, 17% width, then 25% circumference on the motor pulley.

All my messing around looking at alternative belt construction is to see if I can avoid buying and/or building a jack shaft set-up, a different motor mount, a 5" drive pulley, another belt like the one I've got that is wider, and more flex conduit and wire 'cause the motor will be further from the source.

Mike
 
Mike, after all of that talk of the virtues of jack shafts, now you don't want to use one???? Come on, step up!
 
Mike, I don't use leather on mine. Tried it and couldn't stop the stretch.
The composite belting I sent you was the same stuff I currently use.
 
I thought I would share a picture of the big moment. Here is the shaft, both bushings and the sleeve installed for the first time.
IMG_0477shaftinlores.jpg
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Here is the new motor mount setup without the plate permanently attached yet.
IMG_0478mounttobelores.jpg
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Here are the motor mount arms attached to the base of the hammer with 1/2" bolts 1 1/2" long. I drilled and tapped the hammer base for the holes.
IMG_0479mountarmslores.jpg
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Here is a rebuilt side arm, link and pin with work by Sid. The weld is an old weld. Sid's work was welding up the holes, reboring and installing the bushing you see, as well as the new pin.
IMG_0463linkarmslores.jpg
[/IMG]
 
farmer12888 said:
Mike, after all of that talk of the virtues of jack shafts, now you don't want to use one???? Come on, step up!
Click to expand...

Oh, I know it's the thing to do. It's a matter of figuring out if I have to give up the money I need for other things to do it.

If I remember, I'll get in touch with Sid tomorrow and see what he heard from "the belt expert".

Mike
 
Yeah Bruce, I am starting to get a little excited. It will be a good day when everything is back and ready to start reassembly. It should be real soon.
 
Talked with Sid today. He had a failed FAX problem from the supplier and had to start over again. He was waiting for me to call to get my machine data again.

Sid said he was going to follow this around a little until he had some good belt-answers for Fairbanks hammmer owners. I'm hoping this pans out but there is no telling.

Mike
 
I'm certainly interested in the belt discussion. I will need a new one before I can get it running after the rebuild. Have you guys ever heard of laminating a couple of layers of leather? I was just wondering if that would help control the stretch. The lacing together of leather belt ends does not appear to be that complicated, although the procedure is pretty specific. I found an article about it.
 
Robert,

In the end, it may simply be, if the belt is as wide and thick as it is supposed to be and the motor/JS pulley is the diameter it is suppose to be, using a multi-ply, rubber-impregnated, canvas belt will work just fine. I mean, it IS the replacement evolution for leather.

This belt type has an inheirent 4-5% stretch, at the end of which it will not stretch more unless overloaded for it's construction (got that from Western Belting in Colorado). With the long-belt configuration you, Dan, and we have, I'm guessing the stretch would have to be removed by resplicing, though it could be removed by lengthening the distance between motor and drive pulley through shim removal, but that is self defeating to some extent.

It is not that once the 4-5% stretch is gone the belt has no give, though. It does, but the function becomes give and return to same length. I've got no idea how that works with the limitations of idler arm travel. Obviously, the wider the belt, the thicker the belt, and the shorter the belt (there is such a thing as too-short in the world of belt-types), the less temporary stretch for the force applied.

On the rubber impregnated canvas (my guess at it)... the rubber may avoid messing with leather belt dressing and cleaning. I've not read anything concrete about this, but little bits of discussion here and there makes me think it is part and parcel of running leather belts. Bruce may know more about this from his historical machinery interest.

To see a range of belt-types, search McMaster-Carr and then search "flat belts". There are single, double, double-with-woven-between, and others. I thought seriously about double-leather-with-woven-between... There are motor/JS pulley diameter limitations due to thickness. They are expensive. If they take a permanent stretch, shortening is onerous. They may need dressing/cleaning to function properly. Those are the reasons I am looking at other belt-types.

Mike
 
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