lt. weight Goddard or Endura '98?

Joined
Dec 18, 1998
Messages
417
I'd just like to hear some opinions on these two knives as defense folders. I'm trying to decide between the two for my left side carry. The ltwt Goddard has a great integral guard on the handle, but the Endura has the hump for the hole. The blades seem to share similar drop point, saber ground traits. Which one do you guys prefer for defensive carry? Sal?

Also, does it seem feasible to produce a left handed Civilian? Ironstone just told me they don't exist. If they did, I would just pick up one of those and forget about the Endura or the Goddard.
 
Ronald - I prefer the Endura, but it is my own design. It was specifically designed to serve my preferences. Most of the time, I prefer a "hump". Both knives use the same lock geometry, both are extremely sharp. Both deploy easily and securly, both use the same steel. I think it would be amatter of design preference. I think the two knives would otherwise be equal.

The Matriarch is made with the Endura handle including the left/right clip.
sal
 
That's what my general consensus was. Thanks for your input. Maybe I'll just get both.

Sal, out of curiosity can you elaborate further on what your "preferences" were for the Endura"?

[This message has been edited by Ronald Reagan (edited 15 May 1999).]
 
Goddard Lightweight for sure. Integral guard, flaired handle, dropped handle for a natural point, raised checkered pattern for a more secure grip, and a somewhat broad and flat profile to help prevent loss during twisting(No, not like that guy in that silly beer commercial!). Oh, I like the Endura too.

L8r,
Nakano

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"To earn a million is easy, a real friend is not."
 
Ronald, here is a thread you should read, if you haven't already.

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum20/HTML/000048.html

The Endura is one of my all-time favorite knives. I like the way it feels in my hand. I can open it very quickly, even without the thumb hole, using a shake and flick motion. I like the light weight (it won't drag down elastic-waist athletic shorts), and the relatively flat handle has no sharp corners or agressive notches to impede access to other objects in my pocket.

On the basis of Thaddeus's recommendations, I'm going to buy a plain edged Goddard Lightweight. I don't know if I'll like it better than my Endura, but I'm gonna find out.

I hope this helps.

David Rock
 
You bet David. I agree with Thaddeus. According to Sal the LW has started to ship. I' d like to add that even though the Goddard is a large handled folder, because of its design it still fits a variety of hand sizes. I' m calling for a few soon.

L8r,
Nakano

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"To earn a million is easy, a real friend is not."
 
Ronald - interesting question, brings back many memories. The Endura and Delica were designed in 1988. We'd been fending off "knock offs" with the "Standard" model for 3 years. The "Standard" model was also going up in price quickly as the Yen was steadily increasing in strength back then.

All of our knives were Stainless handles, tip down. I realized that there were seveal drawbacks towards our "regular Stailess" models ever becomeing mainstream. The Endura and Delica were going to be the "ultimate" folders for the general ELU.

"Needs" to solve in the designing process;

1. Two blade sizes to try to please the majority of the ELUs. Some like a large blade (3.5 - 4.0 inches - 90 - 102mm) and some like a smaller blade (2.5 - 3.6 inches - 62 - 775mm). Clearly two designs were necessary and one could not just be a "Shrunk" up version of the other. When designing smaller or larger knives, one must take into account that the general hand size is not changing much, just the preference. We needed two separate designs that looked like siblings.

2. We had to maintain Spyderco's "High speed low drag high performance" attitude. That is what we offered and I didn't want to change that. "No more than necessary, no less than perfect'. We continued to use Gingami I as the steel (used to be G-2, changed to GIN 1) because at the time, it was one of the better production steels available. Our edge requirements were already separating us from the others, even in Seki.

Ergonomics were still essential. The knives are designed with the "hand" and the "cut" as paramount. Looks were never very important. We'ed already been branded "ugly" by the market because of the hump.

Guys that design with appearance in mind, like Goddard and Centofante, chose to eliminate the hump. I can design without the hump if I choose (Native design is mine), but in general, I prefer to "expose" the hole and the hump provides that as well as a thumb rest.

3. We had to reduce costs. Under $40 retail was the goal. The Endura was introduced at $35 retail, the Delica at $25.

4. We'd been making tip down stainless clips since '81 (for those that do not know, Spyderco introduced the clothing clip into the knife world). We believed the "drop" opening was a little too flashy for the general ELU. Lester was already having legal problems with the Butterfly knives and we wanted to avoid that. Tip up was was more secure, required less of a learning curve and wouldn't have people using the "drop" quick draw opening.

The integral clip was an adventure. We ended up changing the mold 6 times in order to create an integral clip that worked perfectly. We finally ended up going back to metal. Now we're looking a coating the metal somehow.

4. Functionality was the top priority. The texture was developed to provide funtionality combined with identification (for protection purposes). Additonal sizes were being requested. Our supplier came up with the Ladybug as a miniature Endura. I came up with the Dragonfly and Rescue (a lightweight "Mariner") as additonal designs on the same theme. The "Merlin" was a liteweight Harpy.

We must have done something right with the set (Edura, Delica, Rescue, Merlin, Dragonfly and ladybug) as these patterns seem to have been copied more than any other in this decade.

I'm sure I've left out some details, but this should give you a general idea. If you have more Q's, please ask.
sal
 
I appreciate your time spent in responding to my question. As a Spyderco customer, it is always a pleasure to read this type of info - much more informative and interesting than most of the knife mags!

[This message has been edited by Ronald Reagan (edited 16 May 1999).]
 
I didn't know anything about the Goddard (even what it looked like) so I surfed over to the Knife Center. It turns out they have a really good explanation and description of it on-line. Be sure to scroll down below the picture of the lightweight to read it.

http://www.knifecenter.com/knifecenter/spyderc/goddard.html
 
Sal:
For what it's worth, I feel the Endura and Delica (and most of the Spydie line) are NOT ugly, just unique. I actually LIKE the way they look! It's different from the most common work knives i tend to see people carrying (Buck 110 or copies) which, though also very good knives, are not as comfortable to me to use daily.
I'm looking forward to the plainedge Goddard Lightweight. I like the Endura's blade-to-handle ratio better, as well as the pointyer tip. But the Goddard's handle is extremely comfortable with a pronounced integral guard. Somethinge else different!
One more comment regarding the new clips. On my Endura the clip's black coloring is unlike my Delicas and like the Benchmade clip paint...i.e. very durable.
Jim
 
FWIW I have the Endura, several yrs. old that I gave to my wife and I own the C16 lt. wt. For what I use a knife for the C16 fits the bill perfectly. If you you need to use it for hunting, opening a multitude of different things, and just plain utility it can't be beat. The ergonomics are excellant, the blade shape and the steel are superb, and it is of a very flat profile for easy pocket carry. It is also ambidextorous.
As for sharpness outside of a Boye Basic it is without a doubt the sharpest knife I own. The Basic and the C16 seem to tied in the sharpness dept. I still say it is the BEST knife deal out there in the 35-45 dollar range.
 
Call me crazy, but I keep putting the Delica back in my pocket as my daily carry. For some reason (enumerated eloquently above) it just 'works' and that's all I can ask of a dependable knife. Design and the refinement thereof DOES make a difference.
 
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