M390 vs S35VN in a Hinderer XM-18

Thomas Linton said:
So if your edge chips out, it has superior "edge retention." ? M390 is less likely to chip than 420? No and no.
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Thomas, this thread is pertaining to comparing 2 versions of the XM18 which does not come in 420. So we need to compare S35VN and M390 both at approximately 60rc since that's what hardness Hinderer crew runs these steels at. Any other comparisons would be off topic to this thread...
 
1SHOT1KILL said:
What does one have to do with the other? Does M390 retain its edge longer than 420? Yes it does. Here's where I gathered some of my info:http://bestpocketknifetoday.com/discovering-the-best-knife-steel/

Sent from my LG-H900 using Tapatalk
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From the linked source: "Edge Retention represents how long the blade will retain its sharpness when subject to periods of use. It’s what everyone talks about these days but unfortunately the measurement of edge retention lacks any defined set of standards and so much of the data is subjective. For me, edge retention is a combination of wear resistance and an edge that resists deformation."
 
Biginboca said:
Thomas, this thread is pertaining to comparing 2 versions of the XM18 which does not come in 420. So we need to compare S35VN and M390 both at approximately 60rc since that's what hardness Hinderer crew runs these steels at. Any other comparisons would be off topic to this thread...
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Where did you get the information that Hinderer runs his M390 at 60rc? I'm honestly curious because I just picked up a Harpoon Spanto today with M390 and was reading over in the "Lets see some Hinderer Action" thread that the non-choil spanto could be a little lower.

Was curious if this applies to mine as well.
 
Biginboca said:
Thomas, this thread is pertaining to comparing 2 versions of the XM18 which does not come in 420. So we need to compare S35VN and M390 both at approximately 60rc since that's what hardness Hinderer crew runs these steels at. Any other comparisons would be off topic to this thread...
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I am asking about the basis of comparison, "edge retention" which, as noted above, is a murky standard.
 
highestpoint said:
Where did you get the information that Hinderer runs his M390 at 60rc? I'm honestly curious because I just picked up a Harpoon Spanto today with M390 and was reading over in the "Lets see some Hinderer Action" thread that the non-choil spanto could be a little lower.

Was curious if this applies to mine as well.
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That's what all the hinderer stainless steels are run at, 60-61. This is from the blade HQ website description for a 3.5" XM with CPM20cv but that's basically the same steel as M390. DLT doesn't list the exact hardness for the M390 but it's a safe bet it's around 60rc.

 
Biginboca said:
That's what all the hinderer stainless steels are run at, 60-61. This is from the blade HQ website description for a 3.5" XM with CPM20cv but that's basically the same steel as M390. DLT doesn't list the exact hardness for the M390 but it's a safe bet it's around 60rc.

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Well this was taken from his website so I'm sure there is some miscommunication somewhere.
 
highestpoint said:
96c98b39675db59a6e38871f613e08fa.jpg


Well this was taken from his website so I'm sure there is some miscommunication somewhere.
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They are both around 60. You do realize blades are heat treated in batches and 2 blades from the same exact batch could be 2 points different? Depends on where they sat in the oven and other variables. Regardless they are all in the same range and I doubt anyone could tell the difference in practical use of M390 at 60 on one XM and 61 on another.
 
Biginboca said:
They are both around 60. You do realize blades are heat treated in batches and 2 blades from the same exact batch could be 2 points different? Depends on where they sat in the oven and other variables. Regardless they are all in the same range and I doubt anyone could tell the difference in practical use of M390 at 60 on one XM and 61 on another.
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I completely agree, was just curious why a dealer would have something other than Rick's own website. Just curiosity, but back to telling a difference between 1rc.. I don't think CRK would've gone from 58-59 to 59-60 if there wasn't a noticeable difference. To most people, they wouldn't/couldn't notice but to someone who sharpens or does the actual testing of the steels could (not me) though I have been able to tell between certain steels in a little different circumstances.
 
rexbo said:
OK,

I can find the same knife (same grind) in both steels available for the same price... So,what is the consensus here? Is there a clear choice?

Thanks for any/all input!
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What are you planning to use the knife for? I'd say that should dictate your selection way more than taking advantage of potential cost "savings" since M390 is generally more expensive than the other option...yeah it's cool to save money and all, but I don't think that's the ideal logic for a knife you're intending to carry and use and already going to spend around $400 on.

If you're just planning to do straight forward cutting of not-too-abrasive materials and will go reasonably easy on the knife, M390 will give you better edge holding and wear resistance. That kind of sensible use shouldn't give you much chipping...

If you're planning to buy a Hinderer with the intention of heavier use, hard use style applications (perhaps even a little abuse?), then I think S35VN would be the superior choice. A little less wear resistance than the M390, but a lot less chippy as well, based on my experience at least...I think it's worlds better and more enjoyable to use than its S30v predecessor so don't make the mistake I made and let any negative experiences with S30 sway you from trying out S35.


Whatever you decide on going with, enjoy your new Hinderer!
 
hookahhabib said:
What are you planning to use the knife for? I'd say that should dictate your selection way more than taking advantage of potential cost "savings" since M390 is generally more expensive than the other option...yeah it's cool to save money and all, but I don't think that's the ideal logic for a knife you're intending to carry and use and already going to spend around $400 on.

If you're just planning to do straight forward cutting of not-too-abrasive materials and will go reasonably easy on the knife, M390 will give you better edge holding and wear resistance. That kind of sensible use shouldn't give you much chipping...

If you're planning to buy a Hinderer with the intention of heavier use, hard use style applications (perhaps even a little abuse?), then I think S35VN would be the superior choice. A little less wear resistance than the M390, but a lot less chippy as well, based on my experience at least...I think it's worlds better and more enjoyable to use than its S30v predecessor so don't make the mistake I made and let any negative experiences with S30 sway you from trying out S35.


Whatever you decide on going with, enjoy your new Hinderer!
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Thanks so much for the response, and thanks to everyone else as well, I really appreciate it!

I have been attempting to reasearch this myself and have concluded that the m390 is better in most aspects EXCEPT for toughness? or the ability not not chip, beak, deform? If I am correct, then maybe s35VN is a better option for "harder" use?
 
rexbo said:
Thanks so much for the response, and thanks to everyone else as well, I really appreciate it!

I have been attempting to reasearch this myself and have concluded that the m390 is better in most aspects EXCEPT for toughness? or the ability not not chip, beak, deform? If I am correct, then maybe s35VN is a better option for "harder" use?
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Based on my amateur understanding of different knife steels and alloys, along with my little bit of experience with both of them, yes that's exactly it. M390 is a great steel, but as with all things that get on the hype train, people get pretty excited over it and will automatically choose the hyped up option over the other choices that sometimes might be the better pick. If you're planning to beat on the knife, S35VN will take a hell of a beating. Here's fun video of S35VN getting some good abuse: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW0TVkcBFkw -- this is another company's heat treatment and performance will vary from company to company and knife to knife, but you'll at least get an idea of what it can handle...It seems like a little Niobium will go a long way when mixed into a steel!


Welcome to the bladeforums man!
 
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