Machete edges: toothy or polished?

M

Mr.Wizard

Joined
Feb 28, 2015
Messages
1,452
There are many threads on toothy versus polished edges but not one specific to machetes. Generally a more polished edge is recommended for push cuts and testing indicates a polished edge lasts longer in this use, just as a toothy edge lasts longer is draw cuts.
FortyTwoBlades said:
The most important thing is just to be in the right angle range (about 15° per side is usually the sweet spot for general duty) and making sure that you've brought the edge to a proper burr- and wire-free apex. If you're able to bring it to a high grit without spending much time on it, do that as well, as most machete work (even on lush vegetation) is mostly making use of a push-cutting action and a coarser grit edge will be more prone to collapse under such use.
Click to expand...
HeavyHanded said:
In my own experience I witnessed a huge difference in longevity (all else being equal) depending on edge prep. Massive improvement in longevity when using a coarse edge for manually cutting coated papers at work, and likewise a tremendous improvement in edge retention using a polished edge for chopping - after making about a hundred cuts through Norway Maple branches up to 2" the edge fileted my pants leg when I wiped it lengthwise on my thigh - just the bit of swell at the belly of my bolo machete (right at the sweet spot) was enough to pull through the fabric. At 200 or 300 grit I don't think the edge could have done that with no use, let alone after making a bunch of hard cuts.
Click to expand...

Apart from a swept or hooked tip I view machete use as push cutting but I am still learning to use a machete and that view may need adjustment. FortyTwoBlades gave me unexpected advice in the context of more tooth than the Arctic Fox (22µ, 400 ANSI) edge I normally use.

FortyTwoBlades said:
Machetes being used on lush vegetation definitely still benefit from a toothy scratch pattern, as do slicing knives. While the grit would be considered coarse on most stones it's best to think of the Bull Thistle as being like a medium-coarse stone that leaves the scratch pattern of a coarse stone. ... Lush vegetation is just about anything that's not woody. A specific stroke largely isn't needed since the sliding action occurs naturally with targets of that sort.
Click to expand...

I would like to better understand this. My application is clearing trails of a mix of caneberries, nettles, vine maple, manzanita, salal, ferns, English ivy, devils club, hogweed, snowbrush, rhododendron, scotch broom, and limbs or shoots of pine, alder, cottonwood, fir, etc. If my edge is sharp it seems to bite on all of them with a good swing, but I may be working harder that necessary and if there are improvements to be had I would like them.

Machete users: what kind of edge preparation would you apply for this work, and how would you vary your swing for these different plants?
 
I only get concerned with edge retention when its good steel. You can sharpen most machetes with a file, this is good because of what the tool is subjected too but it also tells you that the tool is soft. With soft steel you will have to maintain it more often and combined with the abuse a machete gets put through spending the least amount of time on the edge while maintaining a working sharpness would be my goal.

I don't sharpen a Machete all too often but if I didn't have my beltsander then a large file and a ceramic rod would be the extent of my sharpening kit. File to maintain the bevel and the ceramic rod to deburr/microbevel/maintain sharpness.
 
I have never tried going directly from a file—one of my coarest tools—to a ceramic rod. What kind of edge does that make? How much pressure do you use with the rod, and how many strokes?
 
My machete is used in the garden and subject to all kinds of abrasive stuff.
It gets honed when needed with the same whetstone I use for the scythe.

So actually putting a shiny edge on a used machete is a bit pointless for me. However, if I were to get another one just for the collection,
I likely would polish it and have it cut a silk scarf in mid air:)
 
I used a machete daily for work in one of my first jobs (clearing brush from hillsides around peoples houses for fire safety, lots of manzanita). The only thing I ever used to sharpen my blade was a file, coarse on one side, medium on the other. Aside from chopping through thick brush all day, it wasn't uncommon for me to hit a rock when chopping low, or rocks hidden in the thick brush or covered by decades of leaves and other natural debris.

I had to resharpen regularly, sometimes multiple times a day. Any kind of refined edge would be a waste of time in my opinion.
 
How did you apply a file in the field? I feel the need to clamp the blade to a table and use both hands on the file. Would you hit the bevel or just the apex?
 
Mr.Wizard said:
I have never tried going directly from a file—one of my coarest tools—to a ceramic rod. What kind of edge does that make? How much pressure do you use with the rod, and how many strokes?
Click to expand...

You file the edge in then deburr with the ceramic rod by going to a higher angle like a microbevel. Keep it simple.

As other have mentioned, just a file works just fine too. A machete is a rough use tool, don't overthink it.
Mr.Wizard said:
How did you apply a file in the field? I feel the need to clamp the blade to a table and use both hands on the file. Would you hit the bevel or just the apex?
Click to expand...
Just hold it. Machete in one hand and a file in the other. If you can find a "bench" even better, use your hand as the clamp.
 
I have a Simonds 10" coarse chip breaking file. It takes quite it bit of pressure for it to cut. I cannot produce that amount of pressure across the bevel using only one hand. Are you hitting only the apex or is something wrong with my file?
 
In general the Bull Thistle/Arctic Fox combo gets you a very crisp but still toothy edge. A quick pass with the Arctic Fox will only polish up the "points" of the undulations in the edge caused by the Bull Thistle so it helps crisp up the apex without erasing the scratch pattern. It's the system I use with my scythes and it does very nicely. A dry-shaving edge CAN be generated straight from a file, though, with practice.

I only bring my personal machetes to a full high polish when using them exclusively for woody chopping work. Otherwise a bit of tooth to them works best. Bear in mind that you want the bias of the scratch pattern running from the tip towards the handle.

I've personally never understood the "constantly hitting rocks" thing. I've only accidentally hit rocks with my machetes...twice? in the roughly two decades I've been using them because I check the path of my swing before flailing away. But expediency is still important with sharpening when there's work to be done.

As far as filing a machete goes, lay the blade over one thigh and under the other and it makes a vise-like hold on the blade.
 
It's a tool for rough work. Usually unwanted weeds and brush. I did once for the heck of it sharpen one with a paper wheel. I didn't notice a difference in use. And the darn thing loses its edge if your cutting a lot with it. In the field as a former landscaper for 31 years I used to touch them up with an angle grinder with a 60 grit wheel. No debur nada. And they worked real.well in the real world. I never tried to slice a.tomato with one though.
 
I bring mine up to a pretty decent level (2k then an abrasive strop for deburring) for brush cutting - mostly trimming back branches and bushes. I don't think I need to sharpen it but once a year or two, and I trim out about 2 acres of yard probably twice a year. I don't see anywhere near the edge damage some of you seem to. I also never chop straight into a branch (perpendicular to the branch). If I'm making a cut, it's with more of a glancing blow so as to try to follow along the grain growth of the wood fibers. This is about a million times more gentle on the edge.
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
I've personally never understood the "constantly hitting rocks" thing. I've only accidentally hit rocks with my machetes...twice?
Click to expand...

You, sir, are very fortunate. I live in an area where the ground seemingly consists of 90% rock and 10% soil. I have been using machetes/hatchets/etc. for two decades as well and am always cautious to clear rocks and debris when I'm fixing to chop near the ground. However no matter how many rocks I clear away there are always more underneath a thin layer of dirt and anything but an absolutely perfect strike on the target will result in a dinged-up edge. The soft limestone isn't too bad on the edge, it's the pieces of flint and chert that do the damage. My Imacasa and Cold Steel machetes must be a little tougher because they seem to hold up a little longer.

I used to simply use an Ace Hardware brand whetstone on my machetes until I discovered the BYXCO bull thistle and haven't looked back. I don't bother polishing the edges since they rarely last long enough to make a difference.
 
It's a tool for rough work. Usually unwanted weeds and brush. I did once for the heck of it sharpen one with a paper wheel. I didn't notice a difference in use. And the darn thing loses its edge if your cutting a lot with it. In the field as a former landscaper for 31 years I used to touch them up with an angle grinder with a 60 grit wheel. No debur nada. And they worked real.well in the real world. I never tried to slice a.tomato with one though.
 
oldmanwilly said:
You, sir, are very fortunate. I live in an area where the ground seemingly consists of 90% rock and 10% soil. I have been using machetes/hatchets/etc. for two decades as well and am always cautious to clear rocks and debris when I'm fixing to chop near the ground. However no matter how many rocks I clear away there are always more underneath a thin layer of dirt and anything but an absolutely perfect strike on the target will result in a dinged-up edge. The soft limestone isn't too bad on the edge, it's the pieces of flint and chert that do the damage. My Imacasa and Cold Steel machetes must be a little tougher because they seem to hold up a little longer.

I used to simply use an Ace Hardware brand whetstone on my machetes until I discovered the BYXCO bull thistle and haven't looked back. I don't bother polishing the edges since they rarely last long enough to make a difference.
Click to expand...

Not fortunate--careful! Maine is famous for its granite and I live on an island that's basically an ancient volcanic remnant that got scraped over by a glacier, so there's rock EVERYWHERE here. It's just a matter of checking where you're cutting and employing the right techniques to make sure the blade only goes where you want it to. I also use other tools where more appropriate. When chopping near the ground, for instance, tilt the blade a little upward so the spine glides along the ground like the back of a scythe blade. This keeps the edge close to the ground, but out of the dirt, and small obstructions will pass under the blade instead of colliding with the edge.
 
I own and use 32 machetes. For my wood choppers like my parangs and kukris, or any heavy machete with a convex edge I sharpen with a stone then strop on leather. For my longer thinner machetes that I use for grass vines and vegetation I sharpen with a stone then I gently drag a diamond abrasive down the edge to top it off with a toothy edge.
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
I've personally never understood the "constantly hitting rocks" thing. I've only accidentally hit rocks with my machetes...twice? in the roughly two decades I've been using them because I check the path of my swing before flailing away. But expediency is still important with sharpening when there's work to be done.
Click to expand...
Did you ever clean new fishing spot on river bank ? Do that and you will understand , you will hit more rock and soil then grass , branches ......
 
Sorry, I'm with 42 blades. If you are chopping the ground & rocks, your doing it wrong. Maybe even using the wrong tool. If I am trying to chop close to the ground, I use a corrugated scythe/sickle, that has a wooden handle. It allows you to get ground level without stooping over.

I keep my machete's hair popping sharp or as close to it as possible. Good steel and good heat treat are key for a good machete IMHO.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top