Marble's axes made in USA again?

[Thomas Linton]

Sorry if I missed a thread on this, but I just found a on-line ad claiming that a "Marble's No. 10 Belt Axe" on sale there was "Made in the USA." Price was $37.95 and the head is said to be 'stainles steel," so I have BIG doubts. Perhaps assembled in U.S.A. of imported parts of doubtful quality (stainless steel).

I find this item is also sold as the "2 LB Belt Axe" at a similarly low price.

Or several vendors will sell it to you for more on ePrey. "Marbles Stainless 2lb. Belt Axe with Leather Sheath Included - MR10"

So what gives with the "U.S.A." claim?

 

[Steve Tall]

The handle label says "Made in USA", along with an American flag. The FTC has fairly strict regulations about such claims.

 

[Steve Tall]

According to the Federal Trade Commission:
"Made in USA means that “all or virtually all” the product has been made in America. That is, all significant parts, processing, and labor that go into the product must be of U.S. origin. Products should not contain any – or should contain only negligible – foreign content. The FTC’s Enforcement Policy Statement and its business guide, Complying with the Made in USA Standard, spell out the details..."

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/media-resources/tools-consumers/made-usa


June 9, 2006
The Stanley Works, a U.S. toolmaker, will pay a $205,000 civil penalty to settle Federal Trade Commission charges it falsely claimed its Zero Degree ratchets were Made in the USA...
https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/pre...ey-made-false-made-usa-claims-about-its-tools

"...the steel in a product like a pipe or a wrench is a direct and significant input. Whether the steel in a pipe or wrench is imported would be a significant factor in evaluating whether the finished product is "all or virtually all" made in the U.S."
https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-made-usa-standard

 

[Steve Tall]

Registration Number 4169925
Registration Date July 10, 2012
Owner (REGISTRANT) Phillip S. Martin DBA Blue Ridge Knives INDIVIDUAL UNITED STATES 166 Adwolfe Road Marion VIRGINIA 24354
(LAST LISTED OWNER) BLUE RIDGE KNIVES, INC. CORPORATION VIRGINIA 166 ADWOLFE ROAD MARION VIRGINIA 24354
[from USPTO]

The "Marble's" trademark evidently belongs to Blue Ridge Knives, a wholesale distributor. I assume that they contract out to various manufacturers the production of the Marble's-branded items.

For the Marbles "Made in USA" hatchet, my guess of manufacturer (just a guess) is Vaughan. [Edit: others have pointed out that Council Tool is the likely maker, and I agree.]
For comparison, a Vaughan hatchet:

Blue Ridge Knives' catalog does specify stainless steel for those Marble's hatchets, and I don't know what to make of that. And the specified 7" head seems long for a 14.25" handle.

 

[Thomas Linton]

Marble says, "As always, Marble’s products are all steel, all American, and all Gladstone, Michigan U.S.A."

I have a two Marble's No. 9 axes. Both are marked "CHINA" on the bottom edge of the head. I also have one from around 2002 that has text printed on the side of the read stating that it was made in Gladstone, Michigan.

OSO Grande is selling a Marble's axe as from El Salvador. "MANUFACTURER: Marbles Knives"

Discount Cutlery sells three Marble's axes said to be from Pakistan.

Walmart sells one as "imported" and others from ???.

SMKW, it says, sells 3 Marble's axes from CHINA, 3 from Pakistan, 1 from "CANADA," and 4 from El Salvador.

So if you have actual knowledge of where this axe is made, I would like to know. It would be great if they are back to making axes in the U.S., but for $37.95 and of "stainless steel"?

A cannot assume that something is true when it is contradicted by the declarer's behavior ("all Gladstone"). I bought a knife from Timor Knives "from Canada" that arrived in a box from Wazirabad, an experience others have also published. Then we have Quartermaster Knives from the invisible factory in Texas, Colonial knives from the factory that closed in 1999, and others.

So I ask, respectfully, if anyone has any facts to add.

 

[Hickory n steel]

I saw these recently and was going to post about them but figured they had to be some sort of new old stock.
They look just like the council tools hatchet to me, and council tools forges the stamp into their heads which Vaughan doesn't do.
Also if you look at the marbles hatchet you'll see a bit of a raised portion around the stamp which seems like evidence of a regular council tools hatchet die being modified so it could stamp Marbles instead of the CT logo.

Btw I own a marbles double bit saddle hatchet and it's a decent hatchet, so are my two marbles machetes all made in El Salvador by imicasa ( parent company to Condor )

Ive seen the made in Pakistan marbles stuff and as far as I know it's all the Damascus steel stuff ( they also have slipjoints made by Rough rider )

 

[Thomas Linton]

Registration Number 4169925
Registration Date July 10, 2012
Owner (REGISTRANT) Phillip S. Martin DBA Blue Ridge Knives INDIVIDUAL UNITED STATES 166 Adwolfe Road Marion VIRGINIA 24354
(LAST LISTED OWNER) BLUE RIDGE KNIVES, INC. CORPORATION VIRGINIA 166 ADWOLFE ROAD MARION VIRGINIA 24354
[from USPTO]

The "Marble's" trademark evidently belongs to Blue Ridge Knives, a wholesale distributor. I assume that they contract out to various manufacturers the production of the Marble's-branded items.

For the Marbles "Made in USA" hatchet, my guess of manufacturer (just a guess) is Vaughan.
For comparison, a Vaughan hatchet:

Blue Ridge Knives' catalog does specify stainless steel for those Marble's hatchets, and I don't know what to make of that. And the specified 7" head seems long for a 14.25" handle.

Thank you. That would indeed be a logical possibility, even if not "all Gladstone."

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I'm pretty sure it's a Council hatchet with a Marble's stamp and no paint. The dimensions and handle length etc. all match.

 

[Steve Tall]

Marble says, "As always, Marble’s products are all steel, all American, and all Gladstone, Michigan U.S.A."...So I ask, respectfully, if anyone has any facts to add.

That quote was taken out of context, in a way. It is from the Marble Arms website, and their actual company name is apparently Marbles Gun Sights, Inc. They do not sell Marble's axes, hatchets or knives. They sell "quality gun sights for firearms including fiber optic sights, peep tang sights, rear and front sights." Here's that quote, with more context from the prior sentence:

"Today, Marble Arms manufactures an impressive lineup of traditional and modern sights for every sporting arm and continues to supply factory equipment sights for most American gun makers. As always, Marble’s products are all steel, all American, and all Gladstone, Michigan U.S.A."

A product label with the USA flag and the words "Made in USA" would be setting up a company for some legal problems if the product has non-negligible foreign content and/or was not actually made in the USA. Those examples of other Marbles products being made in China or El Salvador (or wherever) sound like examples of Marbles following the law and not making false claims about "Made in USA".

 

[Steve Tall]

I saw these recently and was going to post about them but figured they had to be some sort of new old stock. They look just like the council tools hatchet to me...

I'm pretty sure it's a Council hatchet with a Marble's stamp and no paint. The dimensions and handle length etc. all match.

Thanks for the info. Council seems more likely. I will retract my guess about Vaughan being the maker.

 

[Thomas Linton]

That quote was taken out of context, in a way. It is from the Marble Arms website, and their actual company name is apparently Marbles Gun Sights, Inc. They do not sell Marble's axes, hatchets or knives. They sell "quality gun sights for firearms including fiber optic sights, peep tang sights, rear and front sights." Here's that quote, with more context from the prior sentence:

"Today, Marble Arms manufactures an impressive lineup of traditional and modern sights for every sporting arm and continues to supply factory equipment sights for most American gun makers. As always, Marble’s products are all steel, all American, and all Gladstone, Michigan U.S.A."

"CONTEXT"

While I cannot be sure, I can note that the home page lists "Axes, Compasses, Knives, Match Safes, Marble Arms."

Click on "Marble Arms" link, and you arrive at the page for Marble Gun Sights, Inc.

So same address, telephone number, and home page. Might be the same business.

A product label with the USA flag and the words "Made in USA" would be setting up a company for some legal problems if the product has non-negligible foreign content and/or was not actually made in the USA. Those examples of other Marbles products being made in China or El Salvador (or wherever) sound like examples of Marbles following the law and not making false claims about "Made in USA".

I agree. There is a problem if the goods are not made in the U.S.A. I ask. I clearly doubt. I do not assert.

COUNCIL
As for Council as a source, I cannot find the axe in question on the Council site or Google - or anything remotely like it, but that's me.
http://counciltool.com/axes-hatchets-mauls-wedges/
https://www.google.com/search?q=cou...TClMvXAhUDQCYKHSECAf8QsxgIKQ&biw=1016&bih=460

Nor can I find a stainless steel Council axe or an axe at that price point. I did find an M-Tech SS axe.

Help?

 

[Hickory n steel]

"CONTEXT"

While I cannot be sure, I can note that the home page lists "Axes, Compasses, Knives, Match Safes, Marble Arms."

Click on "Marble Arms" link, and you arrive at the page for Marble Gun Sights, Inc.

So same address, telephone number, and home page. Might be the same business.



I agree. There is a problem if the goods are not made in the U.S.A. I ask. I clearly doubt. I do not assert.

COUNCIL
As for Council as a source, I cannot find the axe in question on the Council site or Google - or anything remotely like it, but that's me.
http://counciltool.com/axes-hatchets-mauls-wedges/
https://www.google.com/search?q=cou...TClMvXAhUDQCYKHSECAf8QsxgIKQ&biw=1016&bih=460

Nor can I find a stainless steel Council axe or an axe at that price point. I did find an M-Tech SS axe.

Help?

Just Google council tools hatchet and you'll see it.
Council tools doesn't produce their own axes or hatchets with stainless steel, but would produce what's specified in the contract.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

COUNCIL
As for Council as a source, I cannot find the axe in question on the Council site or Google - or anything remotely like it, but that's me.
http://counciltool.com/axes-hatchets-mauls-wedges/
https://www.google.com/search?q=cou...TClMvXAhUDQCYKHSECAf8QsxgIKQ&biw=1016&bih=460

Nor can I find a stainless steel Council axe or an axe at that price point. I did find an M-Tech SS axe.

Help?

The listing of stainless steel is in error. It's not stainless. As far as the model, check this one.

 

[Thomas Linton]

Youzer! That looks right.

Some even have the same paint pattern, if in black rather than red.

Very consistent in calling it stainless steel. Author of ad copy probably not much of a sharps person.

I am ordering one.

 

[grafton]

That’s an absolute perversion of the Marbles #10 Camp Axe. I hope they’re not really calling that a #10.

 

[Steve Tall]

"CONTEXT"
While I cannot be sure, I can note that the home page lists "Axes, Compasses, Knives, Match Safes, Marble Arms..."

The context I'm talking about is that of the quotation,
"As always, Marble’s products are all steel, all American, and all Gladstone, Michigan U.S.A."

To put this quote in better context, the previous sentence is included here:
"Today, Marble Arms manufactures an impressive lineup of traditional and modern sights for every sporting arm and continues to supply factory equipment sights for most American gun makers. As always, Marble’s products are all steel, all American, and all Gladstone, Michigan U.S.A."

These quotations appear on the website for Marble's Gun Sights, Inc., which does not sell knives or axes, as far as I know. (If they do, I welcome the correction.)

 

[Thomas Linton]

OK. I understand - I think. You assert that the entity, by whatever name, intends to claim that only Marble's sights are made in Gladstone. Certainly, gun sights are typically all steel.

I may have been misled by the fact that all these names have the same address and telephone number and are linked at the same Internet home page. E.g.: Marble Arms, Contact Us Direct, ...
420 Industrial Park Dr. Gladstone MI 49837, 1.906.428.3710, customerservice@marblearms.com
Further, all these enterprises are referred to at the marble's website simply as "Marble's."http://www.marblearms.com/about.html

"Marbles Gun Sights, Inc." appears in one record as an actual entity:

Name: Marble'S Gun Sights, Inc.
Category: Domestic Profit Corporation
Number: 00188W
Status: Active
Company ID: 00188W
Incorporation/Qualification Date: 2006-10-06
Formed Under Act Number(s): 284-1972
Resident Agent of this company is Craig R Lauerman.
420 Industrial Park
Gladstone Mi 49637

"Marble Arms, Inc" is also shown as an entity with its "CEO" or "President" being Craig R Lauerman, of Gladstone, Michigan. It is listed at the same home page as the seller of knives, axes, compasses, and match safes, whichever that is, as shown above. It seems to be the older entity,dating back to 1994.
COMPANY REGISTRATION NUMBER 096422 MI
COMPANY STATUS REGISTERED
REGISTERED ADDRESS 420 INDUSTRIAL PARK GLADSTONE MI 49837 US
INCORPORATED 1994-03-23
REGISTERED AGENT CRAIG R LAUERMAN

Video with sights (and a glimpse of pictures of axes):

Yet the name of this entity is sometimes used as if it were a brand of, or business alias for, Marble's Gun Sight, Inc.

Once there was a Marble Arms and Manufacturing Company, 5390 Delta Ave., Gladstone, MI. That seems to be the company before it's first financial colapse in the 1960's.

That’s an absolute perversion of the Marbles #10 Camp Axe. I hope they’re not really calling that a #10.

That’s an absolute perversion of the Marbles #10 Camp Axe. I hope they’re not really calling that a #10.

"Marble Outdoors" is a registered assumed name (2002) for some entity. It expired sometime before 1/1/2016.
"Marbles" is a registered trademark.
"Marble's Knives" is an alias or brand.

 

[Thomas Linton]

REVIEW

See post 2 above for overall appearance.

Arrived by Amazon today.

Head is very symmetrical. Grind is somewhat crudely done, but easy to fix with a file and some sandpaper.

Secondary wedge seems to be aluminum, as described by Council.

Nicely hung.

Really good handle - absolutely vertical tight grain. Nice fit.

Forged to shape and ground to finished bevel

UPC 57440 83833

 

[sharpetoys]

My dad passed away last year and i inherited his vast knife collection. This is one of the pieces. This has to be prior to 2004 I believe. How do I tell? I know it was USA made and not china. I am trying to determine a fair price.

 

[phantomknives]

Well, we can't give you a price as it is against the rules. I am not of any help on this topic but I bet if you find a way to email them they can give you a range of years