Marketing tips for the beginner

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Feb 23, 2023
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I got some unfortunate news from the doctor recently and from the sounds of it my ability to hold down a normal job(set hours) is going to decline steadily over the coming years so I decided to invest in a Brodbeck grinder and evenheat oven to skill build while coming up with a plan to transition into knife/tool making as a potential career.

I’m not too worried about designing and coming up with efficient ways to tackle tasks. Marketing and sales however are areas in which I have truly no experience and find incredibly daunting.

I guess my question is what avenues are most approachable for a beginner makers and what would you focus on if you were in my shoes? Im truly lost when it comes to this so any advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
I've sold on etsy and started on ebay recently both selling platforms allow for add's and etsy has an option to pay a %age if something sells from there marketing efforts without any upfront payment.
Etsy has it's problems good for to start with and better to move away from once it's more than you care for (I started moving away from Etsy)
Ebay has some high fee's but there customer service has been very helpful (just started selling on ebay cant speak on if there are issues or not)

facebook market is anther place to sell but is a great way to show off your work and show pictures plenty of knife groups on facebook as well.
instagram is another option to showcase work.
doing both the making and marketing will be draining,I recommend making a good 10 knives in between marketing efforts that way you are not doing both at the same time for each knife you make.

you might also reach out to some friends and offer a free knife if the can help spread the word and help by posting some links to your shop,facebook and website here and their on social media platforms also give them some business cards to hand out if the subject of knives comes up with anyone they know.

my grandfather used to work construction framing electrical all home renovation types of work and he was successful from good work fair costs and only by word of mouth so if you can get a good reputation by word of mouth from your local community it can make a huge difference.
 
Well, first you need to produce a quality product that people want to buy. I have heard it said, "Any one can make a knife, but to make a knife that someone wants to buy is something else."
I sold my first knife in 1980. A custodian at the school I taught at bought it. One of the other teachers at the school bought one from me.
Show your knives to friends and family, give some away. Word of mouth is very important.
I started selling at knife and gun shows. To be successful you must keep going to the same shows. people need to see you there year after year. You must have patience and answer a lot of dumb questions. You need to be able to explain why your knife is more desirable than one from Wal-Mart.
Hand out business cards. See if the local news paper will run an article on what you do.
I bought and read the book "Dummies for selling". It had a lot of good ideas.
At a gun show I got several repeat customers.
At one gun show I sold a knife to a customer, later he bought my entire inventory of 30 knives.
The Blade Show is the best show, but your work needs to be top quality. When I used to go to the Blade show, I got the names and addresses of those who bought from me, and the next year I would send them a free pass to the Blade show.
I no longer go to shows. A local sporting goods store sells my knives and all I do is make them.
Knifemaker as a rule are very helpful with information, but there are lots of knifemakers and it can be a challenge to compete with them when it comes to selling a knife.
 
Welcome Busted Carpenter. Filling out your profile with location and some info will help us a lot with advice and offers of help. Right now, we don't know if you ever make a knife or are just a hobby maker with a HF 1X30. The info needed will help us advise you on your question.

The custom search engine in the stickys will find you dozens of threads on becoming a full time knifemaker, selling knives, etc.. Most will tell you full time knifemaking doesn't work out for 99% of those who try.

Knifemaking for a living is HARD! I am not trying to talk you out of it, but you need to know the hard facts and realities.

Ok, here is some advice and hard facts:
Economics - It is hard to make living in knifemaking. The old saying is, "If you want to make a $1,000,000 making knives, start with $2,000,000. The other line is, "Knifemaking is easy as a profession as long as you have a wife with a good paying job and benefits."
Look through the knives here in Shop Talk and in the galleries as well as The Exchange and ask yourself, "If it was easy, whey doesn't every one of those guys just quit his job and sell knives."
It may be exciting to sell a knife or three to friends or at a show, but to make a living you need to sell them repeatedly year-round. If you need $30,000 a year to survive, you will likely have to sell around $90,000 a year to make that. If your profit averages $75 a knife, to make $30,000 after expenses you need to make and sell 400 knives a year ... every year. There will be licenses, taxes, show table fees, transportation/meals/lodging. Your home insurance or local codes may prohibit you from running a business or doing things like knifemaking (fire codes, etc.). There are many more unseen costs I won't go into.

Equipment and supplies can be costly. - Many small-time makers never recoup the cost of their equipment. It would be lovely if it was only a grinder and a HT oven. Most full-time folks have $20K to $100K in equipment. A garage is fine for hobby knifemaking, but you will need a dedicated shop of sufficient size for production knifemaking.

Knifemaking may be easier that carpentry, but it is physically taxing. To do it day-in and day-out you need proper breathing gear and GOOD quality dust and spark extraction. A simple mask isn't going to keep you healthy for long. I recommend a good PAPR like Breath Easy by 3M.

Start by making knives on a regular schedule. Post photos and descriptions of the knives you make in Shop Talk and let folks help you improve them to selling quality.

Try to pick one or two basic and simple styles at first and perfect them before going to a larger inventory. Making a drop point hunter and a medium size kitchen knife is a good start. In the same manner, pick a few good handle materials and stick with them for a while. Having 20 styles of knives with 20 types of wood may look cool, but makes selling hard. I recommend canvas Micarta, walnut, and maple as good starter handle materials. It is best to use stabilized woods. Have a sheath (or blade cover for a kitchen knife) for every knife on the table. You can make them yourself or sub that out to a leather guy.

Avoid weird shapes, handles, odd angles, etc. Look at hundreds of photos of the knives made by those who sell a lot of knives, and you will see that simple sells the best.

Test your knives well to assure the blades are properly hardened, shaped, and sharpened. If you end up a full-time maker you will need equipment to do this, but in the beginning cutting tests and files will tell you enough. Listen to what people tell you about your knives. If someone says, "The blade is nice but the handle is too fat and the butt needs some drop", don't answer, "I made 'em that way on purpose because I have big hands." If you are making them for yourself, fine, but if you want to sell them, they need to fit everyone else's hands and tastes.
As suggested, in the beginning, give some of your better early knives to friends who will use them and give you honest feedback.

Keep working at it for a year or two and don't get discouraged. Once ready in quality and skills, try selling at a local knife show, a craft show, or even a good size flea market. In the beginning you may only sell one or two knives.

Pricing??? First, I want to tell you about one of the forum rules. People with less than a Knifemaker membership level can not directly discuss sales or prices. You can post about a knife you made and ask about it, but you can't ask about what it should sell for or what you plan on selling it for.

Start with knives in an affordable range. Don't expect to get what the big-name fellows get. Knives priced between $75 and $150 sell the fastest and easiest. It may take years to make a regular profit that is sustainable.

Again, not telling you you can't do it, just that it isn't a simple task.
 
I have been telling new makers who have a clientel to not stop working their day jobs. Knife making as a side gig hobby is good but I would never want to try and hustle full time pay the bills amount of work.

The market is saturated with quailty products even more now that Larrin has got everyone thinking about steel and optimal heat treat.

Unless you don't have to worry about life finances I would not be planning on knife making as a job replacing activity.
 
like any other business, knife making requires a period of time to reach profitability. Most businesses fail in the first 3 years, if you make it to 5 years+ the chances of long term success go up quite a bit. So that means a venture like this has to be supported for at least 3 years somehow. That requires sacrifice and strategic thinking.

there are many things which are more important than marketing. In my view, the MOST important thing is minimizing costs. We can't look at our corporate overlords for direction here; they exist as they do due to borrowing- they're a different kind of animal. For an individual trying to captain his own destiny, borrowing capital can be like digging a grave- if you make it all the way to 6 feet down you might as well jump in. Keeping expenses low is the key, and breaking even on those costs with your work is often the best outcome you can hope for in the first few years of running your own gig.
 
I have actively been marketing and building brand loyalty for 8 years. I have spent way to much time on social media platforms talking the talk, it has gotten old but I keep plugging away.

Through this time I have also been watching the market and following other makers. Have seen many of them start to become popular then crash for various reasons and others have done well but now are trying hard to hustle sales as their niche market as been filled with product.

When it comes down to it most all of the people buying knives already have more then they will need in 3 lifetimes. When economy starts declining many of these people stop buying knives and start selling. Right now the secondary market is pretty flooded with collectors thinning the heard. Hard to be a new maker trying to get a market share when the market is flooded with knives being sold at cutthroat prices.

I am debt free in knife shop and watch bottom line and order material in bulk. Profit margin is decent but every year I do taxes I realize how little I actually clear making knives and how I am sitting at the bottom one percent for earnings, which my so thinks is hilarious.

Make knives because you like to make knives but I would seriously reconsidered it being a decent future job.
 
I got some unfortunate news from the doctor recently and from the sounds of it my ability to hold down a normal job(set hours) is going to decline steadily over the coming years so I decided to invest in a Brodbeck grinder and evenheat oven to skill build while coming up with a plan to transition into knife/tool making as a potential career.

I’m not too worried about designing and coming up with efficient ways to tackle tasks. Marketing and sales however are areas in which I have truly no experience and find incredibly daunting.

I guess my question is what avenues are most approachable for a beginner makers and what would you focus on if you were in my shoes? Im truly lost when it comes to this so any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Hi there,

So sad to read your predicament, I hope that at 29 yrs old you do not become too disillusioned with your situation. Its good to have a goal, and good luck with your endeavors.
When you see some of the knives on here selling for a couple of hundred dollars or, frequently, much less, its easy to see that the market is massively over saturated. It looks, to me, like makers should be charging three times what they are to make a decent living. I think its a wonderful hobby, but I think it would be a long hard road through the vale of tears to reach the top table and feast. That's not to say it cant be done! and a big plus is that you are young enough to put in the years.
 
To share the more optimistic (but still with some practical advice) side, I’ve been a full time knife maker for almost 5 years. Some quick personal information, I am married but no kids, I live in northern Kentucky and bought my house at a great price so have a very affordable mortgage and have a reliable car that we currently lease. When I started as a maker full time my wife was working a good paying job and we could have practically lived off her income, between year 1-2 at some point she was able to leave that job and help with the business from home and focus on her own hobbies that she wanted to turn into businesses. Year three we were able to hire a contract employee in the shop for several months (this was a mistake we jumped into too soon and set us back a bit due to some issues with a large client we had at the time) my wife decided to go back to work during this time and we ended up having to stop the contract with the employee we brought on (who ended up finding his dream job right after and we are still friends so happy ending there) now my wife works a job she enjoys because she wants to be there but could leave at any point. All of this information may be unnecessary but it’s a timeline of my journey making knives for a living, it can be done but it is a lot of hard work and can be uncertain at times depending on your situation. Social media is important and it is best if you post on platforms like Instagram and Facebook daily, if you don’t like social media you’ll have to get over that. Back in the 70-80s the equivalent would be traveling and doing the show circuits and there are still some really good shows out there but I’d say focusing on a online presence and attending a few big shows a year like blade show is likely a better approach. Another critical point in my opinion is partnering with dealers and distributors, they can help you reach customers you might not have reached on your own and will often move more volume in the long term/consistently. A lot of the makers I’ve seen struggle try to just do on their own, they don’t want to give up the 30-40% for the dealer and may have periods with lots of sales then saturate their customer pool and sales slow down and if they didn’t save enough during the high point they may not make it out of the low point. If you look at 30% of your knife sale in terms of time selling through a dealer starts to make a lot of sense, if I bill shop time at $100 an hour or more and it takes me 10-15 minutes to stage a knife for photos and do a very quick edit on those photos, 5-10 minutes to write a description that’s interesting and grabs someone’s attention, another 5 minutes to load it on the website, 5-10 minutes to package a knife to ship individually versus a similar amount of time to package 20-30 to go to a dealer. Individual shipping cost at $10-$15 per knife to most places and then the time to actually try and sell that knife and then taking it to a post office or shipping location you could have close to an hour in time outside of making the knife. Most of my knives I have on average 1-2 hours of hands on labor so in the time spent selling a knife myself I could make another knife or be half way done with a knife. Occasionally I still sell pieces directly and places like social media and bladeforums can be good for that, with a knife makers membership you can post in a handmade knife market here but social media can definitely have a bigger reach. I’d suggest starting social media pages for your potential knife business now and start posting regularly documenting your journey of learning to make good knives and by the time your quality gets to the point they are worth selling you may have a decent following or contacts to make it a real business. If you get to a point you are making really good knives and struggling with the business side find a local community college that offers business courses and see if there’s something you could learn from that and apply to selling knives.
 
Also if you are serious about this while you can still comfortably work a standard 9-5 put as much as you can into tools so when you make the switch you theoretically have a fully outfitted shop and can operate with minimal cost. But also on the flip side doctors say a lot of things but we are what we make of ourselves and are only limited but what we say we can do. I’ve seen people overcome significant set backs and find new ways to accomplish the same task and I’ve seen people take diagnoses to heart and are never the same and in those cases they are the only thing limiting themselves. I’ve had bad knee injuries and I’ve had doctors tell me I should just find a job sitting down or I’m just going to be in pain, and sure I have bad days when it’s hard to be on my feet for long periods but I also have days that I just have to block out the pain and push through. If I let everyday be a “bad” day I’d never get anything done.
 
Making knives Has to be done for something other than money..... I don't see how else it's being done.

Like others have said, we don't know your knife background?
Are you starting from scratch, or have you been in already for a few years?


I was a tool room machinist in one form or another most of my life.
Physical work.
Idk if it's my age, but knife making hurts More. In countless ways. You will be using muscles you never knew you had. Hands hurts. Wrists hurt. Neck hurts, forearms, feet, eyes, a close comparison for young people is.... I feel like I just got done playing a new video game. That feeling. Sitting relatively still, focused, micro movements, determined..... For Hours and Hours.
Your mind hurts afterwards when you close your eyes.
It's work.

As mentioned, marketing doesn't really matter much.
Make a good knife.

The hardest part is making Enough knives. Quantity.
I sell everything I make usually seconds after its made.
But I wouldn't be able to make enough to live.

My original plans were to make knives (part-time) as an extra income stream when I retire.
I don't think I want that now.... Idk?
It's an unbelievable amount of work. Tons.

Now, my thoughts are that I'm making knives to make others happy.
That makes me happy.
And I Love knives!!!!
Keeps me active. Meeting new people. Learning. Keeping my brain thinking. Doing.
It Can't be about money.

*I'm naturally a Contrarian.
I don't do and believe what, Others are thinking.

My first thought on your dilemma is to get a new/different doctor!
Find someone who can help you.
Or, join a good Yoga class. (Seriously)

Also for sore aches and pains, look up magnesium oil.

Magnesium chloride in distilled water...... It's Amazing!!!!!
 
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Needless to say if you are a Forged in Fire Champion you are sitting at a different level of name recognition...
 
Crag the Brewer Crag the Brewer

If your selling a knife in seconds they are too cheap, double the price. You will be better off losing thirty percent of your customers but making treble the profit on each one, it would also alleviate the "cant make them fast enough" problem.
 
Needless to say if you are a Forged in Fire Champion you are sitting at a different level of name recognition...
I was a full time knife maker making a living for 2 years before getting on the show, not going to say it doesn’t help but most of my customer base finds out I was on the show after they have already bought a knife or two from me. And it is something I rarely mention to dealers when making those connections.
 
Thank you all for the awesome advice, it is more helpful than I imagined. Apologies for the lack of profile content(I’ve never participated in a forum before so there will be some learning curve for me) , I will update it following the completion of my current project.

I live in Edmonton Alberta, and was working as a welding inspector/project coordinator(dislocated my shoulder ending my carpentry career a few years back). I’ve always loved well made tools, and knifemaking has always been a dream of mine. I started a a little over a year ago and in my spare time I’ve made ten or so with a 1” wen grinder, forge and a lot of sweat equity but was apprehensive to selling to folks I don’t know because I wasn’t 100% confident in my heat treating using the forge (learning to eye w2 within a 75 degree range is not something I’m confident I can learn without the help of someone with decades of experience)

My condition isn’t physical in the strictest sense, potions of my brain have been losing connection, particularly the one which regulates my sleep patterns so it has become nearly impossible to wake up at a set time of day. The results from my spinal tap indicate MS tho they are still testing to rule out some of the more exotic potential causes,

I appreciate the cautions regarding full time viability. I should have specified I intend to continue working and taking a few months off a year dedicated to learning the craft, each year trying to add additional months supported by knife making because I love the process.

I’ve learned a great deal of what I know about the knifemaking process from this forum and really appreciate everyone on it, I look forward to participating and(once I can figure out how) posting my work for you folks to pick apart in the hopes of making me a better maker!
 
Crag the Brewer Crag the Brewer

If your selling a knife in seconds they are too cheap, double the price. You will be better off losing thirty percent of your customers but making treble the profit on each one, it would also alleviate the "cant make them fast enough" problem.

Maybe, but costing is a difficult subject, we Could fill many posts on the s subject.
Me personally, I'd rather sell Quickly, be in demand, and have the purchaser feel they got a good deal. That naturally could lead to more sales.

Think about the knives that you paid too much for....did you race out and buy Another one right away?

There are different philosophies about how to do it.

I've read that it's better to need to raise your price than it is to lower it!
(Big picture)
 
its standard business theory when you are selling fast and at maximum production capacity.

My old boss used to say, "dont be a busy fool"

If you cant make more knives what use is it getting more customers from recommendations? you have no leeway for increasing operating profit in your business, its flat out. If price goes up, profit goes up, and you gain manufacturing capacity which you then the sell at the new price.

I am not being flippant or disrespectful, I know how difficult the decisions are. Many make the mistake of thinking to increase manufacturing capacity by hiring staff then you are in the game of paying them before yourself.
 
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Joshua Fisher Joshua Fisher Most makers are not able to bill at 100 dollars per hour and they are spending more then 1-2 hours on a knife, I would say that is a fairly optimistic outlook.
 
Hey B BustedCarpenter - sorry to hear about the health issues. Personally, I am a hobby maker and mostly just make knives to give some creative relive from my very rigged/procedural tech job - so take my advice with a grain of salt. I sell on occasion to self fund the hobby but most of my stuff is gifts and personal fulfillment.

My recommendation would to be evaluate what direction you want to go as a maker and mirror (in your own personal style) others who have found succuss in that avenue with your personal touch as a individual maker. Do you want to make and sell lots of knives like LT. Wright/Bark River or do you want to make a few over the top customs and charge a higher premium? Do you want to have a ongoing lineup of knives or take custom orders from customers? And lastly and most importantly do you like making knives and see yourself doing this full time?

Transparency, honestly and a quality product will go the furthest - if people know about you. If you want to be full time maker an online presence on most of the social media platforms is required and you will need a solid following on Instagram, Facebook, Bladefourms and maybe even Youtube. This is the direction things are moving. Also take a look at the common complaints in maker sub-forums and other areas and see what are common issues. Missed/delayed orders seem to be a huge issue and really turn buyers off.

Best of luck friend. Look forward to seeing where you go with this. Joshua Fisher Joshua Fisher is a pro and his advice is a great example of of the potential up side.
 
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