Mass Production Knife Steels

C

Craig55

Joined
Apr 21, 2002
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I've read a half dozen books and some online and magazine literature on knife steel pros and cons, but mostly what the custom or handmade knifemaker is using. Is there a definitive guide somewhere that specifies what companies use what steel in each of their mass produced knife series? Also, hopefully there is a discussion on what differences one company's version/heat treat, etc. of a certain common steel compared to another company that uses the same steel.
Maybe there would be a discussion as to why a company chooses a certain steel over another including costs, delivery schedules, ease of working, etc. For instance what is "TruSharp" steel.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Craig
 
I don't know where you will find that kind of information. Anything you find posted on the websites of the manufactures is going to basically be propaganda. They will of course say that their heat treat is better than the competition.

Most big companies choose the steel they are going to use based on cost, ease of getting the steel and whether it is a steel that will be available way into the forseeable future. Some companies have their own steels made up. They are usually very close in chemical makeup to some other readily available knife steel. The reason they do this is so that they can put their own trademarked name on this steel. Then they can start telling everyone just how much better it is than any other steel being used by their competitors. As far as I am concerned it ia usually just a bunch of hype.
 
"True-Sharp" is 420 stainless, either 420HC or 420M. Lots of other companies use this, such as Buck, Camillus, etc. It is a good steel, cheap and easy to machine. Certainly not as good as 440C, D2, or 154CM, though.

All in all the issue of blade steel can be a bit overblown, IMHO. Good 'ole 1095 Carbon and 420HC/440A will work fine if heat treated and sharpened properly.

Regards,
Clay
 
Clay,

I appreciate the brief rundown on production knife steel. Could I ask you to go out on a limb and pick a couple of your favorite mass produced knives and why? From what I have been reading over the past few years and you mention it again, heat treating seems to be the achilles heel in knife making regardless of mass production or handmade. Which mass production companies do a good job of heat treating in your humble opinion.

As far as knife uses I like to use one knife for many things and a short bladed <3" fixed blade knife seems the easiest to access quickly if you don't mind the stares from urbanites who think you are some cheap Crocidile Dundee imitation. The trouble is I'm having a hard time finding a fixed blade that can open an envelope, slice a piece of cheese, whittle a point on a stick, open up a large cardboard box and slice up some cut bait. Hopefully the Queen 89SW will have a thin enough blade with a pretty flat grind, with enough toughness to accomplish all those tasks day in and day out.

The knife that comes closest to being able to do this is knife a friend of mine put together by using a broken Kissing Crane slipjoint and pinning a handle on 3&1/2" blade, crude but it works. I like the Grohman flatginds but the blades are too wide and knives too long to carry discreetly. I do have a an old Case XX marked 523-3&1/4 that works OK, but the blade is sort of a modified hollow convex grind, which reduces its usefulness. Recently I have purchased both a Benchmade McHenry & Williams 440C and an AG Russel D2 Arclite. After making new sheaths for both, I'll be finding new homes for these knives with a nephew or some young soldier who doesn't have a decent knife. Neither knife works for me aesthetically or in the everyday use category.

I have a few other knives and have had a few, some handmade others production, but the two that have stayed with me the longest are two slipjoints and they are both single locking blades. One is Boker Tree Brand 1000 and the other is the old Queen. The Boker has no lanyard hole so makes it pulling out of a sheath a bit harder than the Queen. Both are flat ground but the Boker has the thinner blade. I abused both in a time when I didn't respect a good tool, wish I hadn't now.

I guess I'll just have to learn to make my own knife like I did the sheaths. I've made some drawings but haven't bit the bullet and sent them off to see how much it would cost to have someone else make my design. Probably should get a belt grinder and get started myself. Incidentally, I am pretty handy with a variety of sharpening stones, but favor the EdgePro system as invariably I seem to want to put a new edge on most of my knives, one that allows me to easily touchup with a stone while watching the "tube" or a pocket DMT out in the canoe or in the woods.

I would like some recommendations for that "perfect" everyday use knife and why.

Thanks for listening.

Craig
 
Craig, another way to find answers to these questions is,get a copy of Krause publications, "Knives 2002". They List all the current manufacturers in the back. Just give them a call, and ask.:D
 
Camillus is the largest and oldest knifemaker in the U.S., if not the world. They have a long history of making knives for the U.S. Military and allied countries. Quality, prices, and customer service are very good. They manufacture knives for Cold Steel, Remington, and many others, including the Becker line. Their heat treating method has been updated and improved as well.

Ontario, another longtime manufacturer, makes the Queen, Robeson, and Shatt&Morgan line, as well as several others, and they hold several military contracts. The new Queen knives with D2 steel are probably the best choices where serious edge retention is needed.

My favorite traditional knife to date is the Case Copperlock. I have one with red bone handles that is near perfect, but I had to look through about a dozen or so to find it. However, I've recently heard that quality control at Case has gone up quite a bit. Customer service at Case is excellent.

Buck Knives has two really good lines of traditional knives, and the steel is 420HC. Buck's heat treat is excellent, and customer service is top notch.

Imperial Shrade has a long time reputation for traditional knives at a good price, and has great customer service as well.

www.schradeknives.com
www.buckknives.com
www.camillusknives.com
www.ontarioknife.com
www.casesales.com

For an inexpensive working knife I would go with Camillus or Buck, but for a nice looking carry piece I would go with a Case. If I wanted better steel then I'd look at the new Queen line with D2, or a Shatt&Morgan with ATS-34.

We are blessed to have so many good companies to choose from!

Regards,
Clay

www.midsouthshooters.com
www.agrussell.com
 
Clay and Mike,

Thanks for the suggestions and information. I'm hoping that between the two Queen D2 knives I've ordered lays to rest my desire for the "perfect" everyday knife. My almost perfect knife is a little Damascus 2" fixed blade Damascus (type unknown) made by some fella named Jim Sharp, has ebony slabs and copper bolster. The blade could be longer and a bit flatter in grind for my tastes, but I picked it up at an antique store. Ain't got a clue who Jim Sharp is or if the knife is an antique. It cuts well when sharp and it wouldn't stay sharp long, so like I often do, I changed the edge angle to see if I can keep this thing cutting a variety of things for a few days before touching up.

I've always been somewhat suspicious of the virtues of "Damascus" over other steels. There are so many varieties and makers of "Damascus" it is probably easier to get inferior stuff than good and then there must be job specific Damascus too I suppose.

I had a couple of D2 knives before made by a fella who is a brother to an old Army buddy of mine. Two prototypes they were, out of AR. The things were so darn thick and the edge angle so steep that they made better chisels, railroad spikes or too light of hatchets than using knives.

Anyway, thanks for the talk and I'll make a comment or two on the Queen D2s when I get them.

Craig in TN
 
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