Mini Mills and Surface Grinder

William Schrade

William Schrade

Joined
Jul 30, 2012
Messages
627
I just sold a Vintage BMW that sat in my garage and haven't ridden in four years and decided to turn it into some shop tools. I've been looking at mini mills and wondering what you guys use and your opinion of them. I've also e-mailed Travis Wuertz about his surface grinder attachment but he doesn't respond. Does anyone know if he is still making grinders and attachments.

Thanks



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I can't answer about Travis but, if you have the capability, I strongly recommend a standalone surface grinder. You will have far more capability in the long run. I imagine you will be needing to make jigs and fixtures for your folders and being able to clamp a part into a machinist vise to grind a square edge is not something you'll be able to do on the TW-SGA. Also, don't go too small on the mill for the same reasons. I highly recommend the Rong-Fu RF-45. It is probably a lot bigger than what you're thinking but it will probably never limit you. Enco makes a clone that is very popular. I highly recommend that you get a real DRO with whatever mill you end up buying.

Bob
 
I'd spend more on the mill and get something bigger than a mini, a large mill can surface OK also. I have a LMS Hi torque Mini Mill and while it gets the job done I wish I had gotten something with more mass. Grizzly has some good looking mills with dovetailed columns I am looking at. Then again if you have your reasons (like me... my shop has a wooden floor) you can do a whole lot with mini mill.
 
If you wanted to go the RF-45 route there's a guy in LI I talked to about his Grizzly version (oops it's an RF-40) for sale on CL. I am turned off by the round column but with all the extras he has you might want to call him.

I had a birthday last week and didn't get anything but my wife said I could buy a mill. I don't think I could afford one but if I could I would pick up a LMS 3990. Looks to be the best Sieg x2 out there.

Mark

Edit: the one in Long Island is an RF-40 which is the round column. The RF-45 would be the square.

This was my 1000th post! Gearing up for a big give away so stay tuned.
 
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You should try and call Travis, I spoke to him last week and he is a wonderfully helpful guy.
 
As far as Travis goes, just call him. He usually picks up right away, and is a stand out guy. He can take a sec to respond via email.

I got my TW-90 like 3 days ago. So I know he is still alive lol
 
A friend of mine just ordered a TW90 so yes he's around.

I wouldn't recommend a mini-mill unless it's a budget thing. I get pretty frustrated with mine. It's okay for guard slots and that's about it.
 
I have a mini mill which I haven't used for anything yet. It seems like all the PM stainless I can find is .143 on up when I need .07, .100, and .125. Surface grinding costs a small fortune - seems like almost as much as the stainless. Is it possible to mill the steel?
 
I have 2 knife maker friends that bought a mini mill and thought it would be all they need, they are now looking for bigger mills...
 
I bought a PM932M with DRO from Quality Machine Tools that I'm quite happy with and then picked up a used surface grinder. I would recommend going larger on the mill than what you think you will need, I'm glad I did.
 
My advice for a mill is buy the largest you can afford and fit into your shop. A nice Bridgeport clone would be perfect. But it needs to fit into your shop. Rigidity is everything in a mill, mass equals rigidity. A mini mill will slot guards and drill holes but not much else.

I too like the idea of a stand alone SG. There are some small manual types out there for reasonable$$. Or get on Craigs list in your area. I have seen quite a few for under a grand. They are almost always 3 phase but there are ways to work around that.
Then there is the room issue again. If you are tight the TW SG would work fine more 90% of what you would need for general knife making.
 
Thanks for the insight guys. I was hoping it would do more. I have access to a Bridgeport but have to travel a half hour to my brothers shop. I was looking for the convenience of having one in the home shop. I'll look at buying a surface grinder and set it up in his shop.
 
I have Travis's surface grinder. It's great if you don't have a surface grinder and are doing one knife at a time. When I bought it I didn't have the room to put a surface grinder. So if shop space is limited then Travis's set up is the way to go.

When I make large batches now I take the blanks to a machine shop and have them surface ground. It takes me a lot of time to do 100 knives at a time on a set up designed to only do one knife at a time. Where as the machine shops can do up to 10 at a time and I don't have to pay for the belts. I get charged their shop rate and in a few hours I have all them surface ground and can continue on. I use Travis's surface grinder for forged, and prototype knives only now.

I also made the mistake in the past of buying a mini mill. It was great to learn the basics on, but quickly found it just wasn't a big enough mill. Now I have a G3103 from grizzly. It's a little knee mill, that is not quite as big as the Rong Fu mentioned earlier. The Rong Fu is a great machine. But I couldn't buy that one as I did not have access to 220V. The 3103 was 110 and was plug and play, and also easier to disassemble and take the pieces to my shop and reassemble the machine. If you go with a similar model from grizzly only get the one made from Taiwan. All the Chinese versions have to have the spindle replaced before using. Now that my shop is in an industrial space I'm always on the look out for bigger and better equipment. As soon as a Bridgeport or clone become available locally in good shape with a decent price I will snatch it up. The same goes with my own surface grinder.

Being that you are from CT head to New Haven and check out Charter Oak Automation. They used to be Industrial Hobbies. They import Rong-Fu's and rebuild them. I wouldn't go so far as to buy a CNC version but buying one with a DRO already installed and rebuilt to better specs is a great option.
 
I have owned a couple of the smaller mills. The Sieg X1, X2 & X3 mills are re-sold by many and are pretty rubbish in my opinion. Fit and finish are not great, and the machines just aren't constructed nicely. LittleMachineShop has some great tooling but their mills are all Sieg machines and I'd avoid them personally.

I have a mill that's the same as the Grizzly G0704 (often known as the BF20L) and it's a really nice smaller mill. Good speed control, fairly rigid and overall pretty nice to use. I've done a lot of research on this in the past, and it seems that in the smaller mills the G0704/BF20L is king of the hill. It's also got larger overall travels than most of the other machines which is really nice.

All of these smaller import mills are made by a few companies, then rebranded by many. The BF20L is sold by a few different brands:

Grizzly (G0704)
King Canada (KC20VS)

There are many more brands that sell it but I don't know their model numbers off the top of my head...
 
One problem with the G0704 is plastic drive gears. Right now replacements will not be back in stock until the end of October. We converted our G0704 to belt drive two days ago.

Chuck
 
I got a LMS 3960 about two years ago and love it. Also have used a Sherline for around 16 years and it does all this knifemaker needs.

Look for a used surface grinder, usually can be found for under 1K. Think mine was $600, 6x12 manual.
 
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I have run a HF Mini Mill for many years and make all kind of stuff on it. Bigger is always better but if you do not have the room or ability to move the mill be sure to take that into consideration.

The first upgrade for the mini mill should be a belt drive.

Here are some of the PCP airgun parts I make on the mini mill. I sell them all over the world for these airguns.


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NewWokbuttAFSTRAP1_zpsc0de567d.jpg

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You can do a lot with the mini mill if you have the knack

I use mine a lot. Sure a bigger mill would be better but it just is not an option.
 
I have a little Benchmaster vertical mill. They can be a little hard to find at times but it is great for milling guard slots and such. Would like to have a bigger mill but space limitations doesn't allow it right now. Sure beats drilling and filing in slots by hand though.
 
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