money no object!

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nmgross

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Aug 29, 2006
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if money were no object and wear on grinding belts were no object---what would be the best steel for a knife blade for hunting, would it be d2, s30v, or none of these?
I want to make a blade that will keep an edge the longest and be tough enough to last.
what to harden it to?
 
If money were no object, I'd pay some other poor sap to clean and dress my game!

j/k

What other steels have you made knives out of? Some of these new 'supersteels' have a 'super' learning curve for proper grind techniques, and heat treating on most is way beyond the capabilities of a backyards bozo like me. I'll stick to carbon steels for a while, and maybe in 10 years or so I'll feel proficient enough to try something else.
 
I'm guessing that you may get quite a few people recommending S30V.

. . . But I'm curious what kind of responses you will receive, as well.

Mike L.
 
Honestly, if money were no object, I'd pay the best maker I could find to make the blade and heat treat it properly. Poor HT can make any steel worthless. Conversely, a good HT can make even one of those "lame" simple carbon steels cut like nobody's business. The magic is in the heat treat, not the steel.

Just my $.02,

-d
 
for a nice user hunting knife...0-1. Why not? Its easy as hell to sharpen and hold a good edge. I dread the day when my S30V blade gets dull. Glad I have a grinder :)

Seriously, 0-1 can be touched up with little more than a strop. If money were no object I'd get 3 knives instead of 1 high dollar steel variant but thats me :)
 
Non stainless: CPM3V hardened to 62 rc
Stainless CPM S90V Hardened to 59 rc
S30V Hardened to 62
Leon Pugh
 
Well M4 is being used alot more in winning and "toward the top finishers" in cutting competition, and the guys winning with that steel are not the tall, powerful, "wouldn't want to make mad" guys the size of John Fitch. John is a
wonderfully fine maker and stayed way near the top if not at it, in competition, for some time...so the comparison is meant purely complimentarily.....and honest.
By the way, if you wanna catch the enthusiasm about cutting competition, talk with Warren Osborne and Gayle Bradley and some of the other ICCT folks...talk about excited competitors!!!!
0-1 is a fine workable steel and holds a good edge, and is real "sharpenable".
S30 V is a fine stainless and holds an edge darn fine...but it is harder to sharpen because of that.
From an edge holding point of view, ceramic is good stuff....but it can be so brittle it can be broken...
I'd like to see you tryin CPM 154....it is a fine steel to work, it holds a pretty fine edge, it is sharpenable more than some of the "tougher" blades.
I still like 154CM and ATS34 as pretty darn good steels that have a combination of workability, re-sharpenability, performance, appearance.....all around, better steel than I need 99% of the timefor my own use.....

Heat treat quality is a definite asset creating quality....I am not a hammer and anvil guy...even though that is intriging, so I send my non-oil-quench steel to Paul Bos to have heat treated.....and I have never experienced, nor heard from anyone, anything but extreme positive opinions of his skill and results......and I support that fact about Paul, and he has done well over 1000 blades for me....
 
sunfishman said:
Well, if money were no object, W2 would be my choice :D :thumbup:
Click to expand...
"Money no object" part being finding some economical way to knock the stuff down from Russian wide-gauge track rail size down to 1/4 x 1 1/4 :D I have discovered that a hand hammer doesn't work too well unless you are Paul Bunyan:p
 
John R. Fraps said:
Well M4 is being used alot more in winning and "toward the top finishers" in cutting competition, and the guys winning with that steel are not the tall, powerful, "wouldn't want to make mad" guys the size of John Fitch. John is a
wonderfully fine maker and stayed way near the top if not at it, in competition, for some time...so the comparison is meant purely complimentarily.....and honest.
By the way, if you wanna catch the enthusiasm about cutting competition, talk with Warren Osborne and Gayle Bradley and some of the other ICCT folks...talk about excited competitors!!!!
0-1 is a fine workable steel and holds a good edge, and is real "sharpenable".
S30 V is a fine stainless and holds an edge darn fine...but it is harder to sharpen because of that.
From an edge holding point of view, ceramic is good stuff....but it can be so brittle it can be broken...
I'd like to see you tryin CPM 154....it is a fine steel to work, it holds a pretty fine edge, it is sharpenable more than some of the "tougher" blades.
I still like 154CM and ATS34 as pretty darn good steels that have a combination of workability, re-sharpenability, performance, appearance.....all around, better steel than I need 99% of the timefor my own use.....just my one of my uninformed little predjudices along with hollow grinds, guardless big knives, etc........typical ABS wienie, I guess......lol

Heat treat quality is a definite asset creating quality....I am not a hammer and anvil guy...even though that is intriging, so I send my non-oil-quench steel to Paul Bos to have heat treated.....and I have never experienced, nor heard from anyone, anything but extreme positive opinions of his skill and results......and I support that fact about Paul, and he has done well over 1000 blades for me....
Click to expand...
I had to chuckle when I saw you refer to ATS34 as "sharpenable" My brother and I have had nothing but heartache trying to resharpen Benchmade ATS34 folders over the past couple of years. They are harder for me to bring back than Henckels stainless kitchen knives. As for the cutting competition knives, the list of winners and top finsihers Ihave seen have kinda run the gamut of steel types once you take out Reggie Barker, who not only makes excellent knives, but seems to have just nailed the techniques required for winning. The reason I picked up a bunchof W2 from Don was that everything I heard and read said that it is not only a fantastic knife steel, but, for a forger like me, it is one that is relatively forgiving and can be worked start to finish right in my humble little garage without having to resort to outside heat treaters or exotic or expensive home methods like salt baths or HT ovens. i guess i am a little down on stainless anyway. I have owned some very fine stainless blades in my time, but even if I was making stock removal knives, I think I would still want to use W2 or O1.
 
I also think o-1 is some great stuff. It is the main steel i use to make all of my hard use knives. But i also hear you can make a great knife out of M1. Its a high speed steel used for making drill bits, milling cutters, taps, reamers, and all sorts of high speed things. Gayle Bradley made a knife for the cutting competition out of it and though expensive and rather hard to grind, performs quite well.
Below is a pic of Gayles knife

gayle_4.jpg
 
I've spent probably a few thousand dollars and tried pretty much every steel out there these last few years and honestly, I think I'm going to make a commitment with O1. It's not stainless, but man does it cut!! :thumbup:
 
I've spent probably a few thousand dollars and tried pretty much every steel out there (D2, A2, 1084, 5160, ATS-34, CPM 154, S30V, S90V, 3V, Talonite, etc, etc.) these last few years and honestly, I think I'm going to make a commitment with O1. It's not stainless, but man it's tough and it cuts very well!! If there ever was a steel that just wants to "bite" -it's O1!! It's not a "glamorous", fancy, latest flavor of the month, but it works superbly in all areas (except corrosion). :thumbup:
 
If....I'd ask one of the resident master smith's to forge up whatever they wanted to on an unlimited budget as long as it was a user/hunter. Probably not much of a risk, whatever steel was chosen.
Take care, Craig
 
nmgross said:
if money were no object and wear on grinding belts were no object---what would be the best steel for a knife blade for hunting, would it be d2, s30v, or none of these?
I want to make a blade that will keep an edge the longest and be tough enough to last.
what to harden it to?
Click to expand...

Talonite or stellite 6k would fit most of your request, but they are not steel!
The edge holding ability of a Blade is not as simple as hardness- VS -toughness. Corrosion, wear resistance, edge geometry and temperature are all factors that will mark success.
The Maker in this case is going to ask some Questions to narrow the field down to size.
1. Are you a skilled outdoorsman, Hunter, Game Possessor?
Answer Yes to all of these and your edge just got thinner.
2. Do you enjoy caring for your Equipment, (stainless or blued Guns? Iron or stainless skillet? Gas, Kerosene or electric lights at base camp)?
This will help the maker figure out if stainless is a real good idea!:thumbup: or maybe this is a carbon kind of a guy!:thumbup:
3.Is this a one knife camp? This knife was $300.00 it better cut wood, open cans, tent polls, Beacon (in the skillet), and give a nice shave!:D
4. (This one is Tricky) Is this Knife going to be used at Forty Below Zero?
Many steels that are very good at room temp, will blow out in this kind of weather and it is very hard to know which one will be used in the cold when it is being made!:confused:
I know that I did not give you the name of your new favorite blade material, or its hardness!
But I don’t know which one will work for you. That will be between you and your maker:)

I Think you like most of us are looking for a one size fits all steel, and I wish I could be more help!

If you do find one please let me know.:)
 
I would suggest Latrobe's new Duratech 20CV stainless. It's more wear resistant that S30V and tougher. The edge retention and toughness has been tested against S30V by an indendent lab and had 30% better edge retention and similar toughness. The stainless characteristics of 20CV are similar to S30V. The cost of 20CV is also similar to S30V.

See the articles on Rick Hinderer in the April 2007 Blade issue. Rick uses 20CV on his XM-18 tactical folder. He likes that it is easy to machine and polish, yet holds an edge well and is tough. 20CV also heat treats very easily.

This would be an excellent steel for a hunting knife that needs to hold an edge and withstand abuse, while being stainless.
 
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