MSNBC knife article

Here is the URL for an MSNBC article on knives. It is mainly about autos, but has some things to say about manual folders and knives in general. I am posting it mainly because this is the first mention of knife issues I have seen in the mainstream media in some time. Anybody have any opinions?
http://www.msnbc.com/news/378786.asp
 
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Quite an article. Especially this part:


"Knife industry leaders such as Benchmade's Mr. DeAsis are discussing the possibility of making legislative pushes in some states to repeal laws that ban switchblades."

I like that. Funny that where I live right now I can't own an automatic, but if I crossed the Columbia river and bought a house, I could. Hmmm, it's really not that bad of a commute....
 
Man do I hate this kind of crap. They make it sound like Les DeAsis thinks that anyone who sells to anyone but military and police is some kind of evil arms merchant selling switchblades to gang members because normal knives are too slow to kill someone with.
And by the way, Mr. DeAsis might want to check and make sure he's selling to departments, not individuals. A dealer South of here, near St. Louis, got into deep trouble and ended up paying a hefty fine plus some probation for selling automatics. He was selling them only to people who had police and military ID. You heard that right. The court in Illinois not only said that the law only makes an exception if a police department wants to buy automatics, they also refused to do anything at all to the police officers who had bought autos from the dealer. I'm sure the police were ignorant of the law as much as he was (who can understand knife laws?) but why do they get off scot free while he shells out several thousand dollars?
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After reading the MSNBC article, I think that the knife community, manufacturers, merchants, and consumers, need to look at themselves honestly. If knives are advertised as weapons, how can we criticize non-knife lovers if they perceive knives as a threat? I can think of at least two companies, Boker and CRKT, that make references to self defense in their advertising. Also, we knife consumers are constantly talking about knives for self defense. We need to de-emphasize the weapon aspects of knives and we need to emphasize their utility as tools. I realize that many will argue that they have a constitutional right to publicly talk about self protection and defensive use of knives and they are right, however, just because you can do something doesn't make it a smart thing to. We need to work on educating the public as to the usefulness of pocket knives instead of dwelling on their use as weapons.

The second point is that all knife users need to mindful of local laws about the carry and posession of knives. For instance, if autos are illegal in your jurisdiction, don't buy them. If there is a three inch limit, don't carry an AFCK, Carnivore, Military, etc. Don't flash your knives unnecessarily but make it a point to use them in a constructive manner.

Finally, as for Benchmade working to legalize
autos, I think that this is a reasonable long term goal once the public is educated about knives and their use in crime. For instance, it needs to be stressed that most knife murders involve kitchen cutlery. However, I think that at this time the knife industry needs to stress knives as tools and the practicality of manual one handers before they spend too much time on autos. There are
a lot of old stereotypes that will have to be erradicated before the auto issue should be tackled.
 
CutFinger, I agree with everything you said. You are so darned rational. The only problem is that the American political system is Anything But rational.

Paracelsus, tool guy
 
<rant> Cutfinger, I am not diagreeing with you, in fact I completely agree...BUT it's a load of you-know-what that American citizens living in the land of the free(etc...) cannot defend themselves. It is a sad thing that I must refer to my knife as ONLY a tool, not that I have ever hand to use it for self-denfense, but why do I have to omit that aspect from my love of knives!?!?! Why, under the U.S. Constitution should i worry about saying ANYTHING??? It is a sad, pitiful world we live in where everything except the problem (i.e. people)is blamed. This article disgusts me. </rant>


Jared



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Broken promises don't upset me. I just think, why did they believe me?

I hope that after I die, people will say of me: "That guy sure owed me a lot of money."
 
The switchblade laws are totally useless and irrational, and should be repealed. But I preach to the choir, and we're surrounded by hordes of benighted heathen.
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Self defense is good. Being a dead victim is bad. Again, I preach to the choir.

The fact is that knives, when seen as weapons, are hopelessly politically incorrect, and have been since ancient times, long before anybody ever heard of a liberal. A sword is a symbol of lawful authority in many times and places, but a knife is a weapon for spies, assassins, thieves, peasants, and women.

Restrictive knife legislation is just as likely to come from conservative lawmakers as from liberal ones. There are places that are "cool" on concealed carrying of firearms, that severely frown on edged weapons. In talking to legislators about knives, we need to talk about practical tools for mundane and bloodless cutting chores.


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- JKM
www.chaicutlery.com
AKTI Member # SA00001
 
I don't think the idea of the sword being a legitimate symbol of authority while the knife having a less honorable reputation holds water any more, if it ever did. Even when the sword was the military weapon of choice, virtually everyone, soldiers included, carried knives as tools and utensils. Dinner guests were expected to bring their own cutlery in medieval times. Now that firearms have replaced the sword and spear, soldiers still carry knives when they can. Both for utility use and as weapons. Knives are still necessary for hand to hand CQB, even in this computer driven, laser guided age. I realize most sheeple have never given these issues any thought at all, and view all weapons with suspicion. My point though, is that even a fully armored knight with a broadsword would have had a knife as well. Ditto the modern soldier. Or the smart police officer.
 
I'm pretty much on the same page here, I just have a small problem with "if something is illegal in your jurisdiction, don't do it". I feel that it is my duty as an American to question laws that squeeze my rights to life, liberty, and pursuit(s) of happiness. I think legislation views my pursuits of happiness less as rights and more as priveleges that can be revoked at any time to make themselves feel safer.
It may just be my opinion, but the automatic knife laws seem to be just that: liberties given up to get a bit of safety. Ben Franklin said something like "When you give up liberty to gain safety, you get neither liberty nor safety." (Forgive me, Ben, if I flubbed the delivery a bit.)
I would gladly vote for a referendum that gave me back rights that were previously taken for no real good reason, be it based on knife issues or not.
 
I read and forewarded the article to Mike Turber yesterday.
What concerns me most is a feeling I've long had about the hazard of promoting folding knives as "tactical" or "fighters" as it applies to the quote in the article as follows " While the U.S. crime rate is falling, the use of knives in murders has risen slightly as a percentage of overall killings. FBI figures show that knives were used in 13.3% of the nation's 14,088 murders in 1998 (most recent figures) compared with 12.7% of 22,084 killings in 1994."
Easy-deploying knives, aggressive tactical advertising and increasing use of knives in murders (while the overall crime rate is falling) will surely awaken some squandering or want-to-be senator who will use knife reform as his political agenda.
This scenario, and a then hungry senator, caused the ban on autos as we now know it.
Frighten the uneducated public, have facts to back it up and you will have reform.
Later, Bill
 
Anyone have the statistics comparing how many of those knives used in murders were the 'high-end' stuff we are discussing here (including automatics) to how many were cheap junk, or even just sharpened scrap metal. I think they would show that the kind of people who are willing to shell out $100+ (and often more) for a knife will not use it in mugging someone (although you got to pay for the blades some way
wink.gif
).

--JB

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e_utopia@hotmail.com
 
I feel that we knife lovers and users should obey the laws in our jurisdictions. We all know some laws are dumb, but the way to change things is through protest and education. Simply violating a weapons law because one does not like it is counterproductive. For example, if one is caught with an auto or blade over the limit, how are LEO's supposed to know the difference between you and someone who is up to no good? Also, if, heaven forbid, the illegal knife was used in self defense, how will you look before a judge and jury who don't know you but do know you violated the law? Knife lovers cannot afford to come off as fanatics who feel inadequate if we aren't carrying Sifus or two AFOs in each pocket. We need to demonstrate that knives are useful tools. We also need to protect our manual one handers. Finally, companies must develop responsible ad campaigns for their products and forget all the weapon or tactical talk. Everybody knows that sharp, pointy objects can be used as weapons, we need to show how knives can aid life, not take life.
 
This artical was a typical headline grabbing scare tactic. I have trouble with media conspiracy theories. However we all know sensationalism sells. We all slow down to see the carnage of a wreck. The author conveniently noted the increase in knife murders after mentioning adds on "folding fighters" etc. He fails to mention how many of those murders were commitd by folding knives or other. The inference goes straight to the brain without passing go. The other liberty questioned here is the internet. The increase in autos wouldn't be happening if not for the free wheeling internet. bla bla bla. REEEEEEEGULATE or peril will abound. More government = less freedom. Fear of the boogey man will ruin this country. Lack of personal responsibility will fuel the fire. Where did the auther get the idea that Mr. D'Asis was trying to overturn the law regarding auto's. It's not quoted and he even calls the company "Benchmark".
O.K. I have just repelled off my large soap box. Bottom line, if a bill is presented restricting knives in any way, call your congressmen/women and senators and tell them "hell no, knives are goooooood".
 
California has decent laws I hear..

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[This message has been edited by MickMan (edited 03-21-2000).]
 
Frank; I think that is like saying you like humans better than cockroaches!

It never ceases to amaze me how Jim Mattis maintains his panache even when surrounded by cockroaches.

It is obvious to me that that forum is maintained solely for the purpose of keeping vermin like that away from forums which exist to engage in rational conversation and knowledge exchange. I rather like it for that reason; it is sort of a ethereal sewer.

Walt
 
James,
I enjoyed fighting the good fight with you over on MSNBC. Do you think it did any good?

Bill
 

When will we stop allowing the media to run this country !!

I agree with the postings above. A knife is a tool and should be referred to as such. Remember tools can be used for many things, ie. utility needs and self defense needs. People have asked me, "why do you carry a weapon like that". I laugh and say, it not a weapon, simply a tool for cutting.

Keep in mind, knives scare people. Would you want to be riped out by a 5 inch blade?



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I'm not nutz, I've just gone sebenza!

Shep
 
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