Multi tool selection help

Unless there are pressing financial reasons involved (dead broke:grumpy:), price at these levels should be a small consideration for something that is seldom purchased and intended for long term use. Even at twice the price, factored over years the cost difference is negligible.

There is no question that Victorinox designs and construction are top quality, but IMHO, Leatherman is well made and most of its implements are superior as working tools. Compared to Swisstool Spirit: the Charge has better shaped needlenose plier jaws that open wider; sharp cut screwdrivers less likely to slip; 2 knife blades, one made of 154 cm SS and both of which can be opened one handed; versatile bit holders allowing extended versatility; diamond coated file; pocket clip. I own both, admire the Spirit, EDC the Charge.

Price IMO should always be a factor, whether I'm rich or poor and Leatherman is the most expensive by far, something I do not understand.
Factored over the years, a lifetime warranty (Victorinox) is better than a 25 year warranty (Leatherman).

Then take into account Leatherman is more prone to corrosion and rust then any Swisstool/Spirit (see any forum's reviews on this) and IMO Victorinox is Superior and a better/more practical choice.
 
The Leatherman fit my needs, has better blades and I liked the ergo's better. Not every tool will work for every person, but the Charge seems to fit me perfectly.
 
Price IMO should always be a factor, whether I'm rich or poor and Leatherman is the most expensive by far, something I do not understand.
Factored over the years, a lifetime warranty (Victorinox) is better than a 25 year warranty (Leatherman).

Price is usually a factor that I approach by looking for the best deal on the specific product I want. On a major purchase involving thousands of $, I might compromise, and certainly it is a consideration for something you buy often, like gasoline, but in the range of $100 or less, which is what multitools go for these days, I see no reason to consider price. My first multitool purchase was an on sale Leatherman Super Tool that I carried for many years before getting another (a Swisstool, actually.) The same $40 could have bought a cheap evening out. Why be concerned about that amount of money spent so seldom? Best, of course, is when the thing you want is less expensive than the competition, which is sometimes the case.

Only the Leatherman Charge is "by far" more expensive than the Spirit. Both products compete directly on size and function, but there can be no direct price comparison. In terms of their construction, the Charge and Spirit are of two different categories, defined by titanium handles and a premium steel blade in the Charge, both of costly materials that are more difficult to manufacture. The Wave, basically a Charge made of all stainless steel like Vic product, is more appropriate for comparison, and there the difference in price is small, sometimes favoring Leatherman, depending on who is selling.

Titanium handles are an upgrade, small but quite noticeable, in handling comfort, and the 154 cm blade provides clearly superior performance. Some users find those things important and are willing to pay the extra, others do not. It's a personal call. Many folks prefer the Spirit, and that's fine, but those who like what the Charge has to offer are paying a fair price in the current market.

I'm an older guy, pretty sure that for me, 25 year and lifetime warranties are about the same. However, I would be willing to bet that Leatherman will continue to honor their warranty even beyond the stated limit. Unfortunately, I probably won't be around to collect :grumpy: .

Then take into account Leatherman is more prone to corrosion and rust then any Swisstool/Spirit (see any forum's reviews on this) and IMO Victorinox is Superior and a better/more practical choice.

Although I am aware of reports they are susceptible to rust, none of my several Leathermen, owned from 12 to 2 years, have done so. They get cleaned after each day's use and occasionally oiled. Once in a while, some others of my tools have rusted, none badly enough to be ruined. Usually I wipe it off or forget about it. Rust is not a big worry for me. Other than that, I cannot say.

Sorry this post is so long. I didn't have the time to make it shorter :D .
 
lol long post are sometimes good and informative, I can appreciate them. Now I don't mean to sound like a Leatherman basher, for the record I think they make very good tools, I think they listen to us the most, they have so many variations and styles and come up with some innovative designs (like the Skeletool).

TFin the Charge is a great MT, you've picked a good one, it should serve you well for a long time, please give us pictures and reviews when you get it, that would be great.

Price is usually a factor that I approach by looking for the best deal on the specific product I want. On a major purchase involving thousands of $, I might compromise, and certainly it is a consideration for something you buy often, like gasoline, but in the range of $100 or less, which is what multitools go for these days, I see no reason to consider price. My first multitool purchase was an on sale Leatherman Super Tool that I carried for many years before getting another (a Swisstool, actually.) The same $40 could have bought a cheap evening out. Why be concerned about that amount of money spent so seldom? Best, of course, is when the thing you want is less expensive than the competition, which is sometimes the case.
you have a right to do with your money whatever you want sir, I understand and believe that, I respect it, but I can't and won't waste mine, not even 1 dollar. If I can save a buck on a tool, be it a multitool or a knife I will, and I will save that if only to buy more!

Leatherman has saturated the world wide market so much and positioned themselves so snuggly they think they can charge whatever for their products and I'm not buying it.
example from amazon;
the charge TTi retails for 160.00 usd but you can get it (new) for 90.
the charge AL or ALX for 130 usd but they have it for 101.01 (also new)

look how much money we can save! what a deal!

now the Swisstool retails for 100. but you can get it for 55.70
and the Spirit is 98 but right now it's 44.99 (I got mine from them for 36).

why is aluminum more expensive then titanium? usually the price is the same for either (Ti TTi AL ALX).

I don't want to waste my money, I don't want to waste anything!

Only the Leatherman Charge is "by far" more expensive than the Spirit.
not in wholesale prices, the Spirit and Swisstool are half the price of many LM tools (or close).

the Charge and Spirit are of two different categories, defined by titanium handles and a premium steel blade in the Charge, both of costly materials that are more difficult to manufacture.

yet they charge the same or more for aluminum handles!? and IMO the steel Victorinox uses is as good or better than Leathermans and Victorinox's finish is far superior, leave your Leatherman (any) and a Swisstool in the ocean a few days and see what happens!

Titanium handles are an upgrade, small but quite noticeable, in handling comfort, and the 154 cm blade provides clearly superior performance. Some users find those things important and are willing to pay the extra
what is purpose of titanium handles but not the rest of the tool(s)? when the tools rust up and seize what will they have? pretty titanium handles?!

I'm an older guy, pretty sure that for me, 25 year and lifetime warranties are about the same. However, I would be willing to bet that Leatherman will continue to honor their warranty even beyond the stated limit.
I would like to pass my tools down to my family and friends and I won't take Leathermans nice gestures now because their tools have recently passed 25 years of existence, I want it in writing, I want it real.

I do appreciate and respect your discussion znapschatz but one seems to be way to expensive and adding plastic and is cutting corners (the company name is Leatherman and have you seen their sheaths lately?) and it doesn't stand behind their product in time.
 
Last edited:
TFin the Charge is a great MT, you've picked a good one, it should serve you well for a long time, please give us pictures and reviews when you get it, that would be great.

Just got it in the mail today (and think, it had been sitting out there since 10am and I JUST walked out there!! :)) and it looks like it will do exactly what I want from it.

Even my mom was super impressed but she's a very practical lady. She is currently making a list of the tools she would use most and we're going to find a tool for her.
 
Dantor, your post is illogical, full of incorrect information and reaching assumptions that just don't make sense.


Comparing the Charge series to the SwissTools doesn't make sense. They're completely different chassis and don't have comparative materials. Essentially when you buy any OH Leatherman Tool you're paying a premium for the One-handed opening, which is worth it to a lot of people. The industry has yet to create a full-feature tool that comes close to the effectiveness of the Wave design.

A better comparison would be the Blast/Core to the SwissTool/Spirit.

Amazon Blast: $40.90 (MSRP $64.50) (I got my Blast for 30$ from Wal-Mart. It was a closeout sale, is this relevant? No.)
Amazon Core: $51.40 (MSRP $76.00)

now the Swisstool retails for 100. but you can get it for 55.70
and the Spirit is 98 but right now it's 44.99 (I got mine from them for 36).

Those prices are more in line with the ones you posted because the Blast/Core are comparative to the SwissTools in size, implement selection and operating systems.

adding plastic and is cutting corners

How? The plastic inserts solve a major user issue, do not affect the overall strength and are in no way a load bearing part.

not in wholesale prices, the Spirit and Swisstool are half the price of many LM tools (or close).
Not applicable, where are you referencing your wholesale prices from? Also, one can only compare the SwissTools to the two Leatherman tools above because they are the only two that are similar. The Charge series just does not compare in any way to the Spirit.

why is aluminum more expensive then titanium? usually the price is the same for either (Ti TTi AL ALX).

Uh. It's not, Amazon just has a weird pricing structure for the two models. Look at the retail prices you posted for the two tools, does the titanium model have a higher MSRP? And your numbers are off anyway. I hit Amazon and got a price of $110.00 for the Charge TTi, and $85.58 for the Charge AL. Did you think no one would check?

yet they charge the same or more for aluminum handles!?

"They" don't, Leatherman has a significantly higher MSPR for the titanium models, as you referenced.

*Sigh, carry on.
 
spoon spoon, of course I thought somebody/you would check! I'll give you plenty of examples/links so you can check them out some more.

chassis? your referring the framework that supports the tool? the body of the multitool? I'm talking about the whole tool, every tool has different designs/materials. Your saying because the Charge has OH operation and titanium it's different, it's not a MT?

I'm talking about plier based devices with tools inside; blade, openers, drivers etc. Not comparable? Yes the Charge and Spirit and Swisstool are different, as are all MTs but were talking basics here, and the things the original poster wanted. If my car has GPS is it not a car anymore? Does OH operation make the Charge something other than a MT? We're talking multitools here, and your saying the Charge is something else?! but I'm the one that's not making any sense :rolleyes:

If you think the Wave and Charge are heaven sent miracles then more power to you, gawd bless. Some of us don't feel that way and won't pay a big chunk of cash for it. Titanium, super steel, or aluminum.

The plastic inserts solve a major user issue, do not affect the overall strength and are in no way a load bearing part.
I'm glad you like plastic tools, I sure don't and no plastic tool I've ever had ever lasted over time.

wholesale, suggested retail pricing, have you ever priced Leatherman tools over others? I just used amazon because it's well known but if you check other sites it's generally the same: first 3 sites I just googled for Charge TTi;
$100.00 - ToolBarn.com
$119.85 - BASEGEAR
$98.75 - Great Escapes
their sale prices, not retail.

Charge AL;
$99.85 - Leatherman store
$81.66 - CheaperThanDirt.com
$99.95 - REI
again sales prices.

Swisstool RS;
$64.99 - Buy.com
$64.99 - Sports Authority
$53.69 - clicktodeal.com

Spirit;
$55.32 - Amazon.com
$65.73 - PROVANTAGE
$46.32 - Ambient Weather

again these are the first 3 I see or linked too.
It's why I stopped looking, Leatherman prices just go up and up, probably because people like you will pay it.

Is that "applicable?" can even you see the difference in the prices of MTs? Not Thors hammer, not Excalibur but a multitool, a plier based "Chassis" with tools inside.

And your numbers are off anyway
those are the numbers I got when I hit amazon at that moment but generally I see either the same price for Charge aluminum or titanium or the AL being 10-20 less, what a deal. your saying OH cost more and they should charge more? Other "Premium" One Hand tools don't gouge us. But you go right ahead and pay more.

Bottom line for me, Leatherman charges too much and as long as people like you pay it, and defend it, nothing will change.
 
Your saying because the Charge has OH operation and titanium it's different, it's not a MT?

You're jumping to conclusions again. The Charge is different because of the different manufacturing steps, finishing steps and materials used. Do you own a Wave or Charge? If so compare it to a SwissTool, the Wave/Charge has significantly more stampings, washers, and overall assembly hardware tied into it's chassis that the SwissTools. This translates into higher production costs and a subsequently higher MSRP.

I'm talking about plier based devices with tools inside; blade, openers, drivers etc. Not comparable?

Oh, they're infinitely comparable from a functional standpoint but once you start to factor in price you have to compare differently. One does not compare the Leatherman Micra to a SOG PowerLock and declare the Micra superior because it is cheaper. To compare tools on the basis of price they must have a comparable tool loadout, operating system and materials usage. Which the Charge/SwissTools do not.

I'm glad you like plastic tools, I sure don't and no plastic tool I've ever had ever lasted over time.

There is no functional item on the models with plastic inserts. It's a non-issue that people like to poke and prod to garner a reaction.

your saying OH cost more and they should charge more?

Of course they cost more. Who did the groundwork to develop the system? OH Wave just didn't fall from the sky, someone at LTG had to design, develop and figure out how to manufacture something no other major multitool company has figured out how to do as effectively.

Other "Premium" One Hand tools don't gouge us

Of course they don't! There are no other OH multitools that use a premium steel and have a simple and effective OH operating system like the Wave series.

Bottom line; we're just going to disagree on this one. I still think the OH Leathermans are priced appropriately.
 
For a while I carried a Leatherman Fuse, which is a good tool, but wanted a little more, so I upgraded to the Wave. No I have talked to alot of people who have the charge, and they say there is really no difference in the charge and wave, except the titanium handles and the steel type on the main blade. I am not gonna pay $30 more for all this. My wave has been there for me for everything I have ever needed. The wave knives and the whole body is made of 420 stainless steel, which i have had alot of knives made of it and it holds an edge better than anything i ever had. I have a buck 110 folder made of 420 stainless and only sharpened in 3 times in 3 years and still has an amazing edge on it. Maybe its just me, but I guess I am more partial to the 420 than titanium because i have never really used them, but if i had and it worked great, rest assured thats where I would go. Price, can be a determinating factor, but I stick with leathermans because of past experiences with them. I had some gerber multi tools for 6 years. got them as a gift, and stuck them in a drawer for 6 years. came across them 3 months ago. carried them and 3 weeks ago the pliers snapped. Bottom line here is this. Its all personal selection. Style, brand name, price, features, quality and warranty should be determining factors too, but like I said, I got the leathermans because I have always had luck with them. Good luck with whatever you get, and hope it will serve you for a lifetime!!!
 
Well guys it looks like a Chevy vs. Ford deal. I have tried a whole lot of multi brands, probably have a dozen laying around I currently don't EDC (including LM). I have always gravitated back to LM products. Why? Because they work the best for me. I am not saying that they are the best, but that they are the best for me. That is all I really care about. I currently EDC a Ti Charge with the S30V main blade. I also EDC a Kershaw multi. They have all the features that I need for my current multi use. As my needs change, as they do every few years, my multi EDC will also. If it fits your needs, go for it and be glad that you got what you need:).
 
Well guys it looks like a Chevy vs. Ford deal. I have tried a whole lot of multi brands, probably have a dozen laying around I currently don't EDC (including LM). I have always gravitated back to LM products. Why? Because they work the best for me. I am not saying that they are the best, but that they are the best for me. That is all I really care about. I currently EDC a Ti Charge with the S30V main blade. I also EDC a Kershaw multi. They have all the features that I need for my current multi use. As my needs change, as they do every few years, my multi EDC will also. If it fits your needs, go for it and be glad that you got what you need:).

Speaking of going back. I used a Leatherman Wave (the old one) for a year and the new Wave for a year. Before that it was a PST or Kick. Used a Blast for a couple weeks, had a few Juice S2s and I still can't find anyhing that tops my Leatherman Supertool. Always go back to that one.

On a side note, spoonrobot is right, the swiss and the charge are two totally different types of multitools. Like he said as an example, you can't compare a full size tool with a compact and declare the compact better because it's cheaper.
 
umm
$100.00 - ToolBarn.com
$119.85 - BASEGEAR
$98.75 - Great Escapes
their sale prices, not retail.

Charge AL;
$99.85 - Leatherman store
$81.66 - CheaperThanDirt.com
$99.95 - REI
again sales prices.

Swisstool RS;
$64.99 - Buy.com
$64.99 - Sports Authority
$53.69 - clicktodeal.com

Spirit;
$55.32 - Amazon.com
$65.73 - PROVANTAGE
$46.32 - Ambient Weather

again these are the first 3 I see or linked too.
It's why I stopped looking, Leatherman prices just go up and up, probably because people like you will pay it.


Shouldn't you compare the all stainless steel model to the stainless steel model? So the price for the Wave is....what?

Wave:
Amazon.com: 56.99,57.99
Amazon.com: 61.99 (Black version!)
Buy.com 57.72

And since you quoted the leatherman's store price...Here is the victorinox store listed price
Victorinox Store: 98.00

So in conclusion... You don't need to compare more premium tools to a non-premium tool and then claim the whole brand is way over priced. The wave is just as cheap as your beloved spirit.

PS: About the rusting... Steel rusts... get over it.
 
For what its worth, I like Swisstool a little better. But for my light/medium daily stuff, neither tool is gonna break, lets be honest...
 
Different strokes for different folks i guess. I love my wave, and will continue to use it for EDC, but as far as rust and all that goes, they are tools, and need maintenance. My grandfather once told me about tools, he said "Tools should be taken care of and treated with respect! They should be considered prized possesions, and if you take care of them, than they will take care of you." He hit the nail on the head, since he was a carpenter for most of his life. So whether you decide to carry a leatherman, gerber, sog, swiss whatever it may be, I am sure if you take care of it, it will give you many years of trouble free service, just like a reliable old pocket knife.
 
umm



Shouldn't you compare the all stainless steel model to the stainless steel model? So the price for the Wave is....what?

Wave:
Amazon.com: 56.99,57.99
Amazon.com: 61.99 (Black version!)
Buy.com 57.72

And since you quoted the leatherman's store price...Here is the victorinox store listed price
Victorinox Store: 98.00

So in conclusion... You don't need to compare more premium tools to a non-premium tool and then claim the whole brand is way over priced. The wave is just as cheap as your beloved spirit.

PS: About the rusting... Steel rusts... get over it.

I just picked the first 3 examples from google (the ones that showed prices), I wasn't searching for the best prices, of course you can find a better deal if you look, I got my Spirit for 36 with shipping. it was just an example of common prices (the top list in google get hit the most).
I didn't see a "Victorinox Store" (their is a Victorinox dot ch official site) but their is a Leatherman Store which isn't the official LM dot com.

I live in a wet area of the country, I want my tools to last as long as possible, I have better things to do than constant maintenance, maybe you don't.
 
FWIW I've had my LM Charge TTi for a few days now and I LOVE it. I love the look, the feel of the thing, the functions and pretty much everything about it.

Can't compare it to anything else since it's my first decent (ok...GOOD) Multi but since the TTi is going to be yours as well I don't think you'll be disapppointed.
 
I think you missed my point completely Dantor. Hopefully others did not... You were comparing apples and oranges. Just forget it.

I live in a wet area of the country, I want my tools to last as long as possible, I have better things to do than constant maintenance, maybe you don't.

How long exactly does it take you to maintenance your tools? How long does it take to put a dab of oil on a knife blade or pivot point? If taking care of your tools is wrong, I don't want to be right.
 
I got the Leatherman Wave and love it! I do know some people who wanna pay the extra money for the charge, which is ok, but I am perfectly happy with my Wave. It has all the tools you have listed above. It has a bit adapter too you can by the tool bit kit, which fits behind the wave in the nylon sheath (if you have it), than you can take on just about any type of screw you come across. I have used mine for pulling and replacing a fan motor on an AC unit, to cutting the neighbors dog out of a briar patch. I have also used it for fishing, and really look forward to using it for the upcoming hunting season. I highly recommend it!
 
I think you missed my point completely Dantor. Hopefully others did not... You were comparing apples and oranges. Just forget it.



How long exactly does it take you to maintenance your tools? How long does it take to put a dab of oil on a knife blade or pivot point? If taking care of your tools is wrong, I don't want to be right.


I have to agree with the man here. Good high quality tools can take a beating, and getting wet, dirty, oily and all that, but if you wanna get them wet and dirty, and not gonna wanna take care of them, than you will be beating facing rust and sticky tools in not time. For instance, I used my Wave the other day in the woods with the saw takin some small branches down around where I wanna put my tree stand, than afterward using the pliers to tighten som nuts on the stand. I had wood shavings build up inside the pivot points of the pliers where I had them oiled, and when I got home I took a nylon bristle brush and some warm soapy water and cleaned them all up good. Afterward, I rinsed them and dried them off, and took some WD-40 to no only lubricate, but prevent rust, and displace water in the pivot points of the tools and the center hub of the pliers. All this was done in less than 5 minutes. Also a good thing to remember is, most new tools have a break in period. My Wave is still new, but it is starting to break in pretty nicely.

Things to remember when it comes to good multi-tools and/or knives, and I preach on it highly

1. A good tool is like a machine, in order to keep it working good, than you have to maintain it every once in a while. Take care of your tools, and they will take care of you.

2. Stainless steel is not "rustproof". All metals will rust if not taken care of. Meaning like you said, if you work in a wet environment, than you will have to maintain them more often. I have an old pocket knife of my grandfathers he bought in the 1950's and carried it into the 90's. The carbon steel blades never had a lick of rust on them, because he took good care of it.


Bottom line, no matter when you buy, don't be fooled into thinkin you aren't ever gonna have to maintain the tools. I hear alot of stories about people who have had to send their leathermans in after 10 years for replacement or warranty work, and I bet most of it is from lack of maintenance.

Like I said though, refer to rule number one! If you do this, there should be no reason your tools won't last you a lifetime.
 
Back
Top