My First Axis Lock v. spend more money (943 vs 710)

Z

Zerileous

Joined
Dec 30, 2004
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Ok, a few days ago i posted asking about a grip and another axis, well, I got more money, and am now looking at a more expensive benchie. Specifically, the 943 or the 710. I have a few questions.
First off, I have heard that the BM factory edge is thick, and I will want to thin it. For most of you, is this the case?

Secondly, what advantages/disadvangates do you see between the two? How do you see either of them complimenting a calypso jr in carry? (i am a lefty with good right handed dexterity, so i can easily cut right handed when needed)

Finally, if i choose the 710, should i go for the M2 or high speed. The price is not really an issue, I am just unsure of the difference it will make. I am also a little afraid of it, I dont have any super systems. I have some medium crock sticks, a diamond grited "honesteel" and access to a sharpmaker (also a smiths system similar to the lansky but its a pain and i have to rig it strangely to get a 30* inclusive edge. Further, it sucks for a blade longer than 3" because the angle changes so much. Lastly, it only has flat stones, thus its not a real option). Will I be able to touch this stuff, I would prefer to sharpen my own knives. Also, what aobut that thick factory edge, will i be able to reprofile it without diamond sharpmaker rods. If not, is the better steel worth the sacrafice in angle thinness.

I really am trying to figure out how tough the M2 really is. So if anyone can give me any testimonials that would be great.

Thanks.
 
The BM710 is a great knife and I would go with the M2 if you don't mind the black coating on the blade. I reprofiled mine to 15 degrees per side, but I have an EdgePro and it made short work of that task. You can do this on a Sharpmaker, it will just take awhile, unless you get ahold of the diamond rods for it.

I'm sure others will gives other options for reprofiling. You can just used sandpaper on a flat surface, like a piece of plate glass.
 
how does the recurve hit a flat surface, i know its not too dramatic, but I would not want to harm it with flat sharpening tools.
 
I actually reprofiled a 710HS (M2 version) with a Sharpmaker. And the way the edge came, it really needed it. Took 4-5 hours. :eek: Taking a page from Wade, I set the edge bevel at 30 degrees inclusive and finished with a few strokes on the fine and then ultra fine stones set at 40 degrees. Very easy to touch up and maintain.

I imagine it might have taken 20-30 minutes with an Edge Pro, but then again I'd probably would still have used the Sharpmaker for the recurve portion.

I've had an Edge Pro on order at the local knife store since about February I think. I'm sticking with the store because they've treated me so well but :( .

You won't regret getting the M2.
 
For edge retention, M2 is one of the best. Like KeithAM stated, the 710HS can be reprofiled using a sharpmaker but it will take a lot of elbow grease and patience - the finnished result is a vastly improved cutting tool. The diamond sleaves for the sharpmaker ( in theory ) should cut down the time a fair bit.
My 710HS is one of my sharpest knives now that the edge has been thinned down and holds this edge longer than any other knife that I own. For a little over $100.00, you are getting a whole lot of knife.
 
I got a 710HS just a week ago. The factory edge was HORRIBLE, seemed like it was straight off a belt sander. As for sharpening, it took me about two hours (I was being careful) with 240 grit sandpaper wrapped around a steel to get a nice profile. If I had to do it again, I'd start with 150 grit. If you use sandpaper, sharpen with the edge trailing. Edge first you just scrape the grit off.
With some nice low grit stones or sandpaper, M2 shouldn't be a problem.
 
710HS all the way. Mine hasn't left my pocket since I got it over a year ago. The edge was definately too thick for my tastes when I got it, I eventually convexed the edge so it blends really smoothly into the primary grind. The M2 steel works really well with a thin edge and holds it for a very long time. Some people say rust is a concern with M2, it hasn't even been an issue for me in over a year of carrying it in close proximity to salt water and using it every day. I can't speak highly enough of this knife, I'm sure if it's your choice you won't be disapointed.
 
wow, really satisfied replies. Now i am wondering, how much will M2 take, it is not brittle is it? I really think that i may just end up getting a sharpmaker of my own when i get the knife, and that in the long run, 2-4 hrs is not that big of a deal, just as long as it is not a suprise.
 
Though, I really wish they'd up it to 64. (Same with Spyderco upping their S30V to 61) 710HS will be a great knife. I love the handle. Flat stones will flatten out the recurve a bit, but use the corners and it'll be fine
 
Don´t know what you mean with thick edge. If it is a large edge angle, most Bms offer a good sharp one, i say it is 30° exept the 806 which is 40° in my eyes.

If it is the geometry. The 806 has a thick edge (.7mm) but any other i saw (550, 520, 140HS) has had a thickness over the edge about .5mm which is right for hard cutting tasks.

I just saw one 710HS and this one wasn´t the king. Maybe others are finer or better ground. Mabe you have to ask for replacement till you get a right one, but i guess you will be satisfied.

If you like the style of the 710 go for M2 and nothing else. Only risk: You wont buy more folders. :D
 
Zerileous said:
First off, I have heard that the BM factory edge is thick, and I will want to thin it. For most of you, is this the case?
Click to expand...

I've never bought one that didn't need work. They come with a usable edge, that's it.
 
Zerileous said:
I am also a little afraid of it, I dont have any super systems. I have some medium crock sticks, a diamond grited "honesteel" and access to a sharpmaker (also a smiths system similar to the lansky but its a pain and i have to rig it strangely to get a 30* inclusive edge.
Click to expand...
You only need the sharpmaker and a $5 stone you can get at any hardware store. Use the very coarse hardware store to lower the bevel by hand, you don't need to be accurate, just hog the metal off. You should be able to trim the bevel down in 10-15 minutes if you lean into the stone.

If not, is the better steel worth the sacrafice in angle thinness.
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The steel doesn't give you any advantage in cutting ability, a worse steel with a more optimal cutting profile will still cut better.

I really am trying to figure out how tough the M2 really is.
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It is one of the more brittle tool steels, slightly tougher than D2, tough in comparison to the high carbon stainless steel that Benchmades uses of course.

Blop said:
Don´t know what you mean with thick edge.
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It usually refers to the thickness of the blade just behind the edge bevel.

The 806 has a thick edge (.7mm) but any other i saw (550, 520, 140HS) has had a thickness over the edge about .5mm which is right for hard cutting tasks.
Click to expand...
0.5 mm is 0.020", decent indeed, however unless you are pounding the knife through metals or bone you can go a lot thinner. When you dip under 0.010" you can have problems with hard cutting, such as twisting the knife around in plastics.

The primary grind is also a factor as well, a deep hollow grind which leaves the edge unsupported is a lot more fragile on a 0.010" edge than the same edge profile on a short sabre grind where the edge is heavily supported.

-Cliff
 
The 710 is one of my favorite production knives. I have the 154CM model, because I hate black blades, and have no complaints with its performance.
 
it seems the overwheliming conclusion is the 710HS. Is this correct, or are all of you responding to my M2 inquiries without responding to the 943 v 710? I would also go for the "reverse tanto" blade for the 94x.
 
Dont sell the 154CM version short ! At the risk of getting flamed , stainless steels are great in EDC folders . During the summer months , oxidation is worse than abasion . I own both and will happily carry either one .
 
well, to what extent will rust occur. I have not noticed any corrosion in my Kabar, and it has very scratched coating. It also has been kept in its sheeth for months, and is not oiled. Thus, I do not see corosion as an issue. Though some tips on protecting the blade would be nice.

Now, i am still trying to figure out what the quantifiable difference is. How noticable will the edge durability be?
 
Being harder, it'll be more wear resistant than 154CM. I also think that M2 is more tough, allowing you to go thinner
 
I have an Ares 732(red and black handles) and a 805. Both are quite thin at the edge, comparable to the others mentioned at around .5 mm. I had a 710, and it had quite a thick edge, but that was years ago and BM may have made an effort to thin them since.
 
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