My first REVIEW: The Axis lock Vs. the Compression Lock

Joined
Jul 7, 2000
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Let me just say that this is my first review posted here at Bladeforums. I hope you find it informative. Please post any feedback, whether positive or negative. Thanks

In recent years, major cutlery companies have been striving to create the strongest, best lock for a folding knife. With recent advances from Spyderco, Benchmade, and REKAT, people want to know who's offering them the best product. Is it the COMPRESSION lock from Spyderco, the AXIS from Benchmade, or the Rolling lock from REKAT?

I do not currently own any rolling lock knives so I can only offer you a 1 on 1 comparison between the AXIS and the COMPRESSION lock.

Here's a pic of the AXIS courtesy of Benchmade.com:
AXIS_lock_combo.gif


And here's a pic of the COMPRESSION lock courtesy of the late James Mattis:
compression.jpg


The knives I have to compare are the Spyderco Gunting and the Benchmade 940. I have owned the 940 since it first hit the shelves and have owned the Gunting since December. This has given me months with which to compare these two locks.

It should be noted that the 940 and the Gunting are two very different knives built for very different purposes. Unfortunately, the Gunting is the only COMPRESSION lock model currently being sold so I have nothing else to compare with the AXIS. Anyway, you should remember that this is a comparison of the <u>locks</u>, not the knives themselves.

Lockup:
The pivots on both my 940 and Gunting like to loosen by themselves. With a little loc-tite and the proper adjustment, both knives lock up solid and neither allows blade-play. I would expect nothing less from third-generation locks.

Smoothness of opening:
Neither lock inhibits the blade from opening smoothly and quickly. I am impressed by both of these locks in this regard. If I had to choose a victor it would be the COMPRESSION lock since in applies less pressure to the blade while in motion.

One handed operation:
The AXIS lock is the clear winner in this arena. It requires little to no grip change and I can close my 940 almost as fast as I can open it. The Gunting requires an awkward grip change to disengage the COMPRESSION lock. It is also a motion which takes practice to enter your muscle memory. This is not really a problem for the Gunting since it is a defense oriented knife but for an every day task knife I would choose the AXIS. It should also be noted that unlike the COMPRESSION lock, the AXIS is fully ambidextrous.

Accidental disengagement:
In the months of carrying both of these knives I have not had either one close when I didn't want them to. With that being said, the COMPRESSION lock is better at preventing accidental disengagement.
Neither lock is vulnerable to spine-whacks, torque, pressure, or awkward cutting angles. The COMPRESSION lock, however, is streamlined with the knife, lowering the probability of snagging it with your hand. The AXIS, on the other hand, protrudes from both scales and is therefore subject to external pressures.

Ability to hold the blade closed:
Here's an area in which I am very disappointed with the COMPRESSION lock. Only a couple degrees of opening will free the blade to swing open with the COMPRESSION lock. The AXIS, however, will hold the blade closed even if I open it over 20 degrees. I hope this is something they improve on the COMPRESSION lock in the future.

Reliability:
From my experience, both locks are extremely reliable. They are both rated to take hundreds of pounds of torque so I seriously doubt that I will ever take either of these knives near their limits.
I would still say that the COMPRESSION lock is more reliable: it has far less parts than the AXIS. As people like Gaston Glock have shown us, less moving parts means less of a chance of a problem.
The thing that scares some about the AXIS is that it is suspended by two omega springs. Keep in mind that it only needs one of these springs to function and that neither of them are ever flexed more than 50%. Still, these are small moving parts that are more susceptible to dirt, grime, or even breakage.

Lock wear:
In the months of carrying these knives every day, neither has exhibited noticeable lock wear. The COMPRESSION lock seems to be better suited for wear since the lock can just move farther along the blade tang (like a liner lock). I do not see any way that the AXIS can self-adjust for wear but I could be wrong. Unless I am missing something about the AXIS, I would say that the COMPRESSION wears better.

NOTE: I HAVE BEEN CORRECTED. SEE POSTS BELOW ON THE AXIS LOCK'S ABILITY TO SELF-ADJUST

Conclusions:
I am greatly pleased with both of these locks (except for the COMPRESSION lock's inability to secure the blade closed as well as I desired). When a daily task comes up, I find myself reaching for my 940 more often than my Gunting. This is primarily because of its greater ease of one-handed operation and its quick ability to close. For this reason, I think that the AXIS is a better suited general utility lock. I see the COMPRESSION as more of a heavy-duty or defense oriented lock since it is slower yet more reliable.
Which is more important to you: ease of use or reliability?
These are both valid qualities and should help you decide between the AXIS and the COMPRESSION. You decision on these locks should be based on what you plan to do with your knife.
Personally, I like the AXIS more, but I trust the COMPRESSION more. You decide.


[This message has been edited by ThinkOfTheChildren (edited 03-22-2001).]
 
An excellent review. Only brought out the English major/editor in me once.

I do have difficulty understanding the part about keeping the blade closed. Specifically, do you mean that beginning to open the compression lock as little as 2 degrees, makes the blade swing free? That if you open the axis lock as much as 20 degrees, it will spring back closed? I would tend to see the latter as a real safety problem. Not owning a knife with either lock certainly doesn't help me later. (I do have a rolling lock on the way tho
biggrin.gif
)

Again, excellent job, with the exception of the needed clarity I mentioned!

Thank you.


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Asi es la vida

Bugs
 
The axis lock actually self adjusts for wear quite nicely. The tang of the blade is angled slightly, so the axis bar can move up the "ramp" of the tang as necessary to counter any wear that were to happen.
 
Nice review; I just had a few comments to make.

Lockup:
I have had no trouble with my Gunting loosening; I have owned both a Sifu and a Pioneer II with the Rolling Lock, and both tended to loosen slightly. No experience with an Axis lock.

One-handed operation:
I had trouble with the Gunting's compression lock one-handed too. There's a certain knack you develop, and while it isn't as easy for me as a liner lock or a Rolling Lock, I don't have trouble with it now. I use my thumb to disengage the lock, and my forefinger to push the hump down, from there you can either use the rest of your fingers to close it, shake it back into the handle, or close it against the back of your leg.

[/b]Ability to hold the blade closed:[/b]
I agree with you on this one; part of the problem might be that the Gunting has a relatively heavy blade, with that large full-thickness hump. The solution is to keep the pivot screw fairly tight.

Thanks for an interesting and insightful review!
 
That's really a great review. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

Just a "BTW": the compression locks on new models are supposed to open in the opposite direction of the Gunting's (the other liner locks and you press it towards the stamp side to unlock). Whether or not that makes one-hand closing easier, I wouldn't know or even try to speculate on it.

I think that Bram insisted on the Gunting's method of opening the lock, believing it would be more likely to prevent accidental disengagements.

Anyways, thanks for the review. Good stuff.

------------------
Cerulean

"My good reason to carry a knife is that God gave me rather weak teeth and rudimentary claws in an evolutionary trade-off." - J.K.M.
 
Thanks for your review, TOTC


<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by ThinkOfTheChildren:

Lock wear:
In the months of carrying these knives every day, neither has exhibited noticeable lock wear. The COMPRESSION lock seems to be better suited for wear since the lock can just move farther along the blade tang (like a liner lock). I do not see any way that the AXIS can self-adjust for wear but I could be wrong. Unless I am missing something about the AXIS, I would say that the COMPRESSION wears better.</font>

As pointed out, the Axis lock has a very nice wear solution. It wears forward along the slots, farther onto the tang. In fact, speaking strictly theoretically, I expect the compression lock to wear pretty similarly to a liner lock, maybe a little faster because the contact point is smaller. However, I have no real data, and wouldn't be surprised at all if the compression lock wears just as slowly as the Axis.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Conclusions:
For this reason, I think that the AXIS is a better suited general utility lock. I see the COMPRESSION as more of a heavy-duty or defense oriented lock since it is slower yet more reliable.
Which is more important to you: ease of use or reliability?</font>

Note, however, that your reliability point about the axis is strictly theoretical, and something like 2+ years of experience with the axis shows that reliability isn't a problem. I do buy into the fact that the compression lock's simpler design and harder-to-reach disengagement point do provide a theoretical reliability advantage, which is the reason I admire it so much. But given the axis lock's proven real-world reliability, I'm not sure if the theoretical advantage translates into much of a real-world advantage. My opinion only, of course! I'm looking forward to the release of either the Vesuvius or the Temperence Jr. to check out the compression lock further.

Joe

 
Thanks for the replies and the clarification on the Axis lock's ability to self-adjust. I put a note in the review about this.

Bugs3x,
You have it right, opening the gunting only a couple degrees (not literally 2) will allow the blade to swing free. I am dissapointed in this because if it is slightly jarred while in the pocket, it will be free to open further. The axis on the other hand will stay closed in your pocket very well.

Joe,
Yes, what I wrote about reliability is largely theoretical since I don't have more data to back up these theories. I have read the stories of other forumites, however, who have had their axis lock stick on them or have other problems. These stories are not mine, however, so I don't have any complaints.
 
Thanks for the effort sharing your impressions
smile.gif


However I would discuss the statement about lock reliability. In my opinion in real life use obstruction resistance is very important part of lock reliability as well as breakage resistance. The Axis Lock is extremely obstruction resistant, it continues to work properly even being heavily clogged with dirt and debris.
Compression Lock is less resistant to obstructions, 3 layers of normal writing paper between blade tang and stop pin was enough to prevent locking.

I also can hardly imagine how lock design can influence knife's orientating (defense or utility). Sure, Gunting is far more defensive oriented knife than BM 940 Osborne. But I would be quite surprised if coming SPYDERCO Vesuvius could be considered as better defensive tool than BM 710 or 730 Ares due to lock design only...

Completely agree as to closed position retention. Tell me please didn't you notice Gunting partial opening in the pocket when you unintentionally catch the horn with your hand or clothing?
 
In addition to wearing up along the tang, the Axis bar itself rotates very slightly every time it is cycled. I think the wear resistance prize goes to the Axis.

I'll be interested to see the compression lock, if I ever notice one at a show or something, and can take a look at it, although for me, personally, I think the ambidextrous nature of the Axis will put it higher on my list.

--JB

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e_utopia@hotmail.com
 
Yep, the Axis rocks in the long-term wear department. May '01 marks the 2-year anniversary of when I first met the BM705 Axis (tearing up a little), and since then, with daily carry and use, I have noticed no significant advancement of the Axis bar along the blade tang when opened. So I can attest to Joe T.'s testament.

Professor.
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Sergiusz Mitin:
Compression Lock is less resistant to obstructions, 3 layers of normal writing paper between blade tang and stop pin was enough to prevent locking.</font>

I was not aware of this problem. Thanks for the heads up.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
I also can hardly imagine how lock design can influence knife's orientating (defense or utility). Sure, Gunting is far more defensive oriented knife than BM 940 Osborne. But I would be quite surprised if coming SPYDERCO Vesuvius could be considered as better defensive tool than BM 710 or 730 Ares due to lock design only...
</font>

Sorry if I communicated this poorly. I wasn't saying that the lock should decide the knife use, I mean that the knife use should dictate the lock type. This means that if I were in the market for a daily task knife I would want the axis due to its quickness and ease of use. I think that this makes it hard for the compression lock to compete for this type of a knife.
 
As far as I understand the Gunting was designed to be used with a tighter than normal pivot tension. I f the G is setup right it will not open easily. I have been carrying the Gunting in several different ways every day for the last 4 months and had no accidental opening. I even carried the knife tip up loose in pocket - this way and with most pockets the "ramp" keeps the knife upright (butt end up) in the pocket.

Regarding the Axis lock (on the Ares) I have one big problem and that is that accidental disengagement is very possible and even very likely when one uses a a hammer grip with the thumb on the side of the knife next to the index finger - not when care is taken but when the knife is gripped quickly in that grip.

Accidental disengagement with the Compression Lock on the Gunting is in my opinion very unlikely/not likely at all.
 
I think Deon's point is well taken.

I've been very impressed by Bob Kasper's recent 2-stage column where he acknowledges that he has completely abandoned use of the saber grip in his training curriculum. He strongly advocates the "natural" or hammer/hatchet grip, which puts the thumb down along the side of the scale, in front of the index finger.

I don't know exactly where the Axis button lies, in relationship to a natural grip. Obviously, if it is forward of the thumb in the natural grip, but relatively close, it has a great potential to be accidently released. Pretty hard on the finners, if you ask me.

I still wonder why nobody is designing knives/locks to reflect the "upside down" grip recommended by De Betencourt, the knife instructor at Sig Sauer. While I recognize that knives with a deep finger choil don't work well in that grip, the fact that contact with teh blade is going to exert pressure to hold the blade open makes so much sense to me. Has made me think seriously about some muskrat patterns. Most are too small though.

I think -- and really hope -- that I got a large Dyad tonite. Too bad one blade is a sheepsfoot. A double-ended 2-blade knife seems to hold so much promise.

Well, I'm done now,


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Asi es la vida

Bugs
 
Personally, I don't find hammer grip anywhere near as natural as saber, but maybe that's just me.

On my 705 and 730, hammer grip pushes forward on the Axis bar, reinforcing the lock, instead of releasing it.

--JB

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e_utopia@hotmail.com
 
Michael DeBethencourt has enthusiastically endorsed and now carries a GUNTING.
Its about to become according to Mike the official knife of his SIG classes...
because you can use it reverse to do "officer survival" as he teaches..cutting edge up pulling back towards one's self.

Thanks Deon..I don't have to repeat the make it tighter statement here..you did..

Yes..the lock is the blade detent..we can work on getting it a touch tighter...but I personally in several years of carry have never opened it in my pocket..BUT I carry it so much and play with it I am not a good example...( I am very aware of the knife and its edge..)

Try a holster..ROFL..

Serguisz: gee I better watch out for paper and the like somehow finding its way into the extremely tight soace in the anvil pin contact position and stopping my blade from locking..
yup..thats gonna happen a lot in reall time usage..
I've tried dirt, sand, mud..outside crap in general BUT I gotta hand it to you Serg..NEVER did it occur to me to wedge paper into the anvil contact point to see if I could stop the lock from engaging.

Wait till we meet again...
Gee Serg you are correct..it is not more defense oriented except in my usage of kinetic opening..its about the only lock that says "BAM" abuse me..other locks tell you NOT to slam them open..
soooo In that case it does work better and is defensively designed.

Again.. I can't wait to see you again to go over these salient points in person..
JUST JOKING!!!!!! Serg and I actually met in germany @ IAW..
Thanks Serg for checking it out!!!

thanks to all of you for taking the compression lock so seriously..that includes you too Serg.. really..without input like this the lock and knife cannot continue to evolve and get better...
so please keep using it and sending in those comments..

Maybe you should copy this whole thing over to SPYDERCO's web...
 
Anyone have experience with the gunting in terms of left handed unlocking? If so, do you think the way the compression lock is put together on the gunting will be better or worse for lefties than the newer spyderco compression locks?
Thanks


------------------
------------------------
Pete Jenkins
Lefties unite!
 
Pete: theres actually a left hand model..
WHY? cause I have a stubborn streak in me that says one closes a knife a certain way..
this didn't agree with Poppa Spyder's vision of how to close a compression lock and it came out there are two mirror image compression locks..good for all of us because in a liner or cross motion lock release like the Compression lock..there must be a seperate left handed version..
and USUALLY a company says "well the R&D and egineering is too much"..well in SPYDERCO's case the work is all done..
The Vesuvius works like my left handed version..OR my GUNTING works like Poppa Spyders left handed version..
Lock is identical BUT mirror image..
I don't like rolling a blade AWAY from my line of vision and I never move or take my hand off the knife to start to close it..I can abandon the idea @ anytime with the Compression lock set up as it is in the GUNTING,...for me if I use the Vesuvius I have to move a finger and roll the knife outwards to get to the locl release...so for me a Vesuvious IS my left handed lock...

Left handed GUNTINGS coming soon..
REALLY..

 
Bram,
It was nice to meet you at IWA and to discuss some GUNTING matters. You are right, it opens like each Spyde, cuts like each Spyde (mmmm, Spyde-sharp!) and it is one very thorough knife. And like each knife is not free from some drawbacks and controversies. For techniques you have demonstrated at IWA it works perfectly, I have played somewhat at home also. For me the techniques and entire defensive philosophy they are based on remain pretty controversial but this is the topic for quite another discussion
smile.gif


So far just first-look advice: Friends, don't train kinetic opening with live knife! It cuts like crazy. Obligatorily get the trainer for first familiarization!

Here we are talking about locks. Well, playing with the first Compression Lock equipped knife I have found the lock far more stable than Liner Lock. From engineering standpoint this could be expected but it was pleasant to get a live confirmation in practice. It is free of Liner Lock main disadvantage when thin and relatively long liner's flexing in its plane under negative load can cause lock unexpected behavior. In Compression Lock case we have nothing to flex, there is only some millimeters of steel plate between blade tang and stop pin loaded in plane direction. I really can't imagine under how high load it could lose stability...

On the other hand Compression Lock kept some Liner Lock weaker points like pretty unreliable closed position retention (especially with heavy blades) and low resistance against obstruction between blade tang and stop pin. Please don't get me wrong, I have never had any real liner lock failure due to something like paper stuck there. I have used this example simply to show some comparison: thicker wedge is required to let fail Axis Lock, somewhat thinner - in case of Arc Lock, even thinner in case of Liner Lock or Compression Lock.

Each mechanical device has its limitations
frown.gif


Pete, welcome to the Forums
smile.gif

I have tried some left-hand playing with GUNTING and have not too many complaints as to action operation. I may be wrong because I'm not true lefty or amby, rather "forced amby". My main complaint is why the clip can't be moved onto opposite side? Sheath carry could be solution...

 
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