My foil stuck to the blade after the quench!

G

gixxer

Joined
Sep 21, 2006
Messages
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I had mentioned this in the other thread but I thought I would just start another thread. I took my CPM154 blade, wiped it with MEK to get it clean, went right from there to the foil, wrapped it up with no paper inside. I do have high temp foil, 2300deg I believe. Cooked the blade, to the plates, and then tried to get it out of the foil before cryo. Ended up grinding the foil off.

How do I stop this? I did not look to see if there was a shiny or satin side to the foil, what am I missing?


On the lighter side of things I realized I do not need 15lb of dry ice. I have it in a small lunch type cooler inside of a bigger chest freezer. I opened the cooler to check on how fast my dry ice was dissipating after 8 hrs and there is still A LOT left...
 
i have only fused foil to bladesa a few time s and mostly when pushing higher temps but liek you said you keep things clean and kept most of the air out of the pack (can you see how that sets up a forge weld )

you can weld at lower temps when things are clean and there is no oxides in the way
i dont wipe down my blades any more but in truth jsut grind the foil off less its messign up the spec you have for thickness
 
I just read that another guy uses razor blades to peel the foil off. I will give that a try and see how tedious that is. I would rather spend 10min with a razor blade than try to clean up 60 grit scratches in a hard blade.
 
butcher_block said:
(can you see how that sets up a forge weld )

you can weld at lower temps when things are clean and there is no oxides in the way
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So then what could you put on the blade to not make a mess yet make an impurity so the foil does not stick?
 
spray a very small amount of wd-40 on the blade before you put it in, burns up all the oxygen when it gets to temp and doesn't leave any trace that it was there.
 
Rusty McDonald said:
spray a very small amount of wd-40 on the blade before you put it in, burns up all the oxygen when it gets to temp and doesn't leave any trace that it was there.
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Really ?? That wd-40 is miracle stuff , its use never seems to end . :D
 
Rusty McDonald said:
spray a very small amount of wd-40 on the blade before you put it in, burns up all the oxygen when it gets to temp and doesn't leave any trace that it was there.
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I couldn't put my finger on it but I knew I heard somebody mention using WD40.
 
One trick we used a lot, was to sprinkly the blade with talcum powder before wrapping it in foil. It would prevent the foil from adhering to the blade.

Jamie
 
Just a thought but years ago I worked on Turbo shaft jet engines we used (of all things) Milk of Magnesia as an anti sieze compound for high temp connections, thermocouples and such
 
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I spray mine with blue layout fluid before wrapping them. It burns off trapped air and prevents sticking too.
 
You can cook the foil envelope first to oxidize the inside, then it shouldn't stick.
 
Those are a couple of interesting ideas. And to think I soaked the blade in MEK to get rid of the layout fluid. hmmm...

thanks for all the interesting suggestions guys. I still have a bunch of dry ice left, somehow my blade warped cause I left it on one piece of the ice fro too long before I could get the second piece on top. or the pressure from the top piece warped it as the blocks dissipated. Anyhow, that is another thread. I am gonna cut up the blocks into chunks and buy a couple bottles of rubbing alcohol and see if that is the ticket. The blade was flat out of the plates, so it happened somewhere between the cryo and the temper cycles cause it was not till after the blade was completely done did I notice. I set it on my granite plate to grab a file and I noticed it roll when I set it down! Oh well, what is another 7 bucks on the electric bill to fire the oven again.
 
I read the wd-40 this morning and just tried it. worked like a charm. i always get foil weld, so i wiped blades with paper towel sprayed in wd-40 and got zero weld. foil stuck slightly but pulled right off. thanks for the tip!
 
balibalistic said:
I read the wd-40 this morning and just tried it. worked like a charm. i always get foil weld, so i wiped blades with paper towel sprayed in wd-40 and got zero weld. foil stuck slightly but pulled right off. thanks for the tip!
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No problem any time
 
You know as much as this has happened to you guys I am not surprised this has not come up in conversation before. I do not recall seeing a thread about this since I joined a couple years back.


HEY BRUCE!!! That winding feather pattern blade yer working on is THE POOP!!!
 
gixxer said:
You know as much as this has happened to you guys I am not surprised this has not come up in conversation before. I do not recall seeing a thread about this since I joined a couple years back.



Thanks gixxer,

I had another thought, you know all that oxydized used foil? Just put a single sheet between the blade and the new foil. Oxydized foil cant weld.
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Bruce Bump said:
gixxer said:
You know as much as this has happened to you guys I am not surprised this has not come up in conversation before. I do not recall seeing a thread about this since I joined a couple years back.



Thanks gixxer,

I had another thought, you know all that oxydized used foil? Just put a single sheet between the blade and the new foil. Oxydized foil cant weld.
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false bruce :) deker J and i linned a can in used foil to make it easer to take apart (no we somehow ended up having it weld to the mils steel can) then again our goal was to get a weld on all but the can not jsut HT
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butcher_block said:
Bruce Bump said:
false bruce :) deker J and i linned a can in used foil to make it easer to take apart (no we somehow ended up having it weld to the mils steel can) then again our goal was to get a weld on all but the can not jsut HT
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Yup, it's true. We took used, oxidized foil and lined a can with it. It welded right in between the high carbon steel and the mild can. THAT was a pain to grind apart. If you want a sure fire, nothing-will-ever-weld-to-it surface, use Wite Out. I use it in can welds and I'm able to peel the cans right off with a chisel. The white pigment is titanium dioxide and won't weld to anything...

-d
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butcher_block said:
Bruce Bump said:
false bruce :) deker J and i linned a can in used foil to make it easer to take apart (no we somehow ended up having it weld to the mils steel can) then again our goal was to get a weld on all but the can not jsut HT
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Hmmm, Ive welded up powder metal and Idian motorcycle chain in a can lined with used ss foil and it popped right out, well not just popped out but came it didnt weld. At welding heat some of it did descenigrate though.
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Bruce Bump said:
butcher_block said:
Hmmm, Ive welded up powder metal and Idian motorcycle chain in a can lined with used ss foil and it popped right out, well not just popped out but came it didnt weld. At welding heat some of it did descenigrate though.
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Part of our problem was that fact that Neilson leases a small piece of the sun to heat his forge...with enough heat anything is possible! :)

-d
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