My trip to the "Gun Shop" with a Busse! - help with question -

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shanewomer

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I went to the Gun Shop near my house today, to look at some revolvers, and I happened to have a 1/4" LE Satin Jack on my side. It was quickly noticed, and admired by a couple of the guys working behind the counter. One of them even wanted to hold it. I told him it was the toughest knife in the world. They had never heard of Busse before, but he said he likes knives. And then one of the other guys started telling me about his CS Trailmaster. I ended up starting a little knife discussion there, because I had a Busse on.

Then... another guy behind the counter started telling me the blade was too long to be legally carried, and that it might get taken from me if a police officer saw me wearing it. They were acting like I was wearing some kind of Rambo knife. The Satin Jack is impressive, but it's not really all that huge of a knife. (It is impressive though.) But it doesn't have some big bowie type of clip point, or mean looking serrations, or anything like that. I even had it in the simple nylon sheath. Nothing crazy looking. But it sure drew some attention. Especially for being only a 6" blade.

My Satin Jack is one of my favorite knives. It's such a handy size. It makes a really great tool. I'm serious. I never knew how nice they were, till I had one in my hand. The pictures do NOT do them justice. Believe me.

I thought that I was allowed to carry any knife I wanted, as long as it was in the open. And I thought the blade had to be 4" or shorter, if I wanted to conceal it. Is that not right?

I'm not talking about automatics, or butterfly knives, or double edged knives. Just large, fixed bladed Busse knives. I have a couple of Battle Mistresses, and a Steel Heart, etc... Can I not carry those?

I don't think the guy behind the counter knew what he was talking about.

Does anyone know the knife laws for the state of TN?

I'd like to know the law for myself the next time someone questions my carrying a knife.

Thanks, Shane
 
Links for state by state knife laws can be found by searching on bladeforums in the general knife disscussion under knife laws. For instance i found this.

Tennessee - 39-17-1397. Unlawful carrying or possession of a
weapon. (a)(1) A person commits an offense who carries
with intent to go armed a firearm, knife with a blade
length exceeding four inches, or a club....
- 39-17-1301. Definitions... (5) "Knife" means any bladed
hand instrument that is capable of inflicting serious
bodily injury or death by cutting or stabbing a person
with the instrument.
- 39-17-1302. Prohibited weapons. (a) A person commits an
offense who intentionally or knowingly possess,
manufactures, transports, repairs, or sells... (6) A
switchblade knife or knuckles... (b) It is a defense to
prosecution... that the person's conduct... (4) Was
incident to... a lawful dramatic performance... (5) Was
incident to displaying the weapon in a public museum or
exhibition...
- 39-17-1309. Carrying weapons on school property. (a) As
used in this section, "weapon of like kind" includes
razors and razor blades except those used solely for
personal shaving, and any sharp pointed or edged
instrument, except unaltered nail files and clips and
tools used solely for preparation of food...
(b)(1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry ,
whether openly or concealed, with the intent to go armed,
any... bowie knife, hawk bill knife, ice pick, dagger...
switchblade knife... or any other weapon of like kind [on
any school bus or property]... a Class E felony.
- 39-17-1310. [Exceptions to above include hunting; knife or
gun show on school property; passenger pick-up or drop-
off]

Tennessee Case Law:
- "The general assembly has the power to prohibit the keeping
or bearing of weapons dangerous to the peace and safety of
the citizenry." (1840; 1878)
- "The constitutional right to bear arms refers only to
military arms or arms useful in the common defense."
(1840; 1872)
- "The purpose of the former provisions was to discourage the
using of certain weapons which tend to lead to crime."
(1957)
- "The terms 'other knife or weapon of like form, shape, or
size of a bowie knife or Arkansas toothpick,' used in the
former provisions were not too indefinite to be
enforced..." (1844; 1928)
- "It was not necessary to a conviction under the former
provisions that the weapon carried be concealed about the
person, except if it was a razor..." (1914)
- "Butterfly or Balisong knives are not switchblades..."
(1986)

I'm sure there is more, it's not too hard to find if you really want to know, happy hunting. ;)
 
shanewomer said:
Does anyone know the knife laws for the state of TN?

I'd like to know the law for myself the next time someone questions my carrying a knife.

Thanks, Shane
Click to expand...

i think bernard levine has a site that tells you each states laws... a search may yield something

Ty... Dang boy, you be fast ;)
 
I think for the best responses on Blade Forums, I'm going to move this over to the Knife Laws forums with a re-direct left here.

Actually, you would be best served calling your local sheriffs office and asking them about state laws.

If you live in a municipality, you should call them. Their laws may be stricter than your state laws.

Each of these suggestions will allow you to procure correct/factual information, and lessen the likelyhood of well intended but erroneous "opinions".

Hope this helps.

Mike
 
thatmguy said:
I think for the best responses on Blade Forums, I'm going to move this over to the Knife Laws forums with a re-direct left here.

Actually, you would be best served calling your local sheriffs office and asking them about state laws.

If you live in a municipality, you should call them. Their laws may be stricter than your state laws.

Each of these suggestions will allow you to procure correct/factual information, and lessen the likelyhood of well intended but erroneous "opinions".

Hope this helps.

Mike
Click to expand...

And what is THAT supposed to mean, Hammy??? HUH?? ;) :p
 
This is very dissapointing.

Am I reading this right? Does this following sentence mean that I can't carry my Busse Satin Jack around?

A person commits an offense who carries
with intent to go armed a firearm, knife with a blade
length exceeding four inches, or a club....


Thanks, Shane
 
I really don't understand. People get "Concealed Weapons Permits", and they carry a firearm around.

It says, "A person commits an offense who carries... a firearm".

Is it the "with intent to go armed" part that I don't understand? Or do I just need a permit, and then I can carry it concealed?

Thanks, Shane
 
I am confused. Could someone who understands please explain this. What does "with intent to go armed" mean?

Do I want to kill someone? .... NO. The knife could be used for that though, does that mean I'm not allowed to carry it?

How about if I had a concealed weapons permit? Could I carry a larger knife then?

I could get one of those and carry a gun if I wanted, but a pure killing weapon is not what I want. I want the usefulness of a Busse knife with a 6" blade.

I have read the laws and I still don't understand.

Am I allowed to carry a 6" bladed knife, according to the following sentence:

A person commits an offense who carries
with intent to go armed a firearm, knife with a blade
length exceeding four inches, or a club....

Thanks, Shane
 
Shane,

Don't get too confused with the legal terms. It really boils down to 4" is the limit, and if you exceed it then you will probably be arrested. I agree with the others - talk with your local police.

Gene
 
busse_pr_sj_b3_b5_b5sheath.jpg

busse-le-1-4inch-saber-sj.jpg



i was at work, and one of the employees was weighing a crappy "t.v. knife" on the dough scale, saying "man... this thing weighs 4oz", so i put my 1/4" saber le sj on it, it weighing in at 12oz. so he picks it up (scraping the edge across the metal table like every single person who ever holds my knives does :(.. gotta love love it when people tap the edge on a metal table...) and says "wow... whats this meant for, knife fighting?"

wich, sadly, is a pretty standard reaction. when i look at knives like the bark river series, i think "practical user, excellent cutting properties. would kind of suck in a knife fight, but great for every day use on materials", everyone else (sheeple) think "dangeous weapon - sole purpose = weapon".

unless you have a permit for a weapon, (wich im not sure you can get for a knife...) wether or not you get charged for you knife or have it taken away depends on the cop who notices it, the reason he noticed it, your reason for carrying it, and strictness of the laws in your area.

i live in cali and carry the le saber sj as well as a modded nick of roughly the same dimentions, and i fully expect that when i get searched, im gonna have to spend the next year trying to get my knives back form the police evidence locker. in a place like oakland cali, if you get searched for any reason or a cop see's a knife on you, its going to get taken away.

in a place where hunting is common, and you do actually hunt, chances are that you can talk to the cop about it and things will be less black and white then it is in cali. and if the laws arent totally concrete, you can probably get it back in court on grounds that it is a hunting implement. "tactical survival tool" probably wont get you anywhere, but hunting equipment will hit a more known vein of argument. you may have to go to court to do so however.

in regards to what the law means specifically, "all things situational".


(and i agree with you about the satin jack. if i had only one fixed blade, it would be the 1/4 le sj. (if i had only one edged item, it would be the leatherman charge ti))
 
and a battle mistress in my bag :( ... i also wear long shirts (hemptown hefties) that cover everything up except my flashlight that rests in my tool pocket, so id get a concealed charge if i ever got it taken away...
 
I am a LEO in Tennessee. I can say that defifinately carrying a knife with a blade over 4" is illegal.

39-17-1307 Unlawful carrying or possession of a weapon-
(a)(1) A person commits an offense who carries with the intent to go armed a firearm,a knife with a blade length exceeding four inches (4"), or a club.

It is presumed you have intent to go armed. One possible exception would be if you were on a hunting trip, etc.
 
shanewomer said:
I really don't understand. People get "Concealed Weapons Permits", and they carry a firearm around.

It says, "A person commits an offense who carries... a firearm".

Is it the "with intent to go armed" part that I don't understand? Or do I just need a permit, and then I can carry it concealed?

Thanks, Shane
Click to expand...


TN handgun carry permits do not cover knives.
 
My recommendation is to move to Florida. Warmer weather, you can carry your SJ open, and CCW's do cover knives in FL.
 
I see the clincher here in the phrase "intent to go armed", which reads IMO as "to be used as a weapon". If the knife is not intended to be used as a weapon but as an everyday tool you may still face arrest but it will be up to a judge to decide based on situational evidence, past behavior, eyewitness testimony and etc to decide between your word that the blade is indeed a tool or the law which assumes ("intent....armed") stating it is a weapon. You may lose the knife and/or be told to get something 2" shorter.
I am going to look for that phrase in the Texas law. I may need to use it someday though I stay within the 4" limit....with my folders.....
Us Texas and Tennessee boys sure can be troublesome. :p
 
KAAK, what I meant was that there are some well intending but legally misinformed.

Recently had a dude post rather authortatively that Ohio law specifically prohibits knives with a specific blade length. In fact, it does not specify anything of the sort. Only after I and others showed him that there was absolutely no length specifications in the ORC (Ohio Revidsed Code) did he hem-haw backwards.

Anyones best bet is always to contact their local and state law enforcers and ask them the questions.
 
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