Navigational Question

I live in the northeast and have the same challenges. It's very satisfying to learn land navigation. But after reading the books and learning the theory, discovering that determining exactly where you are on the map is probably the biggest challenge is a frustrating realization. You have to get comfortable with the idea that you can't always know exactly where you are on the map but will have opportunities to approximate and occasionally pinpoint your location.

I really enjoy finding my way around with a map and compass. Having a GPS can even make it more enjoyable (and less worrisome when you first start). I get a great amount of use and enjoyment from a computer map program that allows transmitting information to and from your GPS and printing customized maps. I spent the whole day yesterday wandering around the woods and exploring with my maps, compass and GPS.

I pick interesting looking spots on the program's map, then download them as waypoints on my GPS by connecting it to my PC with a USB cord. I print a version of the map with the waypoints showing, then head out to find those spots. As I go, I may find some cool places or notable spots. I mark them with the GPS so I can download them to the map program when I'm home. The next time I print a map, those places are on it. By having been at those places and then seeing them pinpointed on the map, you develop a better ability to look at the map and relate it to the terrain.

I think you'd enjoy having a GPS. I think it helps make the traditional compass navigation learning process more enjoyable and relaxed.

Stay sharp,
desmobob
 
I'd say just keep practicing. It took me a few tries before I could really start picking out fingers and draws really accurately. The lensatic compass recommendations are good because if gives you the option of shooting a really accurate azimuth or just walking with it wide open. I used started using the open method once I got comfortable with terrain association. I also gave up on the ranger beads at that point. Served me well until our final land nav event at TBS when I missed my first box. I swear it wasn't there.

At night of course its a different story, heres a picture of me soaking wet after falling face first into a chest deep stream in the middle of a night land nav event. The shitty part was that it happened in the beginning of the event. Had to find another 2 or 3 boxes afterwards.

P4200180.jpg


When they allowed us to I picked up the cheapest model garmin (black and white screen) hand held GPS. It gives you your current grid coordinates (or lat and long) and theres a backwards way of creating a waypoint, changing the coordinates and then using it as a "direct to" type feature too. I think it was a little over a hundred bucks, and its durable as hell. It went through many storms, falls, and got covered in dirt but kept on going. Although it does turn on inadvertently sometimes, the buttons are a little touchy.
I believe its called the eTrex H.

Good on you for practicing, and keep it up one of these times it will just click and you'll be good to go.
 
Another thought:
1. Find some high ground or a clearing.
2. Orientate your map and compass. This way what you see on the map aligns with what you see on the terrain.
3. Move your postion around the map to get a good feel for the lay of land. (Not as accurate as trangulation but a quick easy way to get a general fix on your location)

:cool:
 
Goldtanker, here's a naval navigation method for sailing in very thick fog. Carry a sack of potatoes and throw a potato forward every once and a while. If you hear a splash it's OK but if you hear a thunk you're about to run aground !! That's how they do it in Maine !
 
I look at land navigation skills like I do most outdoor skills. It is great if you own and learn to use a GPS. And learning a compass and map is a very basic skill.

I also use a Bic lighter, but know how to make fire several ways without one. I enjoy the benefits of having a good knife, but I can also make one several different ways. I like my analog watch, but know several ways to estimate time without it. I haven't bothered with GPS. But I do know how to use a map and compass well enough to navigate suit my needs. I also find my way without either, as often as with.

People who know only how to use a Bic, a factory made knife, digital watch and a GPS will be SOL if/when they are ever caught without those items. I'll take skills over technology any day. Skills are much harder to lose, break and don't require satellites and batteries.
 
I would take an artillery battery and a compass over a GPS any day. It's just a little hard to pack an artillery battery around:)
 
Les Snyder said:
Smorgan345...do you use two compasses?...its a whole lot easier to DR plot with a flat base orienteering compass, and use a good lensatic compass to find line of bearing on a visible point of reference
Click to expand...

no, I haven't tried two compasses. Mine is a Brunton, flat base I think. I can see what your saying though. I have not learned to use a lensatic compass yet. ARe they better?
 
desmobob said:
I live in the northeast and have the same challenges. It's very satisfying to learn land navigation. But after reading the books and learning the theory, discovering that determining exactly where you are on the map is probably the biggest challenge is a frustrating realization. You have to get comfortable with the idea that you can't always know exactly where you are on the map but will have opportunities to approximate and occasionally pinpoint your location.

I really enjoy finding my way around with a map and compass. Having a GPS can even make it more enjoyable (and less worrisome when you first start). I get a great amount of use and enjoyment from a computer map program that allows transmitting information to and from your GPS and printing customized maps. I spent the whole day yesterday wandering around the woods and exploring with my maps, compass and GPS.

I pick interesting looking spots on the program's map, then download them as waypoints on my GPS by connecting it to my PC with a USB cord. I print a version of the map with the waypoints showing, then head out to find those spots. As I go, I may find some cool places or notable spots. I mark them with the GPS so I can download them to the map program when I'm home. The next time I print a map, those places are on it. By having been at those places and then seeing them pinpointed on the map, you develop a better ability to look at the map and relate it to the terrain.

I think you'd enjoy having a GPS. I think it helps make the traditional compass navigation learning process more enjoyable and relaxed.

Stay sharp,
desmobob
Click to expand...


I have nat geo TOPO software, I love it. I make maps on it too. sometimes I locate interesting looking areas on google earth, get the coordinates, type them in on the map software, locate them on a map, and then go try and find them. it's great too cause you can print out all different size and scale maps. I havent been able to reverse the process though without a GPS. Not having a GPS does increase the level of anxiety, especially if people come with me and have no clue about navigation and the fact that there's some trial and error that has to take place.
 
chopchop said:
regarding instruments to give you the contour...

Does anybody know the typical altitude precision of a gps unit? I mean, are we talking 1ft? 10ft? 50ft?

I would guess that the error in the unit itself (esp. with limited satellites) could be enough to throw you off if you're not careful.
Click to expand...

The altitude on GPS can jump a couple of hundred feet and as much depends on the maps programmed in the unit as much as anything. Units typically don't even update the altitude without more than three satellites in communication though for the most part you eventually get a decent measurement and with the speed of typical orientation, I doubt it really matter.
 
Thanks for the input guys.

Does anybody have any field experience with altimeters? I'm curious how accurate/precise they are as well. +/- 100ft? And in general how well they work in field conditions.

I've used the counterpart diving (depth gauges), but never used anything for altitude up in the mountains. I would guess the depth gauges are much more precise (inches to feet).



I do a fair bit of land nav to find particular sites along streams and rivers for research. We usually do desktop GIS... google earth, terraserver, etc. to get plat maps, aerials, and topos of the area, then gps units, map, & compass to get within 100m of the site. We also shoot bearings along the stream channel to get general shape & direction of the stream.

One of the most challenging things we seem to run into is how find the best route to get to a particular location. Best route could be least elevation change, least number of fence lines, staying on particular property owner's land, etc. depending on the site & how much/how far we have to carry in & out.
 
chopchop said:
Thanks for the input guys.

Does anybody have any field experience with altimeters? I'm curious how accurate/precise they are as well. +/- 100ft? And in general how well they work in field conditions.
Click to expand...

They're pretty precise but they have to be calibrated. They read the air pressure (like a barometer does) and determine the change in your altitude. So if you're currently in a high pressure air mass and while you're hiking up a mountain a low pressure air mass moves in, then you're altimeter is going to need to be re-calibrated.

I've been playing around with this program - http://www.tworoads.net/~srp/software/heliostat/index.html - since it gives the current location of the sun in azimuth and elevation it can be used to find one's bearing. A bit more low key than white phosphorous rounds bursting at known grid coordinates. :)

In theory you could also use it to navigate if you had an accurate watch - at least by sea where you could record the time the sun rises/sets and then enter latitude coordinates until you hit upon the right sunrise/sunset time. There have been sailors who navigated (somewhat haphazardly) with just a watch and almanac tables of sunrise/sunset at various latitudes (and a compass).
 
Garmin makes the Forerunner Watch. You could also pick up a cheap Etrex unit for under $100 that will do everything that you need it to do.
 
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