neck knives and axes..some thoughts

RescueRiley

RescueRiley

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Mar 22, 2006
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I've been playing around allot with knives in this size range (becker necker, Rat izula, and several customs.) I personally find them to be extremely handy.. for about 99 percent of woods related tasks..great for utility cutting, Models with fuller sized handles make great whittlers. they are servicable for most smallg ame tasks, they are concealable and sheeple friendly, and can be worn in other ways, if your are not a neck carry type of guy. about the only thing a necker can't do is process large wood... (i said large wood he he) but coupled with a larger blade or axe you'd pretty much have your bases covered.

WHich brings me to my next thought..we talk allot about axes vs. large blades. it seems to me that they exist on sort of a continum where each one is out wieghed in terms of advantages at some point by the other...I think a smaller axe 14 inches or less can be dangerous in unskilled hands.. and while better at chopping, I find it much easier, and safer to split wood using a larger knife and a baton, as opposed to a short axe... however when we get into axes with longer handles... a larger knife is outshined in terms of performance in that they are better choppers, and safe splitters.
I think in warmer weather and shorter trips, a larger knife might trump in regards to weight and versatility.
where as in colder weather or longer trips where providing massive amounts of fuel for a fire, or perhaps building a longer term shelter etc. are paramount... than the larger handled axe is king..
Keep in mind this is a thread of my perosnal findings and opinions. Let's hear your thoughts, but please keep them civil.
 
The fact that you didn't even mention lasers shows that you know nnothing about the outdoors. Everybody knows that friggin lasers are where it's at. I'm disgusted to the point that I will no longer participate in this forum for five minutes!











;)
The main barrier that keeps me from carrying a larger fixed blade is the concerned looks I might get from passers by, passers by with cell phones.
 
See, that's the same reason I like choppers and leave the axe at hope. A Big knife may make you look like a psycho:D, but an axe makes people think that you're an axe murderer:eek::foot::D
 
Let's see here. I think you have to take a couple of things into consideration. Climate, terrain, length of stay, survival situation or a wilderness skills trek. Let me say this as well my opinion is based on my "more with less" attitude. I personally don't carry an axe or a large chopper type blade. Here's why. In a true survival situation where one would want to conserve energy and maintain a consistent body temp where food (energy and strength) would be in question. I don't wanna being swinging a heavy blade or axe. Accidents do and will happen. I've gotten by in the past on several trips from overnighters to week long trips with a small Gossman PSK and a cheap 10$ saw from my local sporting goods store. I've found that with proper materials selection and taking the time to get a great fire for instance I've never needed to chop or baton any wood. If it's too long or thick to break or zip through with a saw I just feed one end a little at a time into the fire. Just my 2 cents.
 
CM I do agree with allot of your points, and I have taken length of star and climate into consideration in the OP. I do agree saws are underrated, in regards to there overall utility when it comes to sectioning wood. But they are not cool looking so they don;t count... LOL seriously though... I almost never chop anything but do split wood frequently. Less is more is a legitimate claim.. truth be told. I can and have do everything I need with a necker, or a machete, or an axe, or just a leatherman..but I find having 2 tools to be a little handier.. also there are some tasks that require haveing the abiltiy to split wood in to flat sections..for example making a fire board for a hand or bow drill..
I should also mention that I don't carry "choppers" as in huge hulking tanks of knives... I find a 7 inch blade more than enough to bring down saplings for shelter and to supply me with lots of split wood in the wet of things... I have on occasion found a smaller machete to be extremely usefull.. for similar applications. But the largter knives live in or on the pack to avoid the "mansonesque appearance.. the necker is there for when when I get seperated from my pack.
 
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I dunno, I think that more calories would be spent sawing a 12" log than say copping a 12" log. With an ax thattis properly sharp, you let gravity do most of the work.
 
+1 for a saw, I like to carry a mid sized blade 3-5 inches and a saw,

for me saftey one big concern and all it would take is a glancing blow into the shin with an ax or miss chop into the thigh with a chopper and fire starting is going to be a far second to bush first aid of a serious wound,


cya
jimi
 
Why saw or chop a 12 inch log when there are plenty of downed smaller limbs you just gotta pick up.
 
I don't think I'm clearly articulating my thoughts.. but we call large knives choppers.. But Largely I think chopping is a waste of time..in most short term wilderness stays. for me the purpose of a large knife comes into play when splitting.. I have little use for chopping as most wood can be found, broken or sectioned over a fire..or chopped safely using a knife and a baton.. in a eay that is infinitely safer than chopping with a small axe... However a larger axe with a handle that will enable the blade to reach the ground before it reaches you in he event of a missed swing is more energy efficient, and safer in the long term...

Last summer I spent 5 days out...the first 3 of which where during a non stop torrential rainstorm.. 90 percent of the wood to be found was wringing wet..I needed to split most of the wood I found to get to dry pulp to use as tinder, and kindling... to get my fire going to the point where it would burn or dry wet wood... Now if I scrounged around int he rain through the wet undergowth I might have been able to scrounge up some squaw wood.. but what might have taken me 90 minutes was done in 20.. but again that is my experience..and opininon.. just want to make sure I'm reresenting myself accurately..I'm not adcoacating wandering through the local wood lot with a sword like jack sparrow. But i think larger blades have ther places

it is interesting however how this thread has gravitated again towards the chopping debate and noone has addressed the neck knives...
 
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RescueRiley said:
However a larger axe with a handle that will enable the blade to reach the ground before it reaches you in he event of a missed swing is more energy efficient, and safer in the long term...
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very true but, personally don't want to lug around a full size axe , I would gladly trade that weight for water.

jimi
 
J I think a larger handle axe would only be viable in a longterm wilderness scenario...or in cold cold weather where the conditions and utility would warrant the extra weight.
 
I have honestly never owned a large, chopper-capable knife. Perhaps it's time to pick up a stout machete . . .

Riley's observations are interesting in that they pair down the conventional Nessmuk trio to the essentials that would handle anything I would be likely to do outdoors. The one thing is that I find it annoying to work with food using a very small knife. It is certainly doable though.
 
Rescue. I agree chopping with a larger knife and baton is certainly safer than a short handled axe. I think for me at least taking small saplings, say for a shelter or making several tent/tarp stakes is easier and more controlled with a saw, and no chance of swinging your blade in the dirt and rock. Seriously though your right they do not look cool.
 
Ahhhh yes. We forgot about the neck knives. I love them. They are my favorite sized blade to work with. I've built plenty of traps, cut tent stakes, even battoned just to see if it would. I carry it around my neck presumably for the same reason you do and that is so if I ditch my pack at least I still have the knife. My favorite is my Gossman and the Izula. I keep them as sharp as I can so the smaller handle doesn't become an issue because they glide right through whatever I'm cutting.
 
If I'm going to fell a tree, lets say 8-10" in diameter, I'm going to use an axe. Well, actually I'm going to use a chainsaw, but barring gas powered implements, I will use an axe. A buck saw sucks at this task, it binds too easily. An axe is the right (non-gas powered) tool and it will do this relatively efficiently.

It can be done with a knife, there was a thread not long ago that showed the taking down of a sizable tree with a Siegle Bowie and also remarked that the process took about 2 hr. It would probably take about 20 min or less with a good axe. For this task an Axe is right for the job. Most of us don't actually fell trees. I occasionally do it. When I'm going to do it, I set about to do that task with purpose. For example, I will service the grounds of my land and take out dead trees. You probably would never need to fell a larger tree for camping purposes unless of course you build a shelter in the fashion of Nesmuk.

If you are splitting large diameter wood, then it begs the question how you find such wood? The reality is we often purchase or have given to us firewood already pre-cut. I find an axe more efficient for splitting, but a large knife is more fun to use. Others indicate, with good reason that a large knife and baton can be much easier on the back if you have lower back pain. I for one explicitly admit that my preference for a large knife in this task is largely based on the enjoyment I get out of the process. Splitting wood with an axe is about as fun for me as is unloading the dishwasher only to have to refill the damn thing up right away with a counter full of dirty dishes. I guess I just did enough splitting rounds with an axe in my youth to overcome the joys of it. Now batoning a knife - that is fun (I am simple I admit it).

I agree with the OP that splitting a round with a blade that is just large enough to get away with it is a pita. I think it makes for good practice and possibly a good challenge. Trying to tackle splitting with a <3" blade is really just a novelty, unless of course you are breaking 1.5" sticks and your knee is too sore to snap them :D

I also agree that 2.5" knife like the Izula would handle most of your cutting chores. I carry mine in my pocket daily and it will likely be my survival knife if it comes down to that because it is pretty much always on my person. The other knives are in a pack or taken out for special duty.

All this talk about trios, the joys of manage a trois, or "a marriage is between a man and his knife" usually gets me contemplating about my knives and bushcraft tools and the growing collection of stuff I accumulate. I guess I'm just not into monogamy or even polygamy when it comes to a set of tools I use. This little odyssey of mine really is about the joy of going out there and using stuff and learning how different stuff can be used alone or in combination. With the exception of a few pieces of kit here and there I really don't like getting rid of any of my knives. I don't really like using the same knife all the time when I go out.

Well that is just me, the quest for the lightest, the most efficient, the best combo is less appealing to me than the journey to finding out what works versus what you can make do with and what is fun to play with.
 
Foilist... SLicing of food can be done with a smaller knife... or better yet a larger knife.. while a necker can pair an apple or clean a trout.. a machete or a 7-8 inch blade ( my pref) as you mentioned might be great for slicing up a pineapple or larger food oriented tasks.
 
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J.Wade said:
very true but, personally don't want to lug around a full size axe , I would gladly trade that weight for water.

jimi
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Jimi ,

You can carry a small axe just get down to your knees when chopping.

Jozsef
 
Jnyiri,,Ive split wood that way..it certainly can be done... But my knees ain't what they used to be...8 years of full time ems and 12 year of competative martial arts have takin there toll. also since prison I try not to get on my knees for wood anymore... LOL JK never been in prison.
 
Jnyiri said:
Jimi ,

You can carry a small axe just get down to your knees when chopping.

Jozsef
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When Jimi is on his knees, he is still tall enough that an accidental miss can still swing into his thigh :D Perhaps laying down on his belly and swinging his axe would be safest ;)
 
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