Need help first knife

steelswing

steelswing

Joined
Jan 28, 2003
Messages
888
I'm trying to make my first knife out of an old saw blade. I drew my pattern and started drilling holes along the side of the design.The drill bits keep breaking or don't stay sharp after the first or second hole.Why what can I do to fix this? Please help.:confused: I'm lost and I want to make this knife I want to make knives if only for my sanity.
Thanks
Guys
 
sounds like the material you are using is in the hardened state, you need to anneal it to work with it, heat up red hot and let in cool down slow and you will be good to go!
 
I heated the saw blade and it warped bent all to heck I cna't find metal at scrap yars they don't have 5160 or don't feel like dealing with me ay hints?
 
depending on where in Texas you are Texas knifemakers supply might just possibly be close to you, or Uncle Al at riverside machine is just over the border in Arkansas. It's always good to be able to talk to some people in person.

(yea I know Texas is so small you are sure to be near one of these:rolleyes: )

WS
 
I'm going to have to wait a few days for some new metal I have a few knives I dont like the blade style of a steep tanto I would like to reshape to a more stryker like style what do you think could I do this?
 
steelswing....

if this is your first knife, you might be better off getting a kit knife,,,,then you can learn how things work .

Now as for 5160 steel, that type of steel is just used a lot in car leaf springs...they are found everywhere.

The saw blade steel is way to hard yet to try to drill....they make it that hard so that the saw blade will not bend.

thats fine for cutting stuff, but you wish to drill in it and thats just never going to work.

I cant tell you what to do.
But I can tell you what I would do.

First you have to get the saw blade down to a size you can work with. I like to use my power saw with a steel cutting blade on it. it will cut the fastest and a steel cutting blade lasts a long time so you are money ahead.

after you get the blade cut to a size workable, you would need to anneal the steel.

That means heating the steel until it's red hot. and to do this you need a forge. Now I have made many little coal forges, they are easy to make just a bunch of pipe, a flat place with a hole for the pipe to stick in, and a shop vac or a hair blowdryer. and reg charcoal.

once you get the steel red,red hot , you let it cool very slowly..burry in ash, or something to keep it warm.

this will make the steel soft enough to drill and file
 
Guess I'll try the junk yard What type saw with a metal cutting blade do you use that sounds what I'd like to do how about torch cutting?
 
about 8-9" not too wide and I started grindingI ground and ground till a knife started peeking through. I had to quit for tonight because my belt wore out. I'll get one after I take my girl to school:)

Question
Do you tink this will ned to be heat treated or like the sawblade do you think it is?
This was the best night I've had in awhile!!
Thanks
Peace
 
Im not sure I understood your post.


You asked about heat treating?

As far as I know, most all the junk steel that we get for free is in a hard condition and needs to be annealed.

When I get a leaf spring for the auto dump, I first anneal it in my forge.

this gets it soft enough for the tools I will use on it.

then later when the blade is to shape, then I Heat-treat it to make it hard again so it will take and hold an edge.
 
I want to help you, I want to answer your questions, but i didnt understand, so I will just tell you what I do and let you take what you can from my system,,,(Im new to this too so I dont know much yet)

There is a big saw blade we found at work this summer that before the winter is over I plan to use to make a knife for a friend.

This is what I will do.

First I will put a steel cutting blade onto my electric circular saw and cut the section that looks the best to make a blade from.

Then I will get some charcoal and fire up my shop vac powered coal forge and heat the steel until it is red hot.

Then I will hit the red hot steel until it is sort of close to the shape I want, and I will also make it as straight as I can.

I will then heat again in the forge until it is very red hot then burry it in ashes so that it will stay warm all nightlong. (This is to anneal)

Then next I will start to use my belt grinder and shape the blade.

Then after that, I need to make the cutting area of the blade very hard so that it will take an edge. To do this I again heat the blade to red hot, but this time I quench the cutting area in pre-heated oil. I dip just the cutting area up about ½ up the sides of the knife in the oil. (This is heat treating)

Then the next day I place the blade in a kitchen oven set at 350 for 2 hours (this is tempering)

Next I finish grinding the knife and I sharpen it and make a handle for it.
 
Everyone has their own opinions. Personally, I would buy some steel from K&G www.knifeandgun.com or Texas Knifemaker www.texasknife.com that way you know exactly what your dealing with and it generally comes to you in an anealed state. Search the forum archives. There are several good books out there also. I cut out the outline of my knives with an old chopsaw blade mounted on a mandrel. I wouldnt suggest cutting the profiles with a torch as, according to people a hellofalot smarter than me, it burns out carbon or something. If you do cut them out with a torch, leave lots of "meat" to grind off to get to undamaged steel. Find a maker close to you and request some time in his shop watching. If a picture is worth a thousand words, watching up close and personal is worth a thousand books. Ask lots of questions. My .02
Good Luck
 
What part of Texas do you live in? There are many good makers all over this state! I know of 2 that have no problem at all if you requested to come by and see them work. I am sure there are others, but I am just going on personal experience with these 2.

www.warnerknives.com Bob Warner in Nevada Texas (Near DFW area)
www.thamknives.com Phil Tham in Dripping Spings Texas (Near Austin)


both of these guys were very nice when I spoke with them over the phone asking different questions etc. In fact I am taking an instructional 2 day class this weekend on knifemaking from Bob.

My suggestion, contact someone close by where you live and see what you can learn from them!
 
I live in Irving The heart of DFW I can't wait to start on my knife agin I'll contact Bob and see if he minds an extra set of eyes soon
My question was do you think the file has been hardend, I think the answer is yes.
 
Thanks Guys I conntacted Mr. Warner and I hop he'll allow me to come to one of his classes. I'll basicly be doing stock removal I'm using my Chimena to annel don't laugh I'm trying. Hopefully next week I'll have a knife to show you. Keep any tips coming and I appreciate them much.
Thanks
Bob
 
I finished shaping the blade from the file it has an edge now. It's time to think about a handle had heat treat.
Question: if this is a file thats hlready hardend should I heat treat? If so should I aneel it first?
Thanks
 
I am a newbie at this too, but think I can help somewhat on the issue of HT a file knife. Yes a file is hardned when you buy it. Depending on the quality it might be just case hardened, or actually hardned all the way through. Now we need to assume that you didn't get the thing to hot while grinding out your blade, as that would damage the HT anyway. Files are actually to hard for general knife use. To be a decent knife it would have to be heat treated in some way, not sure how though.

Anza Knives makes knives out of files. IIRC they first treat the file somehow to get it a bit softer, then make a knife out of it. Basically this is because a file is so hard that you can snap it off without much effort. You want a knife to give a bit, and not just snap in half so quickly. HTH:)
 
steelswing,

If your using a Nicholson brand file you should treat it as W-1. As mentioned files are hardened too hard (brittle) to make a good knife. Try tempering/drawing the file at around 475-500 degrees for 2 hours in your kitchen oven for a target RC of 58-59. This will make a fine using knife and it will be easier for you to work. The trick when working already Heat Treated steel is to not get it hot enough that it changes color at all. If using hand tools you should be fine, if using power tools keep a water bucket right beside you and dip after every pass.

HTH,
Tom
 
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