Need help with cable Damascus...(again)

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DaQo'tah Forge

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The Situation:
I got hold of about 50 feet of 1 & 1/2 inch cable. I wish to turn this into a few knives.
I checked to make sure there is nothing like a small rope or anything inside the cable, there is not. It seems like some great Damascus making cable to me.

The Problem:
I don't have a clue what to do with it.

The 1st Attempt:
I cut a 3 foot section of cable, heated in gas forge until red hot. I dumped 20-mule-team all over it. I heated again until really red-red hot, and hit with sledge hammer. (This attempt failed as cable evidently started to unwind.)

The 2nd Attempt:
I heated a new 3 foot section, this time after the Mule-team I heated and then twisted in a vice with pipewrench. I placed the red-hot cable in the vice with about 4 inches suck in the vice that is left untwisted. I heated and twisted 4 times. The cable now has an untwisted end of about 4 inches, then some very good twists for about 8 inches before you come to the rest of the untwisted part of the cable.

The Questions:
1 - What is the 20 Mule Team for anyway?

2 - How do you use the 20 Mule Team stuff on a 1&1/2 inch cable?

3 - How much do you forge at one time?

4 - how much twisting do I do?

5 - when is it time to start with the hammer?

6 - When using the hammer, where do I start, where do I work toward?
 
My understanding is that you have to first tig (mig?) weld the ends to prevent the cable from unraveling. Then you twist the cable as tight as you can get it. There is also a process whereby you heat the cable in the forge to 'red hot' 3 times, each time quenching in a borax/water solution to remove any oils and impurities in the cabe. At that point it is ready to be heated and forged to shape.
I'm sure others can give you better insight into the process, though.
 
I have seen people tying a steel wire around the strands, and when the smaller steel wire was yellow, they started pounding. U also have to wait till it achieved non magnetic, so putting a magnet next your the forge is a good way to check. Also brush and clean the steel wires very good before heating, so the burning oil and crud doesn't form a layer between the metals.
 
I use 1.125 inch cable in 12 inch sections. I do nothing special to clean it before welding. I just stick it in the forge and let the heat burn out all crud. I start with new not used cable.

Once an end starts showing color, I put a good amount of borax on it. From all my forge welding experience, a red heat is not hotenough to get high carbon steels to weld. I typically weld at a light orange to yellow heat color. I usually don't even pay attention to color, more on how the flux is bubbling/dancing on the billet.

But I forge weld the two ends first and forge them down to 0.75 sqaure because that is the biggest size twisting tool I have. After the two ends are welded you can start with the center secton. Use alot of borax especially if you are using 20 mules as opposed to anhydrous. With cable I don't think there is such a thing as using too much borax.

Once you get the center section up to the same high temp as before, twist the snot out of it. The strands should start to weld together just by twisting the billet. Then reflux the piece and heat it back up to welding temp, and twist it again.

Re-flux and bring back up to welding temp and then start in with your hammer and anvil working your way down the billet to set the weld. Re-flux, bring up to temp, and twist again. Re-flux, bring to temp, hammer it all again.

Reflux, bring to temp, twist again, and then reflux, bring upto temp and draw it out into your flat billet that you will be using for your blade. At all times work the cable at welding heat to try to close any voids that may be in the billet. The hardest voides to get out are in the center of the billet.

Anyway, that is how I do it. Just my $1.02 worth. Hope that helps.
 
Laredo is right on.Make sure it is at full welding heat.I wire the ends and weld the He!! out of them first.Twist untill you think the strands are starting to break.It takes many twist/heat cycles to get it really tight.About 8" is plenty long to work with for most small blades.12" is the most that works easily.Boil in tsp water,soak in gasoline,burn out and quench in hot borax water,whatever...nothing will weld until you get the crud out first.
 
If my memory serves me correctly, I believe Wayne Goddard's book 'The $50 Knife Shop' has instructions for welding up cable. (I don't have my book with me, so I could be wrong.) -chris

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Chris Crawford Knives

 
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