New Here and A Steel Question

N

NDS

Joined
Sep 12, 2006
Messages
2
I have a few Buck knives and have a question regarding why Buck uses the steels they use. It seems a lot of Buck's knives are 420HC. I also have a few other knives by different manufactures and see them offering things like 154CM, D2 ect on a greater variety of knives then Buck offers higher grade steels on. I assume Buck has a reason for a lot of 420HC, with just a very limited selection of 154CM/ATS34, and even smaller selection S30V. Just curious if anyone has any ideas. Not saying anything agianst Buck here I use them and like them. Just curious.
Thanks,
Nate
 
Welcome to the Buck Forum Nate!

I am not all that technical on the steels so the other guys will be along. The search function will give you a lot of info on this as it has been discussed extensively lately.

You might brouse through the threads and look for the ones on steel. Currently special steels are through the Custom shop and big buyers like Cabellas and Bass Pro.

You might check out the top thread here about trying to get an exchange specific to Buck knives. And should you decide to upgrade to Gold, there is a drawing for some Buck knives coming up for Gold members only.
 
Pack Rat said:
Welcome to the Buck Forum Nate!...
You might check out the top thread here about trying to get an exchange specific to Buck knives. And should you decide to upgrade to Gold, there is a drawing for some Buck knives coming up for Gold members only.
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good pimping if i say ao my self!!! way to go man!
oh and by the way nate i am aka : crasy dave welcome to the buck place pull up a chare, get comfey and stay a while!
 
334dave said:
good pimping if i say ao my self!!! way to go man!
oh and by the way nate i am aka : crasy dave welcome to the buck place pull up a chare, get comfey and stay a while!
Click to expand...

LOL Dave,,,,, Nate probably has no idea what you are talking about...

You guys tell him about Bucks S30V, BG42, and the rest before you run him off..
 
Heres some info from a Buck Newsletter.


I BELIEVE, its because Buck is trying to keep the prices so the average working man can afford a knife. Also their 420HC is excellent steel. Heat treating can make a good blade. Their steel is not standard 420
They also have a lifetime warranty. I am sure they dont want to be doing warranty work for rust problems...
I for one will not buy a foreign made knife for $100.00 + just because it has some fancy steel in the blade. Besides 420HC is still sharp and still cuts like a knife should. Maybe just requires a little extra occassional sharpening... :D

I forgot to add also, Welcome to the forums NDS and,
Good job pimpin again Pack Rat!!!
 
334dave said:
good pimping if i say ao my self!!! way to go man!
oh and by the way nate i am aka : crasy dave welcome to the buck place pull up a chare, get comfey and stay a while!
Click to expand...

Ya know, it used to take me a few Bud Lights to figure what Crazy Dave was typing sometimes. Now it's second nature....guess it also helps that my wife's kin are from his holler...or I'm just drinking too much beer :rolleyes:

Nate, what a decent brother Dave is. Check out that sticky Rat and Dave are yakking about.
 
...Our ol' buddy Dave just kinda grows on ya don't he??...LOL...( been meanin' to see a doctor about that too ):D :D
 
I am 100% into buying USA knives. Even when I purchase a Buck knife I will only purchase the ones with USA on them.
As far as S30V and BG42, I am aware that Buck does offer those steels but it seems like those and even 154CM/ATS34 are offered on such few knives.
I am partial to the Buck knives with the BOS heat treated logo on them. Great blades that hold an edge, and are tough to damage.
Thanks for the welcome so far and I will check out the above mentioned posts.
Nate
 
Nate, Caballas sells a 110 in S30V and Bass Pro has the new 154 in a 110.

There are a few of us here that has those and have talked about them a lot.

Will see if we can get some of those threads stuck in here for ya...
 
i have personal pref to the S30V...
s30v has a tad more corrosion resistance
it was designed from the get go as a blade steel.
holds an edge better like then good old fashon 440
CPM is also a great steel but is a tad more expensive.
ATS can take a hike as it is a jap steel
and there used in cheep kitchen forks ect...
great stuff reworked here ...
but not USA stuff and i dont care how much it gets reworked
it is still a copy of CPM154 but not made the same way now if buck used it in the imoprted price match stuff grrreat but not stamped as usa

the hc120 that buck uses also has a great salt water resistance and
BOS helped buck developed the heat treat for it so it is great edge holding.
thats my onion and i am sticking to it !
 
Questions for you Dave (or anyone else)...About these blade steels:

1. Have you had to re-sharpen any S30V steel? If so, did you do it yourself and was it difficult? I never have as yet and I'm just curious. I have heard comments from co-workers in the past that Buck knives are too hard to sharpen - and they weren't talking about the newer "high-end" steels. Maybe Buck generally tries to use "middle of the road" steels that have the widest range of usefulness, durability and function for the average user?

2. Also, what is your opinion of the BOS ATS-34, made in USA steel such as found on the Tarani? Is that different than the ATS you refer to above?

Thanks,
Dan
 
bbb4u said:
Questions for you Dave (or anyone else)...About these blade steels:

1. Have you had to re-sharpen any S30V steel? If so, did you do it yourself and was it difficult? I never have as yet and I'm just curious. I have heard comments from co-workers in the past that Buck knives are too hard to sharpen - and they weren't talking about the newer "high-end" steels. Maybe Buck generally tries to use "middle of the road" steels that have the widest range of usefulness, durability and function for the average user?

2. Also, what is your opinion of the BOS ATS-34, made in USA steel such as found on the Tarani? Is that different than the ATS you refer to above?

Thanks,
Dan
Click to expand...

Dan,
#1 - I guess sharpening just depends on what type of sharpener you use...
Also if they are harder to sharpen they probably hold that edge longer. I had a schrade USA made folder a few years back it was WAY easier to sharpen BUT I had to sharpen it everyday that I used it. Dulled very quickly.
Buck Doesnt use only "middle of the road" steels either. S30V is THE premium knife steel. I would say that BG-42 and 154CM are better than average and 420HC is average. Just my opinion though. 420HC isnt standard 420.
#2 - ATS-34 is Japanese steel. 154 CM is almost the same but it is USA made steel. When 334Dave types ATS, he is refering to ATS-34. (japan)

I have a 110 folder with S30V love it! I have an Alpha Hunter with ATS-34,
love it!!! I have SOOooo many more with 420HC- they all cut the same! LOVE 'EM!!!!! :D
I hope this helps a little. Plus check out the link in my last post lots of opinions there about blade steel!!! FOR THE MONEY 420HC cant be beat!! (in my opinion) Good luck!!!

Sorry Trax- I should have put ATS-34 as a Japanese "formulation" Not made in Japan!!! Jim
 
wh4f said:
#2 - ATS-34 is Japanese steel. 154 CM is almost the same but it is USA made steel. When 334Dave types ATS, he is refering to ATS-34. (japan)
Click to expand...

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the steel names. The actual steel need not be made in Japan (or Sweden, or Germany), it is the process used to produce it and the various alloys used that are patented, copyrighted, and trademarked. If you intend to use and advertise it as ATS-34, then (IIRC) you need to pay a royalty to the Japanese company that holds the patent. Same for BG-42, etc.

It's not just limited to knife steel. Reynolds 531 (a common British steel used in motorcycle frames) is patented as well. It's a trade name, like Nylon.

What makes the specialty steels costly is that it takes considerable time and $$$ to produce an alloy and roll it and finish it for the end user, and the quantity requested (compared to say 1020 steel) is so small that it is only done when a considerable amount of requests are received.

So don't turn down an ATS-30 knife just because you think it was made in Japan. It could have been made in Pittsburgh or Buffalo.

...by illegal aliens... :D
 
Dan, so far the only way I have gotten a good edge on my alaskan 110 s30v is to start with the diamond stones on the lansky and finish off with the regular stones. So far......

I believe Larry Oden posted something about that here somewhere a while back.
Might search his threads.
 
IMHO:
the import laws are different on requirements of :
NOT stamping source of material IE: putting japan on it
-VS-
stamping USA on on it...:eek:

it is two differentiering laws and enforcement issues, really and they dont over lap,
it is even ruled about in different govt agency's ...

as to if it is merely a licence issue, well i can and will admit Publicly if i am wrong !!! and will acept it !

it is a good steel if BOS has any thing to do with it !!!!!

i simply, until i have documentation that it is only a licensing and not a physically import material, will not like ats34 stamped USA.


i may not like it but oh well wrong will be wrong...
and i am wrong a lot some times but it's my onion and i will cry baby about if i want to!
yours most respectfully, crasy dave
 
Dave - I have no idea what you said above... :confused:

But to clarify - yes, you can get Japanese steel delivered (after all, they developed it), but the whole point is that you don't have to...you can just license the process...and produce it locally...but you need to give them credit...if you sell/advertise it as such...

There are companies that have spent billions to develop just the right properties of their steel...there are men who have spent their lives developing steel alloys...and they've patented their work...

Every time the Space Shuttle lifts off, I wonder what refractories they use in those engines...your own field, submarines - don't you wonder what the propellers are made of??? Not just the generic name - but how much chromium, how much nickel, how much boron, etc??? (I'm assuming they're a steel alloy, and not bronze)... :D

It's a fascinating field...

I understand that some of the more well-known knifesmiths even have their own arc furnaces, and strive to develop the "ideal steel" for their knives...I would love to get involved with that... :)
 
oh yes my friend it is and a place called :
http://www.anvilfire.com/
and LOT of information on that !!! well worth book marking!:D
at one time i was high voltage electrician and crane control repairman at a smelters in fort worth were they made sand castings for the oil industry drilling impediment to be milled else ware.
they used motor blocks mostly and the city police came and dumped all the guns and knives they had 'donated' to them (only the cheapies) in to melt them, wood and all.
the metalurgest pulled samples out, cooled them and examined them under a scope for crystal formation and other aspects and chemical testing. then he added 50 lb sacks of carbide, magnesium or silicone or other 'secret' stuff to the tones of molten steel in the elect furnace get the comp they wanted for that batch of steel.
that guy had a mofo of a knife i could not dull, not real light but green tint to it and man was it sharp but he used diamond to sharpened it and had a camp ax of it also... never would tell me what he made it from...said he tempered it in a slab of raw meat...
 
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