New Native Sprint CPM154/S90V

[DocT]

What are the advantages of the laminated blade? Why is it superior to just making the blade from s90v?

For one thing, they can run the core steel at a higher hardness, which reduces toughness, but increases edge retention. They laminate a tougher steel over the top of it and that gives the knife toughness, and sometime greater impact resistance. So, you get the best of both.
Another reason is to provide corrosion resistance to a super steel carbon steel, like Maxamet, that is highly prone to corrosion, but has other desirable properties. They laminate a much more corrosion resistant (stainless) steel over that so the knife gets the advantages of both.

 

[Mo2]

Thanks for the explanation. Does that terminology only apply to Spyderco? I have a ZT 0850 that has CF scales, they are real and I can even see the pattern on the inside of the scales but it is smooth with very little texture.

ZT is not using peel ply. At least not like what spyderco uses. The zt cf is interesting because it's not slick. Zt have two variations of cf tho. The earlier version of their cf was very good but smooth and the weave was not consistent, I think it may have been supplied by a and j composites based on the weave, but I don't know for sure . The newer knives use an even higher quality cf. Looks like pre-preg cf with a press in a vacuum chamber. Perfect weave and a more grippy texture without being like peel ply. The zt0777 uses Matt diskin lva Carbonfiber, but iirc it's milled not peel ply.

Peel ply is a fabric that's attached to the top of any material composite, be it g10, cf, Kevlar, fiberglass etc. The fabric has lots of little holes in it. Some have larger holes. Once this composition cures the fabric and top layer of epoxy is peeled off, it leaves dimples. When it was vacuum bagged it pulled epoxy up through this. You can buy g10 and cf peel ply from knife making supply vendors. It has a plastic layer that you peel off once your done contouring the handles in the shape you need. If you want to make your own peel ply composites search youtube for some introduction to peel ply.

What are the advantages of the laminated blade? Why is it superior to just making the blade from s90v?

No advantages. Spyderco said they did it cause it could be done. In a fixed blade we would see an advantage of a tougher steel in theory since the spine is the tougher steel. However in a folding knife blade there is zero benefits at least no perceived benefits. It is really cool tho.

With all that said, I've never hard use tested a chemically bonded composite blade before. Nor do I know how it was heat treated. That would be really great to hear about.

They have done laminated blades to keep corrosion low by using a low corrosion steel on the outside of a higher corrosion steel that has higher edge retention for the cutting blade. But s90v isn't the most stainless but I've not had any issues with corrosion on it.

I'll stick with what sal said.
https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/cpm154-over-s90v-laminate-blade.1520028/

The main reason was that Crucible was able to do it. It's not really just a cored laminate, there is a chemical boding of the two steels at the interface. Not quite like splitting the atom, but up there. They were able to make it and we were able to make a blade out of it. High tech stuff!

sal

 

[Freedom Pullo]

Has anyone else picked one of these up? The more I look at the laminated saber grind, the more I want one. Does anyone know if they made the S90V core harder than normal?

 

[Mo2]

 

[kreole]

For one thing, they can run the core steel at a higher hardness, which reduces toughness, but increases edge retention. They laminate a tougher steel over the top of it and that gives the knife toughness, and sometime greater impact resistance. So, you get the best of both.
Another reason is to provide corrosion resistance to a super steel carbon steel, like Maxamet, that is highly prone to corrosion, but has other desirable properties. They laminate a much more corrosion resistant (stainless) steel over that so the knife gets the advantages of both.

Do you have a source for Spyderco running laminated s90v harder than non laminated? Never heard/seen that before.

Thanks

 

[Mo2]

Do you have a source for Spyderco running laminated s90v harder than non laminated? Never heard/seen that before.

Thanks

I don't think that's the case here.

 

[DocT]

Do you have a source for Spyderco running laminated s90v harder than non laminated? Never heard/seen that before.

Thanks

Go back and re-read what I said.

 

[kreole]

Go back and re-read what I said.

His question that you quoted:
What are the advantages of the laminated blade? Why is it superior to just making the blade from s90v?

In other words, he wants laminated vs nonlaminated s90v pros and cons.

Your first sentence in response:
For one thing, they can run the core steel at a higher hardness, which reduces toughness, but increases edge retention.

I assume from your latest response you meant not laminated vs nonlaminated but in general, but then it wasn't relevant to his question . Anyway, thanks for clearing that up for me

 

[John_0917]

Held on the other day in a store, hefty little guy!

It has solid steel liners and the thick steel back spacer, very solid feeling but pretty heavy for the size. The lamination lines were perfect about 1/8" from the edge and barely visible.

I didn't buy it buy was definitely tempted.

 

[Freedom Pullo]

I held out as long as I could but in the end I had to order one of these.
With a a seemingly superfluous S90V/CPM154 composite, saber grind, and peel ply textured CF this blade seems like it wouldn’t be too popular here.
Still I think the saber grind and texture might put this in the same boat as an SNG/DGG, a stout little knife that is great for dirty jobs
I couldn’t see making this one a safe queen

 

[twinboysdad]

Just got one. Haven't carried or used it yet but agree it is a little bulldog of a folder

 

[twinboysdad]

So got it out and this thing is a tank. Bomb proof. Yes the grind won't slice like FFG but this one is beefy

 

[Freedom Pullo]

I ordered mine last week and hope to have it for the weekend

 

[Freedom Pullo]

The saber ground Native 5 is dense for its size but it has better balance than the Fluted Ti Native. The scales are lighter but the saber grind adds weight.

 

[David45]

May not make a great EDC. Possibly a perfect backup camp/bushcraft carry.

 

[twinboysdad]

Held on the other day in a store, hefty little guy!

It has solid steel liners and the thick steel back spacer, very solid feeling but pretty heavy for the size. The lamination lines were perfect about 1/8" from the edge and barely visible.
You get my email?

I didn't buy it buy was definitely tempted.

 

[Kels73]

View attachment 820330 View attachment 820329
The saber ground Native 5 is dense for its size but it has better balance than the Fluted Ti Native. The scales are lighter but the saber grind adds weight.

This knife has caught my eye. Where is the balance point? I love the balance of the LW, but I'm wondering if this version is handle heavy.

 

[twinboysdad]

This knife has caught my eye. Where is the balance point? I love the balance of the LW, but I'm wondering if this version is handle heavy.

I am selling mine but only because I have an aversion to using sprints. Balance point is better than a regular G10 Native because the extra blade weight counters the G10 and liners. Very well executed

 

[Freedom Pullo]

This knife has caught my eye. Where is the balance point? I love the balance of the LW, but I'm wondering if this version is handle heavy.

Balance point is at the first scale screw behind the pivot, so it’s actually pretty good if you aren’t using the forward choil. I wear an XL glove so I always utilize the forward choil for a comfortable grip.
The Fluted Ti Native is beautiful but a little handle heavy when using the forward choil.

 

[Kels73]

Balance point is at the first scale screw behind the pivot, so it’s actually pretty good if you aren’t using the forward choil. I wear an XL glove so I always utilize the forward choil for a comfortable grip.
The Fluted Ti Native is beautiful but a little handle heavy when using the forward choil.

That sounds good. Thanks.

I recently acquired my first Native 5 LW, and it has quickly become my favorite mid-sized knife. I wear an XL glove, so I assumed I would need to use the forward choil too. As it turns out, the handle works extremely well for me in the regular grip. My fingers are long, but they aren't thick, so I benefit from a handle that is wide, but I don't necessarily require length. The Native 5 LW feels like it was made for my hand.

However, I just placed an order for one of the Cutlery Shoppe exclusives, so this one might have to wait, lol. It looks like a tough little knife though.