New-to-me Sterile Camillus? BK9

zzyzzogeton

zzyzzogeton

Joined
Feb 17, 2013
Messages
6,172
Just got this new-to-me BK-9.

The seller didn't know if it was a Blackjack or a Camillus. He stated maybe Blackjack because of the gray finish and sterile blade (no markings), but otherwise said it might be a Camillus.

After I received it, I started comparing it with Camillus and Kabar versions I already had. Grind, thickness, false edge all read Camillus. It has absolutely no stampings on the blade and no tags or evidence of tags being removed on the sheath, just some possible glue residue where there "might have been" a sticker on the sheath. The sheath appears to be a "standard, green nylon w/ plastic insert" Camillus-style sheath.

The grind marks on the blade are very, very small. There are a couple of stains on the blade, sliding a finger across the blade, it feels very smooth. I can't tell if the blade started out coated black, was stripped and now has a very even patina from just sitting or if it has a very fine gray coating. It does have a couple of stains on the blade. It looks a lot like a "thin" version of the mat gray finish on a Blackjack BK2, but a different shade of gray. (actual or perceived due to thinness of the coating??)

So the questions I have are::

Did Blackjack ever make sterile "proto-type" versions of the BK9?
Did Camillus ever make sterile versions for sale?
If no to both of the above, what kind of BK9 do I have (other than a Camillus that won't maybe break at the stamp since there is no stamp)?

Full Shot Mark Side with front of sheath
Sterile Cam-BK9 Mark Side.jpg
Full Shot Pile Side with back of sheath
Sterile Cam-BK9 Pile Side.jpg
Pile side stamp area - sterile
Sterile Cam-BK9 Pile Closeup.jpg
Mark side stamp area - sterile
Sterile Cam-BK9 Mark Closeup.jpg
Tip comparison sterile Camillus vs Kabar
Sterile Cam-Kabar-BK9 tip comparison.jpg
 
I figured it was legit as no one would spend the time and effort to make a counterfeit that was that perfect w/ respect to specs. It would cost them more to make it than they could sell it for. It is literally identical to a Cam9, just sterile and gray. W/o a stamp, it'll never break.
 
It could be an unfinished blank from Camillus when they went under. There was a big box that got rummaged through. Someone could have heat treated it (or not) and painted it, and thrown some handles on it.

Have you checked the all knowing all powerful database?
 
Yep. Matches all the Camillus specs that I can measure (Don't have a hardness tester available :D). The thickness matches at .21(34) on my digital micrometer. Don't know if the .21 in the DB is the final thickness after HTing and finish work or the raw, before finishing thickness.

Haven't tried a file test yet. Did they stamp them before or after heat treatment? If it fails the file test, I could always sand the coating off and send it out to be HT'd.

What happens if you HT a HT'd blade? Anything bad?
 
I have never seen anything like that.
 
I saw it on the bay and was not sure about its origin but in fairness it looked legit. I am glad to see it went to a beckerhead. Please let use know if you find anything concrete on the hardness test or HT question. I think you will enjoy this find!
CC
 
Where's Bladite when you need him?

I'm kinda curious about this one. I hope you get the right answer soon.
 
Did some more testing and examining:::

I took a rat tail file to the choil for a quick and dirty hardness test. Chose the choil as it SHOULD be just as HTd as the blade, a file mark in the choil won't show as badly if it was not HTd and all the pressure I put on such a file in the choil should be directed at the blade, not skittering off.

First, I put the file to a Kabar Stamped BK9 so I could test the file against a known, properly HTd blade. The file just kinda scooted off, although it DID scratch a little of the black coating off. A 2nd try just made the area of removed coating slightly larger. (Pics to be added later as I forgot the dang camera at home.)

Next, I put the same file to the sterile blade. The file just kinda skittered on the choil and didn't even appear to scratch the alleged, possible coating. I did this 3 times, with the same result every time.

Conclusions from this unscientific test and magnifying glass examination??

The sterile blade is heat treated properly.
The coating is NOT a coating, just an age patina that is very every aged (except for the stains).
The blade appears to have a mat sandblasted finish that was applied BEFORE sharpening.
The edge looks to be a factory sharpened edge with absolutely NO indication that anyone as fumble fingered as I am has ever put it to a stone of any sort.

The handle screws are standard black socket screws. Two of the screws don't look to have been removed more than 1 or 2 times. The middle screw has the black worn off the threads for half the length on 1 side of the screw. It's really tight when taking it off or putting it back on, as if the tang hole for the screw is a smidge undersized.

So I'm gonna go out on a limb and say I have a real, honest-to-goodness, properly heat-treated, sterile of any markings Camillus BK-9. :D:D:D:D
 
nice score. i saw that on there as well. i have a BK6 blank that only has the "BK&T" stamp on it no Camillus NY markings... turns out mine was not heat treated. It is the one Crimsonfalcon customized for me. There is an old thread i have on it. congrats on yours. use it well.
 
Didn't have the camera earlier to take pics of the file tests

Kabar Stamped BK9 File Test - 2 hard strokes of a rat tail file took a little of the coating of at the choil (in the circle)
Kabar BK9 File Test.jpg

Camillus Sterile BK9 File Test - Took 3 swipes at this one with the same file - just a little shininess in the circle, I guess where some of the age patina scraped off
Cam Sterile BK9 File Test.jpg

3 different guys in the shop I go to independently said that the blade looked sand blasted when I asked "How do yo think this blade was finished up?"
 
rkmoore said:
Where's Bladite when you need him?
Click to expand...

he has a life

i'm reporting in for him

he has no clue

ask "the gibbs" or something

there's bound to be a lot of prototypes and cruft popping up

before people claiming stuff is a prototype though; i've shown Ethan listings of some things and he said that no way, no how anything he's aware of was marked prototype, that he knows of.

esp the in old days, they made shit and sold it.

though there are likely crates of things that "escaped the shop" without being in inventory, and someone squirreled away a lot of things. skeezy. so, who knows.

Ethan could probably buy a few Teslas with the money he was never paid in past decades.
 
I've posted a link to this thread over in the Camillus Collector forum where I hope either Phil or Camco will comment.
 
Hey Z....

No way to know for sure but, I think what you have is an uncoated escapee from Camillus...... It appears to be very Camillussy and the thickness is right....... There were no BJ Nines........... Several people bought Work in Progress stuff at the Cam auction(s)........ The blades were stamped before HT as it is really rough on the stamps if you are smacking one piece of hardened steel with another....LOL...... As far as sterile is concerned I do not know if an inadvertently unmarked piece is "sterile" or not......... If it came from South Georgia it is definitely a Cam piece........

Hope this helps......

E
 
The person I got from sent it from Chateroy, Washington, which is just a tad over the northwest border of Georgia. :D
 
I bought the Becker Campanion in '96 and it came with a gray finish and no markings. Not sure who was making them back then but it looked like your 9, only smaller.
 
DougB2 said:
I bought the Becker Campanion in '96 and it came with a gray finish and no markings. Not sure who was making them back then but it looked like your 9, only smaller.
Click to expand...

that's epoxy...

the BK9 looks to be naked steel bead blasted
 
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